Themes
 

Is there any chance you guys (illwinter) could tell us a little more about the themes available in Dom II? How many themes are unique to the nation, and how many (if any) are themes available to all nations? I like the sound of the Ulm theme you mentioned - how about a couple more details of some other themes? Indulge our curiousity!

Re: Themes
 

Yes, please spoil us- I've got hours of work time and nothing to do except flit between csipgs, DomX, and this site... a little theme knowledge could make me belle of the ball (among my Dom-playing friends anyways).

Re: Themes
 

yes I want to be spoiled too, throw me any infos you want http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Themes
 

*starts to lurk for info snippets*

Re: Themes
 

Lets just say that Pythum has a nice theme I really like (won my first game with it). You have less special commanders (not units) but you get a special mage-priest commander with poison immunity (priest level 3, level 1 water, level 2 nature and has a random magic pick as well). So its great all around unit that costs only 180 gold! It�s going to be hard to stop them when they lead Hydras, trust me, and they are excellent for taking care of Ermor. I was even able to take out Atlantians with them since they have water magic; well them and sea troll kings http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif .

Also they are possibly the shortest path to mass produce vine men/ogres since they can get level 3 nature, make a staff that gives you nature +1, then make a staff that gives you nature +2 and bonus to summoning vine men/ogres (you need level 4 in nature to make this staff), and make a crown of ivy king that gives additional bonus (or just summon ivy king - you need level 5 in nature which that staff will give). I know that ivy king with that staff could summon 6 ogres in 1 turn costing only 1 nature gem! And my mage with crown and staff could summon 7 vine men (not as much ogres as ivy king) per turn. So you get army real fast that costs almost nothing in gold or supplies. Best thing to stop Ermor in its tracks since those armies wont care for lack of supplies in their territories.

Re: Themes
 

I know what those mage-priest-commanders are:
Serpent Acolytes
Am i rigth, do i have prophet skilz?

And i believe the "staff" that gives you +1 to nature is Thistle Mace. The other "staff" is something new.

[ September 21, 2003, 10:16: Message edited by: Nerfix ]

Re: Themes
 

Correct. The other staff is Treelord's Staff (two handed weapon).

Re: Themes
 

Treelord's Staff is in Dominions I too. I forgot that it would give you bonus to Vine >critter< summoning.
Does Caelum have Harab Seraph theme? I think i saw it being mentioned somewhere, but i'm not sure...

Re: Themes
 

The costs aren't different.

I was just referring to max damage you can do with them early, not the cheapest way (6 vs. 2 ogres is quite a difference). Of course, getting 5th level in nature also enables you to cast Mother Oak and Gift of Health so its sort of "side effect" and getting Mother Oak early would make up for nature games you spend before.
Panganea can do it too, probably even faster, but they would have trouble with water nations and won't have Hydras to accompany those Vine Ogres (deadly combo).

On smaller or special-site-rare maps its probably not possible but on larger you will probably find enough nature sites to get this done (of course there is a luck factor in it all).

Re: Themes
 

Not 100% sure but Druids are much harder to find, however Sages are much more common.

Re: Themes
 

I think Druids might be the one of the easiest indept. mages that you can find. They are almost as "common" as diffrent Amazons.

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They are bothe less common nowdays.

Most independents are keyed to province terrains. Thus garnet amazons in wastelands, druids in forests, lizards in swamps, knights in farmlands etc.

The same goes for sites.

Re: Themes
 

Nothing new to me, since i have lurked the dom2progress site almost from the beginning...

BTW, any new independents?
Dominions I had:
Barbarians
Woodsmen
Amazons
Feudals(knights, longbowmen)
Lizards
Kindoms(heavy infantry, militias etc.)
Sea Trolls
Tritons(not sure of the name, the fishmen)

I'm not sure if that was all...

[ September 21, 2003, 18:07: Message edited by: Nerfix ]

Re: Themes
 

Ichtyids. Probably other as well.

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Ichtyids?
*shiver*
Spooky name...

Re: Themes
 

are you using photoshop for the drawing effects we see on the maps of Doms II? Does a document list some guidelines on how to make a map (the graphical file I mean), which have the same style than yours? Not everyone is a graphical artist (I'm not), so if you tell me that I should use RGB(x,y,z) with a stony texture to draw <insert item there>, I could appreciate.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Kristoffer used gimp to draw most of the maps.

There is currently no such document.

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The first maps made for Dom II was made without thoughts on further mapmaking. Layers were flattened and canvas added without second thoughts. When I started on new maps I gradually found this annoying and the newer maps are made in lots of layers and Versions so I can cut and paste mountains, forests and specials at will.

I have considered making a mapmaking kit (a couple of mountains forests and trees that players can cut and paste into their own maps). This will hopefully lead to more maps and scenarios.

Just save the map image as a TGA file (one layer and no alpha). I believe thats all. White dots (one pixel) in each province. Borders arn't necessary, but editing will be easier if you have red borders as the computer tries to find borders by itself if you want.

BTW, did you make any maps? I can help you finish half finished maps if you like.

[ September 21, 2003, 22:38: Message edited by: Kristoffer O ]

Re: Themes
 

I belive so, but I don't play Caelum much so I'm not sure.

Re: Themes
 

I dont know (sure!) if some costs changed, but the fastest mean to make vine ogres in doms I (except being Pangea and his natives nature 3 Pan) went like this :

get some druids, from the numerous indep provinces which have them (nature 2)
have them build thistle mace (cost 10 gems) and Ivy Crown (5 gems)
cast ritual of summon vine ogre. Will bring 2 vines ogres for one gem.

Daynarr you seem to imply that in doms II it is better to goes for the big items + Ivy king before conjuring them in masse ? The Treelord staff in Doms I cost 40 gems. I suppose the Ivy King cost either 20 or 40 gems. Thats a bunch of resources comitted before starting to invoke vine ogres?

Re: Themes
 

Thanks for the info. Sounds really cool.

So Pythium will have a special commander under one theme, and Ulm will have a random pick mage� what about Man? Can you give us any details about what special themes will be available to Man?

Re: Themes
 

Man will have Last of Tuatha. Maybe the Illwinter crew/ betatesters should tell us more about that theme...
The they could tell about Diabolic Faith, Carrion Woods, Helg�rd and Midg�rd and Living Ermor and...
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

[ September 22, 2003, 05:59: Message edited by: Nerfix ]

Re: Themes
 

hmm�Last of the Tuatha?

Comments, Illwinter developers?

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">nope. Mainly because of a new born child and a changing job environment http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

But dont worry. I do what I say, and my Elric map is the example of this. Starting with mid october, I will have one less worry, so more time for dominions map making.

I will at least make one map for dominions II, a map I have in mind since I play doms I : Beleriand and the Wars of Morgoth (for those who dont know, it is Tolkien's first Age, the Age where Balrogs were counted by dozens). A huge and impressive work, and at the time of doms one I felt that the game was too much lacking in scenario support, thus my numerous questions toward you asking for added scripting possibilities.

Now that we are at this, do you plan to add renforcements as a script command in a patch, one day? all we need is that the #commander and #units command accept an additional parameter, that is the number of turn the force is created. That would ask for more coding in the binary, sure. Generally speaking, do you plan to improve the scripting langage after the game is released? I know you added multi provinces victory conditions, but thats IMO not enough to do complex scenarios.

Also several problems remains, for example adding a fortress and independants, will lead to indeps being inside. So in essence you give freely to the player the exterior, and a single scout can besiege the fortress.

I know that some other players indulge themselves in mapmaking. If you consider adding additional commands in the script language, then we can perhaps suggest what we would need the most?

Re: Themes
 

here is some info about Midgard: In this theme the power of the Vanir has dwindled and human influence has increased. You lose the Boars, Valkyrjar, Dwarven Smith and Vanadrott. But you gain the V�lva (a human seeress with Astral 2) and the Galderman (a versatile mage with Air 2 and two random magic skills).

Rollo

Re: Themes
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">For those of you that have played dom 1, the vanadrott is a souped up Vanjarl (Drott=king or royalty in old swedish/norse) only recruitable for the standard Vanheim theme.

The Helgard theme is a more death oritented Vanheim where the Vanadrott is replaced by the Hangadrott (after one of Odens attributes as the lorde of hanged men), the valkyries get a small boost and the dwarfs are replaced by more sinister dwarfs, there might be more differences I dont recall.

Last of the Tuatha is a theme for Vanheim where Man lose wardens, crones and a few other troops and get Sidhe, Cu Sidhe, Sidhe Lord and Tuatha instead. The Sidhe and Tuatha are quite similar to vanir.

[ September 22, 2003, 10:09: Message edited by: johan osterman ]

Re: Themes
 

Sounds cool. thanks for the info

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Okay, now could you tell us about Diabolic Faith, Restless Worshippers and Carrion Woods?

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The problem with triggers is that the mapfile is not used after the initial setup of the world. The triggers must be included in the fatherland file somehow. This is not yet done, but I like the idea as well. This is one of the more probable addons in upcoming patches. I'm currently working on a map that will probably not be included in the release of the game. Time is short and the map is extraordinary. I have some scenario ideas for this map.

Indep fort defense is a problem. Hmm, got an idea.

Send in suggestions regarding scripting. They might very well be included now or in an upcoming patch.

Re: Themes
 

ok, will send. Thanks for listening to our endless list of complaints http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif