Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">WTF ? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif Dom2 already knocked MoM out of the throne ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

I don't know yet PDF (somehow I knew you would be the first to make the inevitable comment). http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Dominions 2 haven't been around long enough to be a contender for that the title. Perhaps one could call it a Pretender? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

People are still feeling very strongly about MoM. And a sequel would surely draw quite a crowd.

But it's just my personal opinion of course. It's rather like discussing whom the best fantasy writer is.

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

I thought Dominions 1 was the game that knocked MoM from its throne... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif
But then, I played Dom before MoM and that does affect my view. Quite a few of my friends who are not that interested in a game as complex as Dominions find MoM a great game, though. Pity, because it doesn't have real multiplayer...

[ March 08, 2004, 13:33: Message edited by: Endoperez ]

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Don't call me "fanboy" please ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif
Seriously, I'm an old MoM fan (still played it Last year ...) but now I'm sure Dom2 is superior in every aspect - except maybe learning curve !

Endoperez,
Dom1 was a very good game (after all 90% of Dom2 were already in) but IMHO was very handicapped by a poor interface, antiquated graphics and lack of info/management screens and features.

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Comparing *any* game to any Version of BC would make the other game look good. BC is one of the worst games ever made ...

If you want a better comparison, try Dom2 vs. Civ3. Dom2 still has a long way to go by that measure. OTOH, Civ3 had a *huge* development budget, and some of the best programmers and designers in the gaming industry, including Sid.

[ March 08, 2004, 15:41: Message edited by: Arryn ]

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">In what way the graphics of Dom1 are more antiqued than those of MoM? I agree that MoM was easier to get into, but I found some really frustrating things from it too. The biggest one was that I could only be casting one spell at any time... Besides that, I don't recall that many "info/management screens and features". You won't get as detailed province information in Dom as you get from cities of MoM, but the province-city difference is one of the big ones between the two games. Do you mean some of the Advisors?

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

Does any of this (which is probably true but since I never played those games have no clue about) actually imply that Dom2 has a great interface? I *love* DomII, but the interface is perhaps one of only two aspects about it which I find to be at least slightly suboptimal.

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">You get used to the Dom2 interface much like you get used to aching bones as you grow older. IOW, it's annoying, but life moves on.

Alas, I would not expect much improvement as the devs have stated that they detest working on UI and prefer to work on other aspects of the game. Which means that the one issue that is most-criticized in the otherwise glowing magazine reviews of Dom2 is the least likely thing to change, and will prevent Dom2 from ever getting that Last 1/2-star in magazines like CG & CGW.

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I wouldn't say it's "great", no, but it is functional - and with a few relatively minor tweaks (many of which have already been discussed in the various wish list threads) I think it would meet all of my expectations. I don't find the current setup all that tedious, even late-game...but I have a feeling I might be in the minority on that one. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

OK.
Don't get me wrong, I wasn't saying it was awful or anything; but I believe the original poster used the phrase "great", which is a superlative in English unless I am mistaken. It can also mean "very large", but that would be a bizarre metaphore.

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">...unless you have a 21" monitor. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

I think the original poster was trying to make sort of a joke with his title, and to say that Dom's interface (even with its...eccentricities) is better (in terms of its functionality and learning curve) than the UIs of some games with much larger budgets.

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

It took me a while to learn how to do things in dom2 but once i did the interface wasn't an issue (for me at least).

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

"I think the original poster was trying to make sort of a joke with his title, and to say that Dom's interface (even with its...eccentricities) is better (in terms of its functionality and learning curve) than the UIs of some games with much larger budgets."

Exactly.

Sorry for the confusion.

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Not including Sid, which is a good thing. Sid had his hands in with Civ 1, all other projects have been lead by Brian Reynolds. Sid Meier himself hasn't had absolutely anything to do with the games "Civilization 2", "Alpha Centauri" and "Civilization 3", only reason they are all under his name is because it sells. Kinda makes you undrestand why Reynolds left Firaxis, looking at how easily Sid accepts all praise given to him and doesn't bother to mention that he hasn't actually DONE anything civ-related since the early 90s.

This especially true with Civ 2, that is often voted as one of the very best games there is, and all Sid had to do with it was 2-hour briefing with the actual makers of the game, Brian Reynolds, J. Briggs and Douglas Kaufman. yet he still always remebers to accept all thanks directed at him.

And no, he isn't even a master designer who invented the Civ franchise, as it orginally started out as a computer Version of the Avalon Hill board game "Advanced Civilizations". When it comes to undeserved "glory", Sid Meier is the leech of the game industry.

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">It is superior in every aspect from our point of view. But there're many casual players who prefer simpler games. In dom2 you often have to really strain your brains to get anywhere. I (and I suppose most people here) find it a big part of fun, but I can understand many others who prefer to play quicker without putting too much effort. MoM and recently Civ3 and AOW2 cater to this kind of gaming much better. Not that you don't need to think there at all, but usually after establishing basic strategy, most of gameplay is kind of mechanical, which may be good or bad depending on the player's taste.

[ March 09, 2004, 00:07: Message edited by: alexti ]

The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

Well, actually, it's not that great. But it's after playing a game such as BattleCruiser3100 that you realize that the learning curve of Dom2 is far from being that bad. After 1 hour, I could play decently and hold my own against the ai. After 5 hours(interrupted by several crashes) of BC, I still havent figured out how to execute some simple basic tasks.

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

I know what you mean. Before purchasing Dominions 2 I made the mistake to buy Master of Orion 3. On the other hand, had Moo3 not been what it is I wouldn't have returned it, gotten my money back and been able to afford Dom2.

Not to shabby by three part time game developers to be able to create a game that thrumphs such a heavily hyped and funded game as the sequel of Master of Orion 2.

Perhaps Dominions 3, if such a project ever take place that is, will finally knock Master of Magic of the Fantasy Wargame Throne?

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">MoM, for its time, had better graphics and a diplomacy system (human and AI that is. And understandbly simple but again lets take into account the time it was released.)

Dom2 is wonderfully diverse but until those things are implemented at a comparable level i wouldn't put it over MoM quite yet.

that sid meier stuff re-excited me about 'Pirates of the burning sea'...i so hope its the Online equivalent of pirates. That is my all-time favorite game.

[ March 09, 2004, 02:09: Message edited by: djtool ]

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">He might not have done that much lately, but then he is also responsible for Pirates! and Railroad Tycoon, which make him worthy of all the glory he could ever want.

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Ah, Pirates. One of the great, classic oldies where the magic, to this day, has still not been recaptured in anything recent. Lots of wannabe-Pirates!, but there's still only one true Pirates!.

And you gotta love the name: "Pirates!". There's just something about the names of old that are so much better, elegant, more succinct and yet more descriptive than the names of today.

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

The April '04 issue of CG has an in-depth preview of the Pirates! 2 game currently in development, in which Sid is taking an active hand.


Tuna,

With regards to AC and Sid's role in it, I suggest you read Brian Reynolds' Designer's Notes for AC (page 236 of the game manual) which gives a detailed description of what portions of AC Sid was responsible for. And also read the credits page (p246). Before you spout opinions, it might help to actually know the facts. BTW, I've met both Sid and Brian, FWIW. If you knew them better than just what you're read in some slanted report you might actually give Sid some of the respect he deserves.

[ March 09, 2004, 12:38: Message edited by: Arryn ]

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">MoM, for its time, had better graphics and a diplomacy system (human and AI that is. And understandbly simple but again lets take into account the time it was released.)
[/QB]</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I played MOM Last week, and I noticed that the hero portraits and the battle graphics are actually superior to Dom2's - let alone Dom1.

The units are colourful, very well-drawn and despite the much lower resolution you get a better idea of what is going on (e.g. a paralysed unit turns grey. In Dom2 you have to guess why it is not moving).
And the global spell pix are funky! (Zombie Mastery anyone?).

Mom's map graphix are worse though; the AI cheats like nobody's business - and has to since it is braindead. GUI is perhaps a bit better than Dom's.

But the diplomacy is useless since the AI's all tend to be psycho's. 'We have the same outlook on life; we are both at war against the evil Shrraaa; you've paid tribute for the Last 10 turns. Of course, you know this means war. DIE!'.

Better to have no diplo to having useless diplo.

von Schmidt

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Paralyzed units turn gray in Dom2, also. Guess you haven't seen terribly many paralyzed units!

And Dominions II beats out MoM in one important aspect: People can be ON FIRE! That was totally awesome! How many games do you actually see people running around and fleeing the battlefield while ON FIRE?!?

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Yes, that is pretty, er, cool. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Speaking of "cool", it'd be neat to see the opposite effect, that of semi-frozen uints dripping icicles ...

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

Frozen units turn bluish.

[ March 10, 2004, 19:38: Message edited by: johan osterman ]

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

I still play MoM (I have an old Win98 disk partition just to re-play regularly MoM or other vintage games like fantasy general) and love it.
Aside from the obvious differences in screen resolution and world map, there are two graphical features I really miss in DOM 2, compared to MoM : the individualized portraits of heroes and the actual representation of *units* with multiple figures.
I am assuming that "one" ulm infantry little guy in the battle report is the abstraction of a squad or regiment or such (depending on the scale of the map), but actual representation of multiple figures in formation (like MoM did, even with the limited resolution and the very limited stack size) would help convey the feeling of "epic battles" (vs small skirmishes featuring a few dozen of people at most).

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

Kjeld: I must say I find your view a bit odd. IIRC MoM had a maximum of units a squad and 8 squads a stack. Maxing out ar something like 64 units. In dominions you can have hundreds or even thousands of units in the tactical battle. MoM gave me a much more skirmishy feel than dominions does.

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Why there's no pools of water when the heat radiating demon moves near the frozen unit? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: The inteface of Dom2 is great
 

Johan, I do completely agree (and thanks for the answer), but I think I didn't explain accurately what I really meant (english is not my primary language).

I didn't want to imply that MoM did give a more "large army" feeling than DoM2, but that using, for each single unit in DoM2 a representation like in MoM (allowing us to actually see a higher number of figures in formation per "unit") would be a nifty improvement. Hope it clears things a bit. In fact, I shouldn't have made a comparison with MoM : what I had in mind is more like MTW http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Well, after thinking twice about what I really wanted to mean, I think the problem is not so much with the number of individual units, but the absence of ordered units in formation. Pythium legions in ordered rank would be awesome http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Actually, it is more like a "wish list" suggestion than a real gripe with the awesome game.