How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

I have read many Posts singing the praises of a PoD as an SC and as an early-game expander. I would like to know how. Isn't he a little fragile to risk letting loose naked on Indy 6+? Even with backup?

Let's say you get two turns of research in and can have a level-1 path researched by turn 3, but not construction-2. So he gets trinkets. And the backing army of whatever nation. What do you do with him?

I am toying with the idea of a death4 air4 PoD, but only under the premise that he can dish out sufficient quantities of naughtiness very early game (<turn 10).

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I am not a veteran by any means but I use the PoD a fair amount. He isn't that 'tough', hp wise, in low dominion but his natural +10 fear aura (which is actually 13, due to the 3 death he starts with) is extremely effective against indies.

He also has a high defensive skill at 15 and, for a pretender, a decent starting protection of 12.

If you find him too fragile for your liking, you may want to give him combat spell paths that will help. There are other threads on how to build an SC but the short answer is that you can find a lot of early, useful spells packed into alt-2/3.

- Kel

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

1 lvl in Fire (for fire shield) or/and 1 lvl in Water (for the awesome quickness) will help a lot in early conquest.

Air too is useful due to mirror images and mistform.

Astral has body ethereal.

Yes you can send out him buffend and killing every indep.
I did that with an Arch-Mage ... a far more weaker chassis ... indep str 6.

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

Surely he can be used very effectively without rainbow-ing his paths? I too have wondered how to use him effectively within his theme.

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

Terror (with his aura if they get close) will help. Raise Skeletons/Dead could work. He has encumberance value of 0, so you can just give him the Black Full Plate. Plate will help him survive, and the Aura will hopefully make the independants to retreat. These are my guesses, I'm not very experienced with PoD.

Also, small theory I cooked up while writing:
Fear aura is most effective when he has many troops around him, so Boots of Behemoth with reinvigoration and dual-wielded Main Gauhces (def +6 each) would do wonders. That will take too much to help during the first turns, but it might be possible to dish him items in the field... All that is needed is low Earth, although lots of gems would be needed.

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

Yeah, Ulm can just forge the black steel full plate, perhaps a flaming one-handed sword, a bit later a charcoal shield, perhaps bracers, flaming helmet or whatever. It probably won't single-handly conquer the Jungle Temple, but it's pretty decent for not needing many paths.

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Sure. For one thing, you could forge him some armor and items, to make him more survivable. Toss on some black plate armor, maybe a shield and a helm (easily doable early game if you have the gems / mages).

Or - only use him against provinces with militia, light infantry, archers, etc, and set him to hold, hold, attack rear. Doing this in conjunction with a squad or two of regular troops helps ensure minimal casualties in your troops, while minimizing the likelihood of the PoD dying / getting maimed.

Or, research Enchantment 3 and use him to spam skeletons.

Otherwise - just like most pretenders, you have to add at least a path or two to really mazimize his combat use (and even forging / summoning abilities). Add a little Earth magic - his base armor improves, and he can cast Ironskin / Invulnerability. Add a little Water - Quickness and Breath of Winter, making him a much better killing machine. Air? Mirror Images and Mistform, not to mention the ability to later Cloud Trapeze to where he's needed. Fire - Fire Shield, and summoning skeleton archers later.

And I'm not sure it's "rainbowing" him to add a path or two. It certainly isn't as expensive to add paths to the PoD as it is some others such as Virtues and Dragons.

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">There are other, better pretenders (with more hp) if you want an early game, no magic pretender (Wyrm, for example). Every pretender does not surely have to fit every role.

- Kel

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Surely. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

In fact this was really my point. I play mostly SP these days and I like to have each game be distinctly different thematically, since the opponents certainly won't be pulling out many surprises or interesting variations.

I can't really get excited about a PoD w/ AAAEEWDDD who I'd use basically the same as a Cyclops for instance, albeit a flying undead summoning cyclops http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif . Its way more fun for me to try and use each pretender thematically in their own context.

So, despite my odd way of asking, my question was really....

How can you use a PoD effectively as an early combatant taking only Death? Or Maybe with One auxillary path. But staying within the roleplay/theme of the character and not just trying to amalgamize him into the archetypal SC. You know stuff that's fun and has flavor.

Thanks. I love this forum.

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">There are other, better pretenders (with more hp) if you want an early game, no magic pretender (Wyrm, for example). Every pretender does not surely have to fit every role.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Definately - but he wasn't asking about a no-magic pretender, but only about not having to rainbow the PoD. Starting with Death Magic skill of 3 is hardly no-magic. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

And of course, adding to the Death, taking it up to 5 or 6 or 9 is certainly an option for being able to use the more powerful death magics, with much less fatigue in combat.

But in my experience, I found that a PoD who sticks solely to death magic has to be used very carefully in the early game, else you wind up with a crippled PoD, which isn't much fun at all. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">If taking a couple paths is rainbowing, then yes, relative to that, it pretty much is no magic http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

- Kel

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">A personal favorite PoD is one with 4+ in Death and 3+ in Air (depending on what you are doing).

Personal expansion for him depends greatly on what initial equipment you can make. If you can make either A.) Ice Swords B.) Black Steel Armor he can be used for a fast expander.

If you don't have either of those, but have a starting spell (ala Terror, Raise Skeletons) you can also make a fast expander.

With this type of PoD you can choose one of two research paths.

Alt 2-3 (Mine is usually Turn 4 but depending on nation/scales)
Evo 2

Air Shield, Resist Lightning, Mirror Image (Mistform), Shock Wave.

Secondary:

Alt 2
Enc 3

Air Shield, Resist Lighting, Mirror Image, Raise Skeletons

With Terror: Turn 2 Expander.

Enc 1

Air Shield, Raise Skeleton, Terror, Raise Skeleton, Terror

With Raise Skeletons: Turn 2 Expander.
Air Shield, Raise Skeletons x4


Pretty simple, but very effective. I personaly don't use a PoD for "SC" role until I can get him some decent MR. But I will use him as a mass fearer/combat caster much earlier.

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">C'tis has an easy time with a heavy Death PoD because of Terror, but if you really mean melee here, you'd better look at Ulm, Arco (especially GE) , Machaka or Vanheim, who have the gems and the mages you need to equip your prentender with decent early items. Use him as a flying trampler, and get his PROT and DEF as high as you can.

Eventually your PoD will be loaded with tons of afflictions he'll probably never heal, but as long as you don't get Feeblemind or Mute, that's OK. A crippled, blind, one-arm PoD with lots of Death magic will still be very useful when you reach Conjuration 6 and Summon Ghosts - you get one more Ghost/level of Death magic, so a Death 9 PoD with a simple Skull Staff will summon 10 instead of 2, at no extra gem cost.

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

Hm, even though I dont use him for that, hordes of reanimated undead with enchantment 2 would come to my mind

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

Sorry doublepost

[ July 16, 2004, 12:09: Message edited by: PrinzMegaherz ]

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

Wtf tripplepost

[ July 16, 2004, 12:08: Message edited by: PrinzMegaherz ]

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">they are enchantment 3 unfortunately .
ermor has this spell preresearched though .
so for them a pod is good since he can summon 5 skelletons or a various number of 1-10 soulless ( random ) each combat turn .

another good candidate is ctis with terror preresearched .
together with your starting battalion with not too high indep settings terror + the damage from the javelins from your starting li is enough for most indies to get them routing from turn 1 .
this works at indeps 5 and most likely at indeps 7 only at indeps 9 it is a bit risky but can still work .

Re: How do you use the Prince of Death for very early game expansion?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Air/Death PoD was actually exactly my idea and my question in the original post. Unfortunately, it would not be Ctis or Ulm. (I usually like to diversify btw and not give my pretender high skills in paths my national mages get.)

Since a crippled PoD is not what I want by turn 6, I will still have to consider what to do....

thanks much!