My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

After purchasing and playing dominions 2 for the first time a few months ago and realizing that it was exactly what i'd been waiting for without knowing it for quite some time, i've gone on a bit of a glut buying shrapnel games. Maybe its just me, but i actually appreciate, even prefer the spartan graphics of Dominions. Once games get drawn into the graphics craze it inevitably leads to less depth in preference to graphical glitz. But i digress; Since buying dominions i've bought SE4, SE4: Starfury, and i recently purchased TWE but it hasnt arrived yet. I personally have had more fun or see more potential in these 4 games than i have in any of the half dozen decent but high powered games i've bought over the Last several years. I Beat Starfury, which was lacking a little depth, but i still found quite fun when i was looking for less intellectual gameplay. I tested the waters of SE4 but after playing it a few times I quickly realized that in order to do it justice i'd have to jump in, full immersion. Something i just couldnt do to my dominions addiction quite yet. Anyway, i ordered TWE hoping for a fun tactical game that doesnt require the balance of my faculties to learn and have fun with, but ready to take whatever i get. I think the Last time i had this level of satisfaction with the games i've bought was probably Halo. If dominions had half the publicity of some of these other games i firmly believe it would do extremely well, i think far more people than these big gaming companies realize put the stock of depth at least equal to graphics. Are there any other like-minded independant publishers/games out there that i might not have heard of?

[ July 22, 2004, 20:22: Message edited by: Cheezeninja ]

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">What genre(s), please?

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

Spiderweb Software (www.spiderwebsoftware.com) is a very well regarded indie - about 10 games, I think mostly turn-based, multi characters RPGs. One great thing about them is that you can download demos for any / all of the games, and the demos tend to allow about 1/3 of the game to be played through.

There's also a Bards Tale remake out there now called Devil Whiskey, and the Angband variants can be a lot of fun.

And, mmm, you might be able to find a nifty text-based SF 4X game called Anacreon. Which, wow! Doing a quick search via Google reveals that after 15 years, it's been rewritten for Windows, with graphics and a GUI and improvements.

Hmm - maybe I have a diVersion from Dominions for a while now. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

Might also look at HPS Simulations, Ambrosia software, Matrix games, and the free text-based Dungeon Crawl.

Oh and I second Spiderweb Software - good RPG's with tactical combat offering depth and options generally not found in most others.

PvK

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Matrix is a great indie publisher, but be wary of some of the titles. Especially any games that Gary Grigsby's been involved with. They're obtuse, buggy as hell, and their forums are full of fanboys. (For example, Uncommon Valor.)

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">What genre(s), please? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Any except puzzle games i suppose.

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

I would propose battle for wesnoth, it's totally free, and still in developement, has a fast learn curves but is still quite complicated and has some depth.

Skolem

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Matrix is a great indie publisher, but be wary of some of the titles. Especially any games that Gary Grigsby's been involved with. They're obtuse, buggy as hell, and their forums are full of fanboys. (For example, Uncommon Valor.) </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Ya I would look for external opinions of their specific titles, but they have some interesting ones. I think they tend to shun demos, though, which can make it hard to judge. There was one RTS about the normandy invasion developed by a Mexican team that was pretty terrible, but some others are quite good in their niche, such as Korsun Pocket (that specific niche being operational-level wargame about one battle with lots of detail and complexity). I'm currently interested in their most recent Pacific War and Starshatter games, but am waiting for the full reviews to appear at The Wargamer and elsewhere.

PvK

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Korsun Pocket is good. Be warned that Pacific War is by the same developer as Uncommon Valor, and appears to use the same engine. (The engine's okay; the developer isn't. IMO.)

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

Shrapnel has other "retro" feel games. Space HoRSE (a remake of M.U.L.E.) and Dungeon Oddyssey and Interstellar trader are all games I enjoy. None of them are as deep as Dom2 or SEIV, nor as wide-open potential as TWE, but they still live on my computer (longer than any recent "shelfware" game).

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">After long time playing Japan RPG on PS I'd like to buy an RPG on PC. Being a DOM2 addicted, is very important for me the advice of other DOM2 loving palyers.
I've through the "What other games do you play" thread to make some ideas about good rpg, and the usual popular titles are coming out: NWN, Morr, BG, Diablo etc. Surely very good products with some good points and some flaws each. Surely products with money on great graphics and marketing.
But I'm not a high quality graphics fan, apart JRPG I played and loved NetHack, Adom, Dom2, SEIVG etc. I love depth.
So, can you tell me if the SpiderWeb rpg have more depth than the cited classics? Is the comparing a no mathc like Dom2 vs AoW (a pretty game suddenly becoming a mediocre product after you put hands on the unknown Dom2)

Thank you

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

Spiderweb published the Avernum series (formerly known as Exile), and Avernum III is a really, really good game that feels very open ended due to the huge world. The storyline is also pretty good, and the game gets fiendishly difficult but very interesting towards the end.

I also really like the "do as thou wilt" way of character development in Spiderweb rpgs, and the way that in battle, tactics are much more important than dicing luck, especially in dungeons and similar places.

However, the graphics are outdated and the interface takes some time to become second nature, but maybe that's just me.

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">After long time playing Japan RPG on PS I'd like to buy an RPG on PC. Being a DOM2 addicted, is very important for me the advice of other DOM2 loving palyers.
I've through the "What other games do you play" thread to make some ideas about good rpg, and the usual popular titles are coming out: NWN, Morr, BG, Diablo etc. Surely very good products with some good points and some flaws each. Surely products with money on great graphics and marketing.
But I'm not a high quality graphics fan, apart JRPG I played and loved NetHack, Adom, Dom2, SEIVG etc. I love depth.
So, can you tell me if the SpiderWeb rpg have more depth than the cited classics? Is the comparing a no mathc like Dom2 vs AoW (a pretty game suddenly becoming a mediocre product after you put hands on the unknown Dom2)
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">The Spiderweb RPGs tend to have some real RP in them, unlike, say, Diablo2 (which I confess I've played thousands of hours of). Different factions, plot lines, quests that actually make a difference.

Definately better in terms of depth than MorrowWind, the original Baldur's Gate, and the like. But you don't need to try too hard for people's opinions with these ones - just download one of the demos and give it a spin. The demos aren't crippleware - 1/3 to 1/2 the game is right there to play, no turn limits, no magic research limits. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

They're no graphical wonderland, albeit I think the later ones especially have serviceable art, but - without fancy graphics, the guy has made a living doing indie RPGs for ten years or so.

But give 'em a try - I had my issues with the early ones, in particular inventory management could be a pain. Everyone has different pain thresholds for things like that though, and the later ones may have improved the UI.

(Oh - while I never finished them ( the only RPG I can recall finishing was Wizardry 1 and Bard's Tale 1 ), Baldur's Gate 2 and even more so, Planescape Torment were, imo, pretty damn good RPGs given the handicap of using the AD&D rules.)

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">WitP is the best PTO sim I've played, actually.

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Considering how few PTO sims there are, that isn't saying anything of significance. If MOO3 were the only space 4X game in existence it would still suck, even if one could say (biting one's tongue) that it was (by default only) the "best" space 4X. Ugh.

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Considering how few PTO sims there are, that isn't saying anything of significance. If MOO3 were the only space 4X game in existence it would still suck, even if one could say (biting one's tongue) that it was (by default only) the "best" space 4X. Ugh. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Heh. What I mean to say is that not only is it the best PTO sim I've played, it is also a deeply enjoyable game.

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

I'd definitely recommend trying demos of Spiderweb's games to see if you like them. I haven't tried BG2 yet, but I have seen Diablo and Morrowind and would say they are all different genres and have different strengths, but Avernum III had some very good stuff that I liked a lot better than Diablo and Morrowind. The comparison was a bit like Dominions vs. AOW in that the combat system seemed much more sensible and tactics-oriented, and I liked the details and freedom of action and potential to do different things. The character dialogs are not like many CRPGs where you are just reading a bunch of dialog and have no real choices to make. In Avernum, your choices of what to say and ask often had effects on what happened, who your allies were, events and so on.

PvK

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

i would try steel panthers waw from matrix games it is freeware and the nicest ww 2 turn based game i know .
i would further try steel panthers mbt and steel panthers ww2 both freeware too and they can now be found here on the shrapnelsite .

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

I would recommend galactic civilizations as well. (www.galciv.com) Its a lot simpler than se4 (you can only play as the humans, though how you want to make those humans, pacifists, techies, or war gods is all up to you) but the ai for the other races and the game world are very very well done.

Re: My recent addiction to shrapnel games.
 

I would recommend you to try: Ishar I + II + III. They are old dos games so you have to run dosbots or alike if you are on XP. I's used many hours on them when they came out http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
I think the company behind it is called 'Silirias' or something, dunno if they exist anymore.


best regards
Thilock