Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

This game is REALLY REALLY hard and is REALLY REALLY under-documented... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

I have been trying to read all of the faq's, I have been trying to figure out this game myself, and I have been trying all I can with the demo... but I still dont really know how to play this game!! Could someone perhaps walk me through, in excrutiating detail, _ONE_ of the "main" strategies? Something that would work in the Demo, and help me, you know, win? Something that is working towards a greater sense of having a plan? I dont really know stuff like how to use units, much anything about magic, what sorts of things I should be trying to do at any given moment... please? Ive read stuff about you guys being able to play against a whole lot of AI's on impossible, and I'm struggling along on easy trying to figure out the mechanics. Why after a week, I just now figured out the "gold for defense" thing... I am really having a lot of trouble, and every existing faq or strategy guide seems to just suck... could someone help? I just need one thorough strategy, for one race, one sort of god, broken down for what i should be trying to do (in all areas) at any given turn...

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

http://www.maladjustite.com/dom2_walkthru.html

Will that do or did you have specific questions?

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

Uhm... Like I said, I've read all the faq's. including that one. that's the one I *started* with...

What I need is an in-depth strategy guide for what SORTS of things I should be going for at any given turn in order to win, with one specific god and one specific civ, including things like research, spellcasting, searching for magic sites, army setup, building and fort setup, etc. etc.

That isnt a very in-depth faq. it gives you more questions than answers. there has to be one simple way to win, for at least one narrow civ and god thats agreed on as a very workable strategy? something that tells me what i should be trying to achieve at any given moment?

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

Well, as in the demo you are limited both in time and in the amount of magic you can get your hands on...
High scales, especially those that give results immediately. Growth/Death is slow. Temperature is best left at the national preference (remember that it might not be 0!). Luck... depends. Production is probably nice as you will get more units and small income boost.

Take a strong, cheap pretender, like Wyrm. Take Order +3, Production +3, temperature depending on race, growth +1 if you need supplies (Jotunheim), else 0. Either best castle that is fast to build or one that provides most bonuses, that is Wizard's Tower/ Fortified City. If your race does not need many resources, consider 80 pt Castle and building more of them.

Consider Drain and Growth. Drain will slower your research, but demo will limit that any way. Growth lowers supplies, but other effects are (small reduction in population, small amount of tax loss) almost painless in 40 turns. If you have points (Ulm taking high drain, Jotun/Abysia/Machaka taking temperature scale(s)) give your Wyrm one point in Fire or two points in Water. Fire gives you Fire Shield (Enchantment 1), water Quickness (alteration 2) and Breath of Winter( enchantment 1).

Start game with small-ish map, few computer nation(s), and independents at 5. This will hopefully slow computers down more than you.

Wait for a turn, recrtuiting priest (holy 3 or 4) or mage and units of your choice. Hard to say more without knowing your race. Generally, go for high hitpoints and armor, but look at numbers too. 10 warriors with 10 hits and 13 prot. are better than 2 with 11/18. Research Enchantment if your Wyrm had magics, else you can not as you have no mages.

Host turn.

Look if there are any shortbows, druids/woodmen, militia/light infantry etc. "easy" provinces. Do NOT attack any provinces which have knights and/or longbowmen (always together but you might not see both), bloodhenge druid/dark vines, barbarian or other "hard" provinces.

Choose an easy province. Take your Wyrm. Conquer it. At the same time, consider if your "real" army is ready to try the same. You might lose your Wyrm and/or too many soldiers, but both should be strong enough if you choose your fights carefully.

When you start to have gold flowing in, build second fortress at a suitable province. Remember that the resources of that province are effectively doubled and that the fortress takes its admin-value % of resources from neighbouring provinces.
If you have (preferably cheap) nature mages and atleast 1 gem income:
Research Conjuration 1 for Vine men. Press 'M' and choose Vine Men as monthly ritual. If/when you get to Construction 2, forge Vine Crown and give it to your summoner. You get more vine men this way. If you have mage(s), search for nature sites at forests. Nature sites are most commonly found there.

With death mages, research Enchantment 1 and cast Reanimation. Be careful about priests. If you are Jotunheim, remember that you can get undead GIANTS! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif C'tis gets undead lizards. Search for sites at provinces that have more Death scale than normal, but remember that computer might have taken some even if you didn't.

Else, research Evocation for elemental/astral attack spells or Construction for items. Nice items to give to your Wyrm at Construction 2:
1S: Pendant of Luck (50% of hits/arrows/spells negated), 1E: Black Steel helmet, 1D: Horror Helmet, 1N: Horned Helmet, 2A: Amulet of Missile Protection, 1E:Bracers of Protection, 2N: Cat charm.
Constr. 4:
E1: Girdle of Might, S1: Amulet of Antimagic, 3A: Flying Carpet, 2A: Dancing Trident, 2N: Ring of Regeneration/ Amulet of Resilience/ Lycanthropos' Amulet. The Last one only if you have no magics, berserk prevents spellcasting and the L's amulet automagically makes him berserk.

If you are Arcoschepale and your Wyrm gets a nasty battle affliction, use your Priestess to heal it. With other nations, no luck. If you have no magics killing him and calling back might heal some of them, though. If you have, death taxes magics so it is not a good idea.

At some point, either the computer will trash you, you hit the time limit or you will win. You might be the (almost) sure winner when you hit the limit even if you weren't able to finish your opponents. Count them as wins. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

Too many variables, even creating your Pretender can be a huge exercise. I don't believe there is a sure fire strategy guide for any single race, and really, what would be the fun in that.

As a relative newbie myself who struggled understanding the demo (which included putting it down for a couple of months because I couldn't even figure out how to research), it took me several tries to figure things out before I began to understand and bought the game (which is well worth it).

I found the best source of information to be these forums, either through the search function or by casual reading.

The forums also sold me on the game when I uncovered the unlimited possibilities that exist and number of variables in the play. I imagine this is a difficult game to master, so I don't think there is a single strategy that can be applied. Even who your neighbors are on Turn 1 may influence which strategy you take.

But then again, I'm just a n00b at this who is playing his first non-demo game against the AI (as Ulm).

Krool

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

play Ulm
play against ctis, man, and pangaea
play the aran map
change the independents setting for the game to 5
hire mercenarys the first turn
do NOT attack anyone on the first turn
on turn 2 use the i buton (info) to see who your neighbors are
do NOT attack anyone that has knights or heavy cavalry

That should get you started. Any questions so far? About why I made those particular suggestions?

[ July 21, 2004, 22:16: Message edited by: Gandalf Parker ]

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

The problem with Dom2 (and the great thing) is that there are no "winning strategys". You can win with any nation. What will decide if you kick tail isnt what nation and strategy. Its finding the nation/pretender/scales that will let you play YOUR STYLE the best. Ulm is armored tanks. Arcosphale is magic. Pangaea is sneak. Jotunheim is defense. Ermor is the mindless swarm. All of those are stereotypes with alot of variation possible but you get the idea.

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

The one I posted is simply a simple strategy balanced towards aggressive early expansion. I tested it myself, it went nicely until I forgot that T'ien C'hi has those awesome infantrymen with Glaives. Something like a halberd, but even worse: 10 (!) damage on the top of the normal strength of ten, and my W2F2 Wyrm with Quickness, Breath of Winter AND Fire Shield was quickly slaughtered. He still has enough magics for Quickness/ Fire Shield. I played Ulm and took Order 3, Productivity 3 and Drain 3, dominion of about 6, 4 opponents on Sundering.

If you lose your pretender, remember that you can still fare well. As in my case: not every Ulm has Sages (? + research bonus) and Sorceresses (2A2S and ? in sorcery).

Also, use mercenaries. 'B'id for them and give few spare coins, even small amounts of gold help them to decide if computer player tries to hire them at the same turn. Don't order them on suicide run before the turn during which they would leave you (1 turn left on bid list).

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Don't? You mean *DO*, right? If you're not planning to, or able to, afford to rehire them, you should go ahead and deny them to your opponents as well. Or at least kill them down to the Last commander, as the AI will happily hire an entirely depleted mercenary group consisting of a single commander. Don't forget to give him something nice, like a Bane Venom Charm.

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Don't? You mean *DO*, right? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">*Before* the turn they are leaving... I want to get as much as possible from them.

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">While this is true of "official" documentation, there are plenty of fan-created docs that will help you. May I suggest the following:

1. Download the various docs I have available on my site.
2. Follow the links I have on my site to other sites and download the docs you may find there (notably, the stuff on Sunray's site regarding playing various nations).
3. Read the AARs (After-Action Reports) for various nations that are to be found on this forum.

Once you've done all this homework you may find that most (if not all) of your questions have been answered. The forum's SEARCH feature is also useful ...

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">There is no such thing. Even concentrating on how to play just one (of 17) nations, strategies can (and do) change dramatically depending on the map you choose, the strength of independents, where on the map you begin, etc. Oh, and strategies that work against AIs may fail miserably versus human opponents.

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

A simple way to win against AI is with Ermor Ashen empire. Take a ghost king. Take full negative scales on everything, except luck and magic. Take 10 dominion. Give your ghost king a bit of every kind of magic minus blood or 4 in nature. Just make some bischops, have them reanimate warriors and keep attacking. Have your ghost king search each province.

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">There is no such thing. Even concentrating on how to play just one (of 17) nations, strategies can (and do) change dramatically depending on the map you choose, the strength of independents, where on the map you begin, etc. Oh, and strategies that work against AIs may fail miserably versus human opponents. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">What I meant was, "Give me a good simple, win-in-40-turns strategy, controlling all possible variables, which will help me to understand various parts of the game as possible with the demo."

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

We can try but how do you play? If you tend to mass armies and charge in like berserker then it will be very different than if you prefer to use scouts and sneaking armies. I REALLY dont want to insult you or anything but this game isnt for everyone. Some people prefer arcade games where the path is obvious and you just keep trying it till you get past it. Some people like games like chess where all the pieces are equal on both sides and its only who uses the best strategy. This game is well designed for people who really REALLY prefer to come up with their own strategys and tactics. Lots of choices about nation, pretender, equipment, tactics. Some of us have had it over a year and are still finding new tactics. The problem it causes is that we can give you what works for us but there is no gaurantee it will work for you. The game is balanced pretty well that way. Personally, I prefer playing Man or Pangaea in sneak-army mode but my tactics fail horribly for other people.

My suggestion was Ulm because its the lowest learning curve. Its armored units with resistance to magic scale. You build armies and attack. I suggested man, ctis, and pangaea as opponents because the computer AI doesnt play them very well. Do not put Ermor, water nations, caelum, or abyssia in as opponents because explaining what to do when you meet them is a whole new subject. I recommended turning up independents because even though it seems harder for you to beat them, you will do better than the computer. If you have independents at the default of 3 or lower then the AI's will swarm you way too soon. If you play Ulm then you can stand some help in the area of food, archers, and flyers. That means its good to attack provinces that say it has druids, jade amazons, raptors, and any archer types.

[ July 22, 2004, 01:44: Message edited by: Gandalf Parker ]

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

Coud someone help me with setting custom orders? I dont understand how to script orders for a battle, and I dont know much about setting repeating orders every month, or other things like that. thanks.

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

Gavin I would like to help you, but I really can't. There is no easy way to win the game in a demo unless you take the time to learn the dynamics of the game which are hard to teach.

Post your Nation, Your Pretender, your Theme, and your Scales and I and many others will be able to help you muster together army, setting mages, and pointing you in a research direction.

Edit: Spelling.

[ July 22, 2004, 03:46: Message edited by: Zen ]

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

I've been playing the game for about 1 week now. I've won a couple now (well won one, the other I was realloy dominating by turn 40).

I don't use my god for combat at all, basically. I generally will use a crappy human pick. Give them at least 3 in water, death and nature. All that they will be used for is searching for these shrines. Add 3 to cold, and select Niefenhelm. Raise dominion up to at least 6, select (probably) Castle as your fortificatation type, and use the other picks how you like.

Create a new game. Change starting provinces to 3 or so, special sites to 75, intedependent strength to 5 or so, everything else the same.

Therefore, using Jotunhelm, with Niefenhelm. First turn, grab a Gygja or perhaps a Skratti for research. Contiue adding these for research, I generally end up on turn 40 with about 8-10. Research conjuration until you get to at least level 3. Then you should be able to revive Banes and Wights with at least a couple of your Gygjas. If you can't (you need 2 death), give one or two of them empowerment up to 2 death. Revive a Bane, then repeatedly revive wights (shift-M). You could also research to level 4, empower to 3 death, and summon shade beasts too, but it's not necessary.
Also, empower your Skratti(s) to water 2 if you don't have one, and cast summon ice drake repeatedly with them. When you have enough Nature gems empower a Skratti up to 3 (or you have a lucky Skratti with 3 nature already), and repeatedly summon pride of lions.

I generally just produce Jotun Godes as commanders (Priest level 3, leadership 25), and Jotun Axemen or Jotun woodsmen as troops. When you have enough money, go for Niefel Jarls and Niefel Giants if you like. Just carry on producing as much as you can afford, you should be able to get 3 or 4 or more axemen every turn, just do this every turn, because resources are your limiting factor generally, not gold.

Just carry on attacking easy neighbouring provinces, especially those with decent incomes. Your god should be just wandering around, searching for magic sites, and after a while you should be able to start summoning (see top). Basically, don't attack anything you think you might lose.

This is just the tactic I use, I've only been playing the demo for a week or so, so I've no idea how this tactic would play in a longer game, but it seems to work pretty well for me now. Anyway, good luck http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif .

[ July 22, 2004, 06:18: Message edited by: Smauler ]

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

Another fairly easy tactic should be Abyssia (default theme) with a Moloch fire-9 pretender. Just build Anathament Dragons (level 4 priests), lava warriors (their sacred, berzerking, 2-flail-using troops) and heavy infantry. Don't include Ulm among the AI opponents.

Lead your armies with Dragons, have them bless the lava warriors, and watch them buzzsaw their way through virtually any opposition. Research evocation magic so that the Dragons can help out the troops with fire spells. Once you get up to the more powerful spells (falling fires was the great one, I think) the Dragons will be able to wipe out whole squads on their own, and the Moloch will be an army-murdering death machine. You'll hardly even need the lava warriors at that point.

This was how I won (well, almost. I'd wiped out everyone but Pangea and had them down to just a couple provinces by the time I hit the turn limit) my first demo game.

[ July 22, 2004, 06:31: Message edited by: Sindai ]

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">For short games, I'd recommend Jarls. Godes are too expensive unless your strategy is dominion spread (very hard in short games) or blessing sacred troops (not recommended to use with Smauler's pretender magic picks).

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I recommend Jotun Spearmen (or the spear-carrying Hirdmen) over Axemen. The longer length of the spear is very effective for repels, which means your troops tend to get fewer wounds and live longer. Axes do more damage, but I prefer every edge in favor of troop defense. Woodsmen are a poor choice in bang-for-the-buck, unless you are playing a bless strategy. They are quite fragile, compared to other choices, and expensive.

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">You would probably be be much better off to forge skull staffs, at a cost of only 10 death gems, rather than empowering at a much larger cost.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Skratti come with water 2 already, so they don't need any enhancement for ice drakes.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">A Gygja with nature 2 would be a far better choice, since she can forge a thistle mace to bring herself to nature 3.

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">For short games, I'd recommend Jarls. Godes are too expensive unless your strategy is dominion spread (very hard in short games) or blessing sacred troops (not recommended to use with Smauler's pretender magic picks).</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Jarls are 34 resources though, as opposed to 18, so if you're resource as opposed to gold limited, they may not be the best option. If you're short of gold though, they are cheaper. I realise blessing's pretty useless with those magic picks (ps. I saw a list of bless effects, but can't seem to find it now, do you know where it is?).

Quote:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Jotun Axemen or Jotun woodsmen as troops.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I recommend Jotun Spearmen (or the spear-carrying Hirdmen) over Axemen. The longer length of the spear is very effective for repels, which means your troops tend to get fewer wounds and live longer. Axes do more damage, but I prefer every edge in favor of troop defense.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I'll probably give them a try next turn, sound good. I just went for axemen before because of their higher damage.

Quote:

Woodsmen are a poor choice in bang-for-the-buck, unless you are playing a bless strategy. They are quite fragile, compared to other choices, and expensive.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Yes, I realise this. I only use them if I find resources to be a problem. In my Last game, I could recruit 6 woodsmen and two axemen in one turn, as opposed to just four axemen. But if gold is a problem at all, they're not really worth it.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">You would probably be be much better off to forge skull staffs, at a cost of only 10 death gems, rather than empowering at a much larger cost.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I haven't got into forging yet (I haven't been playing too long), but I can't see the skull staves in the forging menu. Is there something I'm missing, or does the demo just not have them?

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Skratti come with water 2 already, so they don't need any enhancement for ice drakes.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Oh yeah, missed that. I thought for some reason they only came with 1, but got a random to two.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">A Gygja with nature 2 would be a far better choice, since she can forge a thistle mace to bring herself to nature 3.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Oops, yes I meant Gygia, typo. I can't see the mace in the forging menu either though, perhaps it is just a demo limitation.

Anyway, thanks for all the points and suggestions. I'll take them into account when playing my next Jotunhelm, though I'm going to try some other races a bit more first, while waiting for my full game to arrive (ordered monday morning, but I'm in England, and chose cheapest postage, only $4 as opposed to $15+ for the others. I can but hope it'll come tomorrow for the weekend http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif ).

I know I've screwed up the boldness in this post, but it's still obvious who's post is whos, if not, I'll edit.

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

Gavinfox,

May I suggest that you forget about winning the first game or two? If you are really having a hard time with the game mechanics, focus on learning the mechanics rather than winning the game. For example, if you just figured out paying gold for provincial defense, all the fancy bless strategies and scales are not going to help you right now. Spend some time clicking on different things, try stuff out and experiment. Yes, you will make mistakes and lose, but you will learn the game. Play 20 turns, then start again with the same god. Play 20 more, then start again with another god.

Give that a try once or twice, then come back and try to win. You will understand the basics much more and will be in a position to try the fancy stuff. No offense to the others, but some of the suggestions are telling you how to run when you are still learning to walk.

Gandalf's suggestions are solid and his point that this game is not for everyone is very valid. I hope you are one of us, as it is an amazing game, but sometimes people are not into it. Give it a shot, we hope you stay!

Good luck!

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">How to play the flute in 2 easy steps (by Monty Python)
1. Blow into the mouthpiece
2. Move your fingers over the keys so as to produce beautiful music.

But seriously, you are asking a bit much.

Many people here have already given you very good tips. There *ARE* some good threads on this board directed to exactly the *type* of questions you want answered (although no one will be able to tell you exactly how to control all the variables and win in 40 turns).
Here is one I started for just this purpose:

http://www.shrapnelgames.com/cgi-bin...=001728#000000

There is a slight discrepancy being *knowing* the truth-value of certain propositions (e.g. I know that it is better to purchase mercs under conditions ABC than PQR if the price is XYZ and the turn is between 10 and 22), and *being able to* carry out certain actions based on these propositions. (That is why I can explain to you perfectly well how to drive a car or ski that slope, but that doesn't mean you can do so just by listening to me.) This is one of the oldest pedagogical problems of the universe. (And yes, the game is not sufficiently documented even with this in mind, which is odd, considering that *teachers* made the game.)

You will need to ask very specific questions to specific problems, otherwise the answers you will get will be unsatisfactory to you (how to play the flute).

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Wasn't that Shakespeare? In Hamlet? I believe it was Hamlet speaking to Rosenkrans and the other guy...

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Yes, I realise this. I only use them if I find resources to be a problem. In my Last game, I could recruit 6 woodsmen and two axemen in one turn, as opposed to just four axemen. But if gold is a problem at all, they're not really worth it.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Jotunheim will always be resource-limited. But, IMO, a key to playing Jotuns is building quality troops, not quantity. Jotunheim doesn't really have cheap troops (resource-wise), nor cheap enough to be treated as fodder. So if you aren't going to build fodder, then make sure that each trooper counts. Jotuns are kind of like an entire army of elites that crush with disdain anything that gets in their way. The only things you have to be concerned with are knights (and heavy cavalry), Ulms, and anyone that can swarm you at 4:1+ odds (beware of Ermor).

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

Well it looks like I'll be learning this game with Jotun and a Wyrm...

A question, do you need to have troops in a stack for a Wyrm to conquer a province by himself? (Ie, just put them in the back?)

PS, does anyone know where I can get a non-2.08 Version of the demo so Utgard will work right? Thanks!

[ July 22, 2004, 14:50: Message edited by: Gavinfox ]

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">You have to research construction magic to level 4 in order to forge both skull staves and thistle maces. The magic item quick reference that is available on the main page is a good reference for what each item does.

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">What do you mean "troops in a stak for the wyrm to conquer a province by himself"? That seems directly contradictory. You don't need any troops with the wyrm to occupy the province. It beats the defending indigenous defenders and the province is yours.

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">The Version available for download from Shrapnel's page is about 4 Versions behind the current one. I'd recommend getting it from my site at this link.

EDIT: if you visit my site, go ahead and grab the other downloadable docs which I host while you're there. You'll be glad you did.

[ July 22, 2004, 15:40: Message edited by: Arryn ]

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

There will actually be a new one out shortly, too. I just have to pdf it.

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Heh. I'll believe it when I see it in my email inbox. Zen's been promising me it (along with others) for weeks. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

The reason I list Jotun as a good choice for people who play defensively is this...

People who picture rampaging armies of giant warrors arent likely to make it happen. The gold, resources, and feeding of such an army makes it nearly impossible.

Jotun has the best defense in the game. To withstand the "Call of the Winds" attacks from Caelum and "Call of the Wild" attacks from Man I tend to need a defense of 11 for most nations. Just buying a defense of 6 is pretty solid with jotun.

For those reasons and many others Jotun seems to work well if you use the giants for close to the capital or support/backup (like a few giants likely mixed into a squad of other troops). Then count on provincial troops and mercs to do most of your fighting (in my humble opinion)

[ July 22, 2004, 17:03: Message edited by: Gandalf Parker ]

Re: Help, read all the faqs, playing demo, dont know how to PLAY...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Other (non-national) troops that Jotun may hire (except mercs) tend to be decidedly inferior and not worth it on a bang-fer-buck basis. A different strategy that conserves Jotuns as the 'elite' backbone of an army is to use summoned creatures for fodder (I like Vine Ogres for this, as well as Bane Lords for SCs), and save your gold/resources strictly for Jotuns. Works for me. But, of course, there are many ways to win, and whatever one feels comfortable with is fine.