Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

As there are more and more players here who don't have any experience with DOM1 and little with DOM2, as they just got the game, I though I could shed some light on some of the more obscure aspects of DOM, which aren't found in other games in a similar fashion -

GIFT OF REASON this time

This spell (thaumaturgy-4, nature-4, 20gems) makes a commander from any unit.

Some examples .. (I'll add some as I try them out)

Living Statue
+ Low cost, full set of slots, high natural protection.
- Too low hitpoints for a real supercombattant, very low "tactical speed"

Troll

Sea Troll

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

IMO, there's little reason to GoR a troll or a sea troll as you can just summon a troll king/sea king for about twice the gems and get not only the king but a bunch of minions as well. And you don't need to know Thaumaturgy either.

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

Your casting each time? As far as I know, what you see isnt much different than what is in the AllView game. Basically it makes every unit into a commander. (oops hope that doesnt ruin your fun). I wonder how those nature spirits would do...

[ February 23, 2004, 20:55: Message edited by: Gandalf Parker ]

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

Let's see. 20 nature gems and 1 earth gem for a Troll commander.... OR... 45 earth gems for a Troll King with better stats and earth-3 (able to summon more Trolls or Troll Kings) AND 15 ordinary trolls.

Of course, if you have some unique situation that really screams for a regenerating commander, the Troll might make sense, but in just about any scenario I can envision it makes more sense to GoR something that you cannot easily summon a better instance of.

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

.. let's see, folks:

Troll King

Devil
Crusher

.. and before you ask, yes, I had an insanly amount of nature gems to burn in that game. So I looked around for some fun things ..

[ February 23, 2004, 21:41: Message edited by: Arralen ]

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Um, mightn't it instead be 20 nature and 60 (?) gold for a Troll commander? This would allow one to justify one's choice of Troll over Troll King based on an absence of Earth mages. Not necessarily a great rationale, but still...

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

Funny. The only time I use this spell is when I want to "promote" an exceptionally experienced unit. Usually they pop right into the Hall of Fame as an added bonus. Five star Elephant with Heroic Endurance anyone?

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Um, mightn't it instead be 20 nature and 60 (?) gold for a Troll commander? This would allow one to justify one's choice of Troll over Troll King based on an absence of Earth mages. Not necessarily a great rationale, but still... </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">It might indeed by 20 nature and 60 gold, assuming that one found one of the rare provinces in which Trolls can be recruited. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

In which case, assuming that I wanted a Troll for the regeneration in the first place, I would probably rather spend 10 nature gems on a ring of regeneration for some other commander than use 20 on giving a Troll Gift of Reason, come to think of it, but I guess that is a question of style. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

okay, this is only for fun, it wont be really good BUT try to do a few crossbreeds. Sometimes you get big foul spawns with like 4 armor piercing claws. now give them the gift of reason and hope you equip with 2 misc and one armor. now you really have a SC, esspecially given a strong dominion and Gift of Health. They arent really THAT strong, but i always liked the idea of a giant mutant attacking with tentacles and stuff !

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

Some of the void summons are fun this way.
GoR'ing a Vastness is a mixed bag, however. While you gain a formidable magical commander who has 10 strategic movement, he also is an astral-3 mage which opens up a vulnerability to Magic Duel.
A GoR'd Iron Dragon can be great fun. A GoR'd Wailing Lady with a Black Heart would make a nasty assassin, albeit it's not THAT strong -- needs armor, more hp would be nice. An area-1 save-or-die length-6 attack is spiffy however.
GoR'ing is also handy if you enslave enemy commanders, as they should get their magical paths and equipment slots back.

(Edit.) Oh, and of course, if you cast Tartarian Gate, GoR the result if it's not already a commander and esp. if you have ways to heal the not uncommon Feeblemind. A male Tartarian Titan appears to come with 7 points of magic in a 3-2-2 pattern, a nice buy for the cost.

[ February 24, 2004, 18:05: Message edited by: Taqwus ]

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

Yum, I love the idea of the instant Hall of Famer! Gift of Reason may not be cost effective, but it is more fun than most spells, so I love it. Now I just need to get it in real life and apply it to some people I know…

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Yes! Starting with all elected officials ...

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

Played against Pythium in a game semi recently. Ended up facing a GoR'd hydra prophet. As long as it was fighting in his domain, it seemed pretty much unkillable ;p It was regening around 50hp a turn iirc.

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

A hydra prophet? That's even weirder, thematically, than the Ashikaga Jonin prophet I had in one game. Heh -- with over 60+ assassinations (long, slow-paced SP game) I reckon he'd be good at keeping the audience's attention. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif
(And I'm tempted to try out an Arco Golden Era Sceptic Prophet, both for the irony and for the hope that it would tear down enemy dominion especially fast.)

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I was sort of wondering about that myself...perhaps he's only skeptical regarding *other* faiths rather than *all* faiths, including his own. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif Essentially, he'd be the philosophical equivalent of an assassin. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

I tried GoR-ing the Eater of the Dead, just to see if you can keep control of him after he gets too big to be commanded normally.

You can't, but he rebelled while besieging an enemy capital, and I had great fun feeding him unburied bodies (with the various disaster-causing spells) and watching the AI try to recapture its capital from this obscenely high-HP, ridiculously rapidly regenerating monster. He seems to regenerate 10% of his HPs every round, and got up to over 1000 HPs near the end.

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

My Eater of the Dead ditched me around 350 Hps... based on the cost of gems and the fact it ditches you... other units are a better deal.
They're good if you have lots of gems, want to play around on the map and you've got the game easy. I wouldn't bring one into serious games tho.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

I am reasonably sure that I managed to charm the Eater of the dead when it went wild.

Having it go wild in enemy lands is fun, but it is not that hard to kill when it goes wild. Regenerating 35 hps per round does not help against an army with its low defense and prot.

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

The most interesting thing was when someone (Arryn?) GoR'd a Blood Slave and empowered it in blood magic. I think he said it crashed the game, though, when she tried to use herself in combat. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

Double post. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

[ February 27, 2004, 15:25: Message edited by: moodgiesanta ]

Re: Fun with ... GIFT OF REASON and Super Combatants
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Cool. Did it stay charmed, or revert to Unfettered status the next time it crunched down on a tasty corpsicle?

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I'd certainly agree that it is more of a "for fun" summons than a serious contender in a MP game (unless someone can suggest a sneaky strategy for it), but regenerating 35HP/round is the lower limit for an Unfettered Eater of the Dead, from what I remember of my test. And yes, this was at the end of a single-player game on a large map.

Once the Eater has over 1000HP (and so is regenerating over 100HP/round), with very high Fear, and add on whatever boosting magic items you gave him (2 miscellaneous slots, if I recall correctly), he will be a major pain to kill.

Not impossible, but what is?