Did you noticed.......
 

......that almost all threads are about some bad "thing"? This is bugged..that is wrong...I don't like this...I don't like that...
Frankly I've barely seen any good things about the demo... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Re: Did you noticed.......
 

The only nice thing I can say about the demo is that the aesthetics of the game are much improved over Dom I.

I dearly wish they had kept the Dom I game and simply upgraded the graphics.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">What are the main probs with Dominions II.??? [Other than the bad strategical AI.]

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Im afraid that Im beginning to agree. Im eager to play the full game and try very hard to convince myself to start playing Dom 2 instead of Dom 1. Especially since Ive got half a dozen copies of Dom 1 and dont expect to do the same for Dom 2.

But then much of what was changed were things that were demanded loudly by lemmings who gave no good reason for demanding it. They dont realize that everything has its pros and cons. There is a price to be paid for shoving something onto the do-list. The full game isnt even out yet and we are seeing the same thing happen again right in this forum IMHO.

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So Dominions I. is better? I didn't played with Doms I.
So what are the main probs with Doms II.? [Once again, I know about the bad strat AI. post anything else.]

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What if we all wait for the full Version and then say which one of the games is better, mmmkay?

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What do you vets think is worse about dom 2? The potential increased focus on supercombatants? And if they could rebalance that would it be better?

I found many changes nice myself, mainly anti-micro features, the lack of a need to patrol/tax, a greatly iproved interface. Only thing I'm lacking is the battle replay speed really. Personally I've found the AI in general to be much better now that old abuses have been removed, although I'm sure new ones can beat it just as well.

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I've found Dominions 2 to be similar or superior in every regard, except 3:

1) Some bugs that snuck in
2) The overall lack of gold income
3) Inability to accelerate battles

What are these major problems that make you prefer MM-heck Dominions I to Dominions II?

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This can't be serious, I'd like to see a list of those changes for the worst because certainly there are very few that qualify as such (and no, having your favority tactic/style of play whatever nerfed does not count, just adapt).

-The interface takes some time to get used to after having played with the previous one for so long, yet it's way way more powerful:

Now you do not need to hunt for that one researcher you have not moved to the new field, you just make a couple clicks instead of having to readjust every single mage. You can also send all your slaves & gems from clams & such to the lab with a single click...this is a huge MM improvement. Same with the no need to adjust your taxes every turn with bad patrol results.

You can reccord scripts...scripting the 20th support mage in a row was never so easy.

You can move a huge number of commanders together, and no longer are limited by the 18 names max when transferring gems outside of a lab.

-The music is gorgeous, and I love the new look of spell effects like astral shield or nether bolt.

-The number of units almost doubled, from 600+ to 1100+! and we are not talking about MOTS (more of the same, minor changes to previous units), the new units have great descriptions & backgrounds.

The main step back I can think of is the loss of the speed replay, but we might get this one patched in future.

As per the AI needing to build heavier troops, that one will be easy to patch.

So, what else? I hope balance is not being judged before the game has even been released, and besides IW has a good reccord of patching this one in Dom I.

[ November 01, 2003, 23:08: Message edited by: Wendigo ]

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Well put.

I'd also add I like the new tactical orders better. And the nerfed storms. And the nerfed wards.

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I have only played the two demos (Pre-Ordered copy of Dom II) but I can't see anything Dom I has over II other than combat replay speed and I bet that will be patched.

Sammual

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OK I scrolled back and read just to make sure and nobody said that Dom II is worse. It definetly has some great advancements, and alot of love has obviously gone into the animated combat. When the full game reaches me I will be better able to pass judgement on the rest

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Gandalf, I find you first post in this thread bordering on insulting, do you think illwinter is constituted of mindless automatons that implements any change that might be suggested. I have no idea where you are coming from, dom 2 was made the same way dom 1 was, content where added because it was fun, the content of the game have the same originators, the sources are much the same. Most of the input outside our circle of swedish friends where derived from cspigs. So if demands from loud lemmings have made their ways into dominions 2 and ruined the game, you are one of the lemmings.

Apoger, what are your gripes beyond the replay speed and the scarcity of the gold? Are you honestly suggesting that the looks is the only thing that is improved in the game? As far as I can tell the replay speed, the scarcity of gold and its consequences is the only issue you have raised. Sure there might be balance issues in some cases but this was the case at the release of dom 1 as well.

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Quite right, Im sorry I gave that impression. Im getting edgy at some of the "absolute facts" about what is "wrong" with the game that people seem to think must either get fixed, or IW is ignoring them.

So far the demo gives me the impression that the game has moved a far way toward leveling things for more balance, and a better gui, and a product much closer to market standards. As Ive said I am waiting for the full copy Ive ordered.

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>Are you honestly suggesting that the looks is the only thing that is improved in the game?

The looks and a few nice interface tweaks, such as the research pool.

Yup, that's it.

Beyond that is the gameplay, and frankly I think Dom I played better and was better balanced.


>As far as I can tell the replay speed, the scarcity of gold and its consequences is the only issue you have raised. Sure there might be balance issues in some cases but this was the case at the release of dom 1 as well.

Balance issues is putting it mildly.

Dom I was not about graphics or interface, obviously. What made Dom I great was a combination of incredible complexity and the balance between those complexities. In a game as massive as Dom I there were only a handfull of balance issues.

It seems that IW was intent on making pretenders more potent in Dom II. I have no issue with that. However instead of making pretenders more potent... you guys diminished the potency of near everything else. Taking such a backwards approach has thrown a giant monkey wrench into the games balance. I know that you don't see it, and many players here who aren't familiar with Dom I don't understand, but IMHO it's pretty clear.

Making resources scarce has ripples of effect through the game. It detracts from light troops. It makes it hard to build forts. It makes mages hard to afford. Making it hard to do stuff, is not fun.

Meanwhile players will be inspired to build super combatant pretenders. In multiplay, the whole game is going to be a festival of giant pretenders going on rampages. Hey, I'm one of the biggest abUsers of this sort of strategy, and even I think it's going to get out of control. I want to choose between hard choices and paths. The current system is destined for 'Super combatant face off', and that's not fun.

Blood magic was diminished less than everything else even though it was a major problem in Dom I. What were you thinking? Limiting the super blood summons was good, but it's not limited enough. Still plenty of super combatant chassis to go around. Extra blood slaves can be used for "hordes from hell". HfH, by the way, is also going to be a major issue. Blood magic was too easy and too cheap, and your response was to make it easier and cheaper? I simply do not understand.

Death magic was not changed. Death summons cost the same, and death mages can still summon skels. Any reason that elemental magic got crushed, but death comes through with no change?

Wrathful skies. Did I not make it clear that this spell is an issue in Dom I? It's going to be much worse in Dom II. Having an enemy air mage cloud trapeze into my army and blow it away with wrathful skies... not fun.

Almost all evocations got nerfed, however I predict that the classic quickness-orb lightning, will be back in force.

The Seithkona nether darts problem will also make a return.

Meanwhile most other evocations have become stunningly inaccurate. It brings new meaning to the phrase "can't hit the broadside of a barn". Mages can't hit AN ARMY that is standing out in front of them with a fireball. OK can't is too strong... can't hit 4 of 5 times. Spells like flying shards and fire flies are jaw dropping as they fan out across the entire length of the battlefield! Funny, yes... but not fun.

High taxes destroying population in droves while low taxes have no effect. A design choice that I just cannot support. And not fun.

While the new interface is better than Dom I, it isn't very good. Certainly not up to standards set by other full priced games. If the game cost $30 then I wouldn't complain, but if you are charging big league prices then you get big league criticism. "It sucks less than Dom I" is not the same as "it's great!". The current Dom II interface is clunky and non-intuitive.

There's still no reason to take a fort other than wizards tower or fortified city.

Sorry that this post has become a bit of a rant. However the "feel" of Dom II is slow. The "low resouce model" exacerbates the problems with game imbalance since any issue means more since players have less.

Nobody was as big a Dominions fanboy as me, and I'm not upset because the system has changed. I am upset because I percieve that the system has changed for the worse.

It's not just me. I have a friend that cancelled his order after seeing the demo (and not becuase of input from me). My sizable gaming group who are all huge Dom I fans, are seriously questioning whether we should get involved with Dom II.

When push comes to shove, the gameplay of the demo is just not as much fun as the gameplay of Dom I, and I can see trends that will make it worse. Right now in the euphoria surrounding the better graphics and new release, players are being forgiving of the gameplay. When things calm down a bit, they will start to concentrate on game issues, and they will not be as happy as the Dom I community.

Again sorry for the rant, I should have written a more coherent essay. However since I spewed this, I might as well post it.

[ November 02, 2003, 04:19: Message edited by: apoger ]

Re: Did you noticed.......
 

I agree with a lot of what you said, though not as vehemently. But a lot of it is holdovers from DomI rather than negative changes. And the negative changes can mostly be remedied fairly easily, once they have been brought to IW's attention... if they are found to, in fact, be detrimental to the final game.

But this:

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">...is flat-out wrong. No more SDR-scout slavers, and seemingly higher unrest incurrence... hmm. No, the blood economy is weaker, period. You have to hunt in many provinces, with expensive (and usually national) mages, not in one or two provinces, with cheap scouts.

Since most of what you said is relevant, but phrased in a harsh manner that Illwinter would not want to read, or would be immediately biased against just by its tone... you're kind of doing the community a disservice. Just like those zealous Christians who burn gays. Is Christianity good, or bad? I don't know, but those people sure turn me off from it, regardless of any virtues it may have.

So, if I were you, I'd rephrase it in a less confrontational manner.

-Cherry

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I agree, good points..and you didn't even mentioned other things, like the strategic AI etc. etc.

Overall I am quite sad about the demo, maybe some patches will fix our problems. We shall see.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Disagree. The Mausoleum and Watch Tower are good cheap picks for most setups. Compared to a Watch Tower, the Wizard Tower will give you, what, less than 20 more gold/turn with optimal scales? For 120 more design points? I'd certainly invest in a Wizard Tower with, say, Ulm/default - but that's the exception rather than the norm.

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I dont know if my opinion was asked (or even valued), but as I played doms I for one year and a half, here it is:

- the interface is far better, and does a good job in reducing the micromanagement, and accelerating the infos gathering. There is still some issues with it, but I can live without (sorting by column on the overview eg, etc.).

- many minors, or not so minors mechanisms have been improved in the right sense (cant use dousing rods with scouts, improved targetting AI in tac battle, etc etc.). In a sense doms II appears to have many refined mechanisms compared to doms I.

- Many new & good ideas (themes, blessing effects stemming from magic, individualized Demons Princes, etc.). This give a new feel to the game.

Now what I think is detrimental to the game (my major issues) :

- Toning down gold output emphazize even further on a combatting pretender at start. Such a pretender double your initial expansion speed, as you will have problem fielding, rapidly, several provinces-taking regular armies (in dominions I it was possible to have 2 such armies before turn 10).

- Super combattants problem far from being fixed.

- no speed replay in the tac engine. Battles can Last 15 minutes real time now, and I dont feel it is suitable to take a book each time I want to watch the end of a battle.

- Evocations spells wich dont affect the whole battlefield (except a few ones) are even less accurate, and as mages are rarer (not a bad thing per se), I suspect nobody will ever cast a fireball in competitive game environement.

[ November 02, 2003, 09:19: Message edited by: Pocus ]

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">? Nice reply. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

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When quoting really long Posts, please do not post the entire thing again... post the first line or two, followed by an ellipses (...). All it does is slow page loading times down, and forces everyone to scroll past a big chunk of material they already read. Thanks.

Re: Did you noticed.......
 

MStavros :

I was editing the content http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Did you noticed.......
 

My only real gripe this far is that army bLasting spells are still there, but i don't know have they been nerfed or not. And we have a new, low level army bLasting spell, but i'll have to see if it is unbalanced or not.

Astral magic turned even more important, but i'm not sure how this will affect the game. Propably more pretenders with Astral.

And Apoger, Curse and Star Fires aren't the only supercombatant counters...

[ November 02, 2003, 10:07: Message edited by: Nerfix ]

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I dont think you are likely to see a comment on the AI thread until people have had a chance to play the the full game. Without the turns limit people are more likely to play it with realistic settings and gain a whole new viewpoint. This might move the AI thing from being "big #1 problem" to "ok for now but could use tweaking"

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I'm not used enough to Dom2 (wasn't even that used to Dom1 ..), but I think the main gameplay change comes from the reduced gold income, itself coming from the new tax/no patrol system.
I fear that Dom2 games will be rather "smallish" in terms of army size compared to Dom1, so focusing more on elite troops/SC (as many pointed out).
But conversely note that the reduced mm will allow us to play larger maps, thus giving nations more gold/resources...
So we've still to experiment, but surely we have to adapt - and changes are always unwelcome to old vets http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

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I don't know, I love the whole layout of Dominions II. I love the demo as well, the only thing what I don't like is the weak strategic AI, but that's nothing new, since we're talking about this for days.

I am sure that the devs are checking the AI threads. If I remember correctly, Kris has posted something that he will play some games against the AI, after hes back. [He will be back today.]
So just wait and be patient.

[ November 02, 2003, 14:59: Message edited by: Mortifer ]

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I have been unable to recruit the apprentice but in the capital. Is it supposed to be that way?

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I have been unable to recruit the apprentice but in the capital. Is it supposed to be that way? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">No its probably right, I just didn't bother to check out if he was exclusive to the home province or not, and to be on the safe side I made the more inclusive claim. But the home site requierment obviously only strengthen the point I was making.

As for comments on the AI it is better that JK or KO handles that than me. Kristoffer should be back in a couple of hours.

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1) This is a great game.

2) If a (minority??) of players don't like design choices then they should harass (or attack rearmost...) for a modding tool instead of complaining about these choices.

3) However I agree with [don't remember who] whos said that a 50$ game must accept criticism much better than a 30$ game.

5) This is a great game

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Yup, great game but it will need lot of fixes/tweaks. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

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what bother me a bit (well more than a bit) is now that blood magic is much more restricted to native blood nations, then SC will concentrate into these nations.

Whereas, as a worst case, you could at least try to counter/temper the influence of SC (which are mostly blood creatures) in doms I by starting blood magic yourself (I remember a pbem game where after 15 turns of efforts, starting from nothing, I produced one ice devil every two turns with a mystic which was empowered in blood magic).

But this was a very poor workaround. What would have been better is to reduce much further the nastiness of big creatures in Doms II (several mechanisms can be found to increase how a sole creature can be mobbed by several smaller ones). With more than 12-15 demons prince available, there is in practice no reduction in the numbers of SC dominions games will see, with the annoying change that they will be controlled by the 4/5 blood nations.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">This is not a counterargument, but a honest question. Why do you claim this? Is it not just a case of empowering like with everything else? I probably haven't played enough to perceive it, but would be interested to know what's the basis of a claim.

[ November 02, 2003, 19:47: Message edited by: HJ ]

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Pretender SCs are lame. Period. I have no probs with the late game SCs, but IMHO the early pretender SC is a cheap way to abuse the AI.
I am talkin about Doms I. but this will be a problem in Doms II. as well, as I've seen it in the demo.

--This is not a prob. in MP, since everyone will use it.--

[ November 02, 2003, 20:29: Message edited by: Zerger ]

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">This is not a counterargument, but a honest question. Why do you claim this? Is it not just a case of empowering like with everything else? I probably haven't played enough to perceive it, but would be interested to know what's the basis of a claim. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">because the blood harvest mechanism restrictions (no more non blood leaders harvesting blood slaves, which is a good thing) prevent non blood nations to develop a strong blood economy. So only native blood nations will be able to summon the strong devils and demons which make the chassis of 90% of super combattants.

Perhaps it is possible to have a small blood economy to run (20 slaves a turn, for the sake of giving a number) if you are no national mages with blood, but as Demons/Devils Princes can be banished like global enchants, you can be sure that the native blood nations will have no problems removing the single SC you were able to summon, if they are your enemy.

Theorically, I dont see a problem in that, it appears legit that Demons&Devils are controlled by blood nations. But these big creatures should either be toned to a reasonable level, or should have problems fighting alone (like Super Pretenders).

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Indeed, I agree with this.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I thought that all commanders have a blood hunt order? That's why I'm asking. Sure you can get more slaves if you start with blood, but you can also gather enough of them to empower a few mages even though you don't start with blood. Are there some other restrictions I am not aware of? What are the restrictions exactly,a nd how are they different from DomI?

[ November 02, 2003, 20:58: Message edited by: HJ ]

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I thought that all commanders have a blood hunt order? That's why I'm asking. Sure you can get more slaves if you start with blood, but you can also gather enough of them to empower a few mages even though you don't start with blood. Are there some other restrictions I am not aware of? What are the restrictions exactly,a nd how are they different from DomI? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">It looks like the unreast hit for blood hunts is MUCH harder to knock down and I see less blood slaves as a result.

Sammual

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">How is blood magic easier and cheaper? The only nation in the demo you can possibly claim this about is Abysia. Abysia now has a warlock apprentice for 150 gold. The warlock apprentice is certainly not cheaper then a scout with a sanguine dowsing rod. The warlock apprentice is only recruitable in provinces with castles and labs. I fail to see how this is cheaper and easier, especially since you have in other Posts claimed that the new reduced gold incomes will make mages scarce. Also the big blood summons are more expensive. And a popular blood summon like Father Illearth is now singular.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Death summons where never as much of a problem as air and fire elementals, the death magic required for raise dead is primarily posessed by nations traditionally considered on the weak side, such as Ermor or Ctis.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">How will this be worse in dom 2 than dom 1? Because of the reduced efficiency of the wards? This is a step that most people seems happy about otherwise.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Evocations have not been nerfed, in fact precision above ten improves precision more than in dom 1. The source of your problem is the wider battlefield. The wider battlefield was introduced to make missile weapons more useful. Position your mages closer to the front if you want results similar to dom 1.


<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I still think this is an excellent design choice.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">The various other castles are now more viable than ever before, part of this is due to the reduced income increase of admin.

Your claim that any imbalance means more because players have less is at best to vague to judge and at worst downright false. If players have less they also have less to produce imbalances with. By your argument the richer the world in dom 1 the more balanced it would be, this might be true by virtue of special sites or indeps blurring the distinctions between different naions, other than that I do not think it is much to support the conclusion.

Many of the complaints you give as reasons why things have gotten worse are complaints that things have not changed. And some things that have obviously changed for the better, such as with bloodsummons, you claim they have changed for the worse. Sure there might be instances that could do with balancing, but as you make out your case you grossly overstate it.

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Johan....you should make some replies in some other threads as well...IE. AI threads etc.

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BTW Apoger, did you notice that Abysians have less precision than normal humans?

Some spells have less precision like Blade Wind(and i like it this way) or Star Fires (which i don't like this way) and some spells could use more precision(few Blood spells).

[ November 02, 2003, 12:35: Message edited by: Nerfix ]

Re: Did you noticed.......
 

90% of the game will be about SCs. Just take a look at the pretender SC abuse.
Don't forget, we have many more problems other than these anyways.

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HJ --

I seem to recall that the devs have stated that the sanguine dowsing rod no longer helps non-blood commanders find blood slaves (haven't checked this yet in the demo personally).

This will make it a LOT harder compared to Dom I to really get a blood economy rolling...

It used to be possible to hand out SDRs (cheap at 5 blood slaves, once you get a blood mage -- e.g. certain indies and magical sites provide them) to cheap commanders and harvest. The SDR would boost their base chance of finding slaves from something like 10% to something like 50% (!). And once you got started, more SDRs could be cranked out, and you could feed the machine with yet more cheap commanders.

Now you'll have to use genuine blood mages to do well in blood -- which means either having native mages, or getting quite a few relevant indys / sites, unless you relish empowering non-blood commanders at 50 slaves a pop.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I don't see how this is different than empowering them in any other magic that you don't start with. You won't have the ability to find the right sites, and therefore will have a hard time getting the right gems to empower your mages. Random magic picks on native mages helps a lot as well, and you might get some blood mages.
The very similar thing applies for the blood slaves as well, the distinction being that once found the site will pump out the gems by itself, and here you need to dedicate a mage to do that. So you lose a mage to a dedicated service, but it ends up being the same thing, when you disregard the difference stemming from the fact that blood is inherently different from other magic school in general.

Thanks for the info.

[ November 03, 2003, 03:24: Message edited by: HJ ]

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I'm a reasonably experianced Dom I PBEM player and I have a very different take than the negative one expressed on this and other threads by some toher Dom I players.

1. I think you are seriously jumping the gun Alex. I read your Posts on the new bless effects being underpowered and you made some pretty firm statements - before you had seen the demo. Well I've played the demo and I think you owe someone a pizza with Anchovies - the bless effects are my biggest worry for being canidates as overpowered.

Don't decide what the game balence is like before you have seen the full game and played it awhile!

2. Stick with Dom I?? Err, aaah, do you remember target mages orders for archers? "We'll just get our flying observers to signal us angle of fire and velocity of release so that we can take out the mages somewhere in the back of that there huge army - got em!" Taking that out is a huge bonus for mages that few seem to have considered.

Thats just one of many, many improvements in game balence and play including dealing with the insane elemental summoning that nerfed many other forms of magic because they couldn't compete. To have increased the power of other magic so it could compete with the old uber magic would have ruined much of the game.

If the Dom II isn't a step forward for a Dom I player I would suggest they have been sucked into the world of Dom I and are criticising things just because they are different from Dom I.

3. Have you been trying out some of the new thematic possibilities? Race design has taken a huge leap forward with the addition of themes and bless effects. "Right I think I'll design a Jotun race which is going to win by bringing back the Ice Age before collapsing under its own decay setting off a new thawing" - finally I can do it.

4. The interface. I could not play single player Dom I beyond test bedding - to fussy. Now I can.

5. MP = early game supercombatents? Am I the only one who finds early game super combatents dieing left right and center when used carelessly? My "Back to the Ice Age" Jotun race has awesome early supercombatents and all it takes to kill one is a few lizards with pokey things! Sure they smash low damage dealers but I wouldn't have thought two handed weapons were a hard to achieve counter?

I would suggest starting MP games with each race having ~6 provinces and two Castles - I think you will find this will reward better balenced races as it reduces the fear of the early overrun which changes the whole meta game of race design.

6. Evocation. Johan seriously the fire magic thing is silly. Very silly - it makes mages look like clowns. I have given it a good go, cast many, many fireballs and if you are happy with the overall balence then please reduce the damage of evocation fire magic and increase the accuracy so we don't all feel so stupid using fire mages. Its just a really unfun/kill joy feature.

Guys lets not jump the boat because our favourite strategies have died and we are worried for the future - take some time and give it a good go.

As a race designer with a love of synergy I couldn't go back to Dom I. To me the increase in this area is a massive step forward as I though most Dom I races lacked synergy. The addition of the themes and bless effects creates many new possibilites for synergy.

Don't worry, be happy . . .

Keir

Re: Did you noticed.......
 

I guess Alex has posted his experience with the demo. Correct me if I am wrong.

[ November 03, 2003, 09:20: Message edited by: MStavros ]

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I agree with everything you said. #5 and #6 are important. I have yet to see a fire spell kill anything other than a LI.

When I first read about the bless effects and played with them I thought they were useless (Rainbow Mage, 4 Fire / 4 Nature / 4 Earth). Now that I have tried Water 9 / Nature 9 I have changed my story. As long as you go all out the bless effects can rock.

Sammual

Re: Did you noticed.......
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">care to develop your argument? Everything prove the contrary, as already explained.

Re: Did you noticed.......
 

HJ -- A big difference is that blood is far less tied to magical sites than the rest; at least in Dom I, anyway, even the Damned Merchant (blood 1?, gives 1 slave/turn) was pretty rare. Hence you can't just conquer a province somebody else searched and get free slaves, normally. Nor can you find the sites with a handful of mages searching or casting divination spells, and reap blood income for free (i.e. no further action); your blood income is heavily tied to population and blood mages (since SDRs won't help as much). It's harder to get started, but it used to be easier to boost your capacity once you did get started so long as you had heavily populated provinces.

Re: Did you noticed.......
 

>I think you owe someone a pizza with Anchovies -

Ahem... that was in response to a specific warden versus flagellent fight. We will do the testing when the full game comes out and we have access to the flags.


>5. MP = early game supercombatents? Am I the only one who finds early game super combatents dieing left right and center when used carelessly? My "Back to the Ice Age" Jotun race has awesome early supercombatents and all it takes to kill one is a few lizards with pokey things! Sure they smash low damage dealers but I wouldn't have thought two handed weapons were a hard to achieve counter?

We obviously have different definitions of super combatant.


>I would suggest starting MP games with each race having ~6 provinces and two Castles - I think you will find this will reward better balenced races as it reduces the fear of the early overrun which changes the whole meta game of race design.

I have developed a scenario offering just such a theme. Check out Sunrays site for the download.

[ November 03, 2003, 15:37: Message edited by: apoger ]

Re: Did you noticed.......
 

can been done with scripting, remind me the specifics? it was 35 wardens against 100 flags, and what magic levels should their gods get?

Taqwus : nicely explained. In doms I blood income would allow a nation to get increased blood income, because of a kind of snow balling effect (I had Abysia reaching between 150 and 200 slaves a turn in a MP game).