What are Arch Devils good for?
 

They require 1 more blood, 1 more research level, and 30% more slaves than ice devils, they have level 4 magic instead of level 3... and are inferior, statwise. They can fly, but they can't go underwater, so that's a tie. And they can't cast quickness on themselves.

Are Arch Devils good only for hot nations, or nations that have fire magic and no water magic? For a neutral-heat nation with mages that can summon either one, is there any point in summoning arch devils, or is it just something to do once all the ice devils are taken? Are they even more valuable than a soul contract? They seem like a fun diVersion from winning strategies.

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">They can't cast quickness, but they can cast Fire Shield. That would be a tie, too. Also, fire has some very good battlefield damaging spells, and propably the best far-strikers. As pure fighters they might lose, but still I think they could get more kills than Ice Devils. But ADs need more research, so they are a bomb with a long fuse.

Besides, won't you love a mage that is strong enough to go meleeing and then cast Flame Eruption? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif BTW, if they need a boost, I would I would give my vote for an Amulet of Vengeance -effect...

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

By default they are Level 4 fire mages... so add one more level and they're casting that level_9 spell (flames from the sky). A simple magic item can do this. They can also cast that 'fires from afar' which does more damage with more powerful fire mages .

For battle I prefer having them cast :
phoenix pyre
&
fire shield

[ February 13, 2004, 18:56: Message edited by: NTJedi ]

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

Phoenix Pyre! Wow, I never realised that...

[ February 13, 2004, 19:06: Message edited by: Endoperez ]

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">It's a fun spell. I love watching an AI commander kill it's own armies with it ...

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

Flying is about a zillion times more useful than entering a sea (on most maps anyway...) I'd hardly call that a wash. However, by the time you're throwing IDs and ADs around you're probably also able to equip them properly (quickness, waterbreathing, flying carpet, ...) to offset what they lack or what you want to give them.

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

Keep in mind there are nations (Marignon/DF comes to mind, and Abysia too with their fire-3/blood-3 hero) which have mages who can bind Arch-Devils easier than Ice Devils.

And Arch-Devils easily outperform Ice Devils in Heat+3.

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

Arch-Devils also come inherently with Flying (as has been noted) thus freeing up a foot slot (Boots of Quickness anyone?).

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

Flying boots (5 air) versus quick boots (10 water). Flying boots win...

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

Depending on the nation.

How many nations have access to water without access to air?

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Mictlan only has air if you get the eagle priest hero. Other than that all the water nations can get a single random in air.

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Mictlan only has air if you get the eagle priest hero. Other than that all the water nations can get a single random in air. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Mictlan has lots of magic, but all the mages are expensive (initially) and the lack of randoms is quite painful... no entry into non-national paths.

They are a good example, though. +1 heat - not too bad. Ice devils still have much higher HP and higher protection... Also, Breath of Winter is nice for combat. You cast it once and it's done; AD has no similar continual heat-effect boosting spell. I would rate BoW and Flame Shield as equal versus living armies.

[ February 13, 2004, 22:30: Message edited by: Saber Cherry ]

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

BTW, anyone know if an AD with Rime Hauberk can radiate heat and cold at the same time?

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

It does. Though I'm pretty sure it doesn't fatigue him since he is given 100% CR.

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">There is one archdevil that has a scythe of slaying though, which is a very nice weapon. I'm dissappointed that immolation doesn't add to the heat effects of such creatures.

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

And their flight and fire magic orientation makes them good leaders for fire-resistant devils and demon knights.

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

If you're like my Mictlan, or Abyssia, or anyone with a Soul Contract, you've got this growing army of devils who do really well in packs, which get very hot. Ice Devil is no good there, but Arch Devil is in his element. Add a blood mage and cast heat from hell, and... fwoosh!

PvK

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

Also, when summoning Ice Devils you might get the one with no hand slots. No such danger with the ACs.

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

the arch devils are good for tactical movement and undead/demon leadership, not to mention heat from hell(one archdevil gets a free fire gem every turn...).

Re: What are Arch Devils good for?
 

Take an Archdevil, give him 75 devil to lead (that's its limit), and just watch your flying army from hell tear into just about anything. Making your archdevil a SC is just icing on the cake at that point. Can't do that with an Ice devil. On the other hand, my Ice devil is leading my amphibious cross-breeding experiments right now in the South Atlantic, so it too has its place.

So far, the only army which stopped me (long enough for reinforcement to arrive, due to the losses taken) was a Tien Ch'i army with about 350 units total, mostly shades, undead horsemen, and some Behemoth and celestial soldiers. I was fighting at a 1 against 5 numerical disadvantage, and I still won, but lost half my devils... No problem, I am making 15 a turn with soul contracts.

Also, one of the Archdevil has a very nice weapon built in (some kind of scythe).

But there is something better than an Archdevil for this : a demon lord. I have just summoned Pazuzu, no time to equip him yet, and he looks very nice...