OT: You Know I Hate
 

I hate games like Freelancer where they make it so that it is not an ejoyable game. They make it so that the fun is sucked out of the game when you come acrossed a level that is hopelessly unbeatable. Like for instant the Race level. I simply hate the fact that I have now played that level 20 times, and have lost 20 times. When you loose, it is as if you died. You have to redo the level. At this point I normally just uninstall the game in disgust.

After loosing 20 strait turns, I think that it would be best to uninstall the GD game and break the disk into small finite peaces, place those peaces into an evelope and send that envelope to MS with explicited instructions on where to place it.

I will read a walk through to see if I am missing something, but the truth is, even if I have, it will be a long time before I play this game again.

The same thing happened in Diablo II. I played it for days until I ran into one boss that no matter what I did, I could not kill. That sucked the fun right out of the game. UNINSTALLED.

KOTOR - Borning as hell. I paid good money for it and found it to be so boring that I actually fell asleep while playing. How could a game as borning as this win game of the year? - UNINSTALLED

Tribes Vengeance. I paid good money for this game, while the SP is not all the difficult, it does get horridly repetative, the same thing with DOOM 3. Although I still have T:V on my system, I did uninstall DOOM3.

DOOM3 was in a nut shell very repetative with little or no pay off. It was the most borning, unthrilling game I have ever played. The orginal DOOM, despite its graphics, was the better game by far.

DeuEx Ivinisible War - Fun to a point, but I lost interest. What can I say, it happens.

Civ III - Just a horrid game. Horrid horrid horrid. When a musket man can beat a tank, time to uninstall. (I am sure with mods this balance issue has been fixed, but I have no intention of pulluting my HD with a re-install.)

Far Cry - Simply a brillant and fun game to play. However, no decent mods, horrid MP, and very few maps. After the SP game is over, there is not much left to do but cheat. You fly around the map sniping people form unhigh.

Dominions II - A very interesting and addictive game that burns you out with micro-management. This game could benefit from implmentation of some basic concepts for construction, unit, and province management.

Half Life II - Nice looking game, but two short and to spendy for my blood. Not interested.

Star Wars Galaxies - [insert]SHUDDER[/insert] After a long day of working, the Last thing I want to do is come home and log onto a game that is nothing more than a second job.

Now I am sure some opinions will vary when compared to mine, thats ok, there are pros and cons to any game, and I accept that. I just hate it when the game becomes un-enjoyable.

No game should do that. Game developers have to realize that when a game becomes work, then it is no longer fun. With the exception of SEIV. Modding SEIV is as much fun, despite its time consuming process, as the game its self.

I am serious surprised that Aaron has not received an offical industry award for SEIV.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

Out of those 2 I have only played KOTOR and SWG. KOTOR I played for awhile but then I stopped playing. I didn't have anything against it per se I just realised after a while that when I had nothing to do I didn't feel like playing KOTOR. Either that or when someone I know upgraded my system he wiped the game and I havn't felt the desire to reinstall and start again. Same thing happened with SWG. I spent months making money by logging on every few days to maintain all my facilities. One day I packed up all my facilities to move to another planet. No longer needing to maintain my facilities I never had a reason to return.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

I think this happened to a lot of people with SWG and a few that I know of for KOTOR. Great game concepts, but they loose ones interest over the long term.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

Its not so much that I hate them but I do get depressed that I lose interest.

SWG. Waited for years and even bought a new computer 2 years before it came out so I could play it (this was before they kept delaying it) and upgraded my system again when it arrived. All that anticipation and expense and I lose interest after 2-3 months. The expense isn't so bad, i've been able to enjoy lots of other good games.

KOTOR. Heard great things about it. Asked for it as a Christmass present. Lost interest. Its like I feel I should bother to start playing it again and finish it just so I didn't waste all that interest and money.

MOO3. Spent money buying it and became MOO after second game. Stopped wasting my time, but a waste of money none the less. Don't feel so bad about this one since I have learned it is common opinion it was a %@#%@. So not my fault http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

I found KotOR to be very well done and enjoyed it very much, but unfortuantely it has ZERO reply value. (the fact that it took me 4 days to complete the game means that it fell way short on the 'value' meter. Diablo 2 was a nice game, but you soon realized that the SP aspect of the game sucked. Finding sets and certain rare items was virtually impossible. In the end I lowered myself to using the D2++ mod almost exclusively. and that took much of the fun out of the game.

Many games that I bought in the past few years were very good, but fell short in the replay department. such titles as Far Cry, MoHAA, Deus Ex and KotOR were one shot pass through games. once completed, they left litle or no reason to replay.

Anyhow, that's my 2 cents.

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

You finished KOTOR in 4 days http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif. I played for weeks and when i stopped had only just got off the first planet. When I stopped it wasn't a case of "I'm not going to waste anymore time on this", more that I finished one day intending to return and never got around to it.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

I don't hate the games, well with the exception of Civ III and SWG.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

Games like SimCity 4 Rush Hour, SEIV, BOTF, Tribes, and a few other ones that I still enjoy playing, are examples of games done well. Lots of replay time, and modding fun.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

<font color="brown"> I am going to come out and say it. F***ING Freelance is a GD POS FU game if ever there was one. HORRID controls, horrid game physics, and just out right a complete POS TRASH FRELLED game!!!!!!!!!!!

Scale of 1 to 10 I give this POS a -7 GD MF game just PMO!!!!! </font>

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

Isn't this what demos and *ahem* "extended demos" are for? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

I have to say, most of the games out there these days fall seriously short in the reply value department. I absolutely loved KOTOR (aside from the space battles, those were just a pain!), and it took me about 6 weeks to get through the whole thing (keeping in mind I don't have a lot of time for gaming these days). A couple days after I finished it, I loaded up a new game as a different character class and started playing again. I barely made it through the introductory sequence before switching off to do something else. There just wasn't any desire there to keep going.
Now take a game like Baldur's Gate II. I must have played that one through a dozen times as various character classes, because the game is actually different depending on what kind of character you play. Add the fact that the game was so massive there was just so much to do that you're bound to miss half of it your first time through, making each replay a fresh experience.
A lot of the problem with many games is that reviewers tend to praise games that take a large number of hours to complete, while reacting negatively to games that can be finished quickly. Which is fair, since if I'm shelling out money for a game, I want as much value for money as I can get. The problem arises in that many developers, instead of making large, rich, intriguing worlds that we can spend hours exploring, just make their games really, really hard, therefore you will spend a long time getting through them for the simple fact that you'll die so much.
Which is not fun. I think something that developers need to realize is that they make computer GAMES and the deffinition of a game, according to the dictionary is "An activity providing entertainment or amusement" (italics mine). ie: Fun.
Dying 20 times trying to complete a level is not fun. Heck, playing the same level 20 times for any reason, is not fun. Frankly, I would rather play a game that I finish in 2 days that is fun and enjoyable than I would spending 20 days slogging through a game that is just pointlessly hard.

Oh, and Atrocities, if you're refering to the Freelancer level where you have to flee to a jumpgate with half a bloody fleet after you, the only way I managed it was by cheating.
Pop open the PerfOptions.ini file located in your Freelancer game folder and change the following line:
DIFFICULTY_SCALE = 1.00
to
DIFFICULTY_SCALE = 0.0
Which will make you invincible. The difficulty scale is basically what percentage of their normal power enemy weapons do to you, so 1.00 would be 100%, 0.50 would be 50% and so forth. I personally ended up putting it at 0.30 and found the game still challenging enough to be fun, without having the joy sucked out of it by being pointlessly hard or too easy.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

Actually, I loved Freelancer. Had no trubble with it at all, and overall, give it a 10-out-of-10. If you want, I could tell you exactly what to do with that race level. (In dublin, or something. Beat it the first try.) Email me at karatekid88@bellsouth.net, and I can tell you you are surely doing something horribly wrong, cuz that game is awsome. Best mod-able game I've ever seen to. Far better as far as modability and mod selection then this game, and BF1942. (and in response to the cheater, I actually need difficulty mods to make it fun, or play Online. Wich is a bLast! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif Not sure whats wrong with you guys... but Freelancer is NOT hard. And no, he's talking about a different level.one where you actually race through gates against some dude.)

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

I am using a mod now. The mod made several improvements to the game thus far. I had to restart the game though. I hope to beat the hell out the guy when I get back to that level.

I know the cheat, I have not had to use it thankfully, but if I do, I will.

Also is there any way to bypass the cut scenes? My god they get old fast. The manual has nothing on it.

I also re-mapped my controls thus saving me a lot of head aces.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

That I find very, very hard to believe...

Seeing as SE4 is a niche game in a niche market, only sold Online, and has a very small Online community, I'd say that the selection of mods available is rather large...

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

I don't mind hard games as long as it is possible to complete them. They are just a challenge. Leaving the PC, I used to play Wipeout2097 on my PS. I loved that game and played for ages trying to finish the Last track. I went away to work in England for most of a year and came back home. I played it 2 more times and managed to finish the Last track. I may not play it ever again but I take great satisfaction in knowing I finished every Last bit of it (and that I have almost expert hand-eye coordination http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif).

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

Lemmings. Most games today can't get anywhere near that fun or zany.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

I have to concur with Randwall, since I am doing exactly the same. The first time I played Kid Chaos was seven or eight years ago, and I have yet to finish that game. Grr. Most platformer games are easy, but that one managed to beat me. For now at least.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

I have to say, that the mods for FL make it a lot more fun to play. A lot more fun.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

I should point out for the record that I do not hate the games I listed. In fact I found Dominions II to be a very good game, just the micro-managment did not appeal to me after about an hour of playing. Dominions II is a very good game and one that will provide people with as much replay $$ as SEIV. I still have it on my HD and play it from time to time and am trying to teach my nephews how to play.

For me it might just be that I have not spent enough time playing DomII so please do not think for a second that it is a bad game because it really is not. It is a wonderful game filled with great ideas and involving game play. I am just lame for not playing it enough to get a good feel for it. So just remember its me, not the game. Now go buy Dominions II. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

The Worms Series! The best game around for mutliplayer fun with friends http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif

I'm currently playing The Political Machine, it's actually not a half bad game based on American Elections, It's kept my interest quite happy these past few days.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

Serves you right for playing games other than se4 http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

Seriously, the only other games I play are freeware: Return to Castle Wolfenstein Enemy Territory slakes my thirst for FPS killing and slashem takes care of all my turn-based-tactical-RPG-ascii-smashing needs. Two excellent games, both completely free. With se4, they are all you will ever need.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

In fact is is speculated that there were only about 10,000 copies of SEIV sold and that is on the high estimation.

It took SEIV nearly four years to reach this point, and GalCiv did this in its first two weeks.

The differance, certainly not better game play on GalCivs part, but Gal Civ was sold in stores and had a huge advertising blitz.

Shrapnel has done a fine job of selling SEIV on line, but their business model, as commented and quated many times, dictates their marketing strategies.

I think the bigest boast to sales came from PC Gamer when they reviewed SEIV Gold and gave it a good review. After that, word of mouth followed by Shrapnel adds.

I found out about the game via word of mouth, and I know I have done my best to bring people into the game over the years. So I do believe that word of mouth is rapidly creeping up on the PC Gamer generated sales.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

There is an expansion for CW? Well GD, I must have it! That game rocked and kicked butt IMHO.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

I thought Freelancer was a great game. I had no problems beating it. It has a great story and has awesome graphics even though now its a few years old. I give Freelancer a 10/10 the only problem I had with the game is when I had a non-M$ .mp3 codec installed and had some sound problems. I am also gonna plug my friends Freelancer multiplayer server "Eagle's Utopia" it's a great server filled with great people that will be more than happy to help you get started in multiplayer.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

Well, if you don't believe me about the mods for Freelancer, there are thousands. Just that I know of, and hundreds more a least I don't know of. Every time I go to the forums I find a new mod in production. I am telling you, there is more mods. I can give you links if you want to count them... I, myself have made dozens of mods. Ships, weapons, systems, you name it. I have done it. And I know many more people like me in FL comunity... Let me tell you, its huge. the mod comunity for it is absolutly massive. Bigger then Battlefeild 1942, a game known for its mods. (That I also mod, but its much, much harder then FL) Oh, my favorite mod to date is Evolutions 1.28 by pathfinderstudios. I am almost loyal to that mod. lol Don't get me wrong, there are great starwars, bab 5, star trek, andromedia, and any other series you can think of mods. I like the starwars mods... they work great. with the good ones you think its actually a SW game. not like the SW mods for BF1942... yuck. *cough*galactic conquest*cough*

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

Umm... I think you misunderstood the point. I don't believe you when you say that the game is more moddable than SEIV. There are only a few games out there that even approach the level of moddability of SE4... Where moddability is the capability of being modified by the user, what can be modified, and just how far the modifications can go in providing a totally different gaming experience.

Certainly, there are a lot more mods to be downloaded for Freelancer. But when you take the fact that it has a huge player base, compared to the very small player base of SE4, it doesn't mean much when comparing to SE4... When you take the size of the player bases for the games into account, it paints a different story... Also, mods that just do something like add a new weapon are not really "mods," in the sense that something like Pirates and Nomads or Proportions is a mod. To me, "mod" refers to a major game overhaul. Fiddling with a couple of values is more of a "hack" or a "plugin" than a full "mod..."

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

I se your point. But by mods, I do mean that the planets, items, drop rates, toughness og hulls, sheild, equipment, human models, everything is changed. Some mods it seems like a different game. However, I am afraid I did misunderstand your point. I se now that you mean this game has more user-tunable variables. I'm not sure if it does or not... but at least I know what your proposing now, lol.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

I think what Fyron is trying to say is that while Freelancer may have thousands of additions you can plug into the game, it lacks SE's ability to radically alter the game. If one so desired, you could change SE4 from a 4X strategy game into a servicable fantasy RPG. To a lesser extent, you can radically alter the type of universe you play in. Want to make a Wing Commander/Starlancer type game where big ships are relatively rare, and you main strike power comes from fighters? Doable. Or do you want to play in a universe where ALL the ships are incredibly massive, and fighters just don't exist? Not a problem. You can even create mods that would do away with the most fundamental aspects of a 4X game, such as resource collection and research if you so desired.
Essentially, while games like Starlancer may have a vast number of mods due to the larger community, a game like SE offers a level of customizability that few games can match.

Damn. Should I be the MM Press Officer or what? ;-)

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

The mod I am using has be fighting X-Wings, Tie Fighers, Starfury's, Thunderbolts, a-wings, a Cylon Raider, vipers, and so on. Its really a cool game in that regard, but some of the cut scenes are extremly bad. The constant "you must be new here" comments, and rehashed cut scenese just kill the fun factor.

I sware if this game was a cross with a FPS, I would blow the heads off of everyone in the bar who so much as speaks the words "Oh You must Be new here!" BOOOOOOM. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

"You Must be the New Guy..."
"Yep, I'm the Replacement for the Last guy who said that."
"I just Did..."
"Yep"
"Oh #@*&amp;%"
BLAM

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

Freelancer is great. The mod you are playing sounds like the Rebalance mod. That's the one I play.

Regarding that stupid race. I hate it. For the longest time I could not beat it. But, then I mapped my flight controls to the keyboard and used the mouse only for targeting, throttle and weapon firing. I beat the race on my second try that way. I have used that setup ever since. I still dread that @#$&amp; race every time i start a new game, though. Keep at it, the final levels are challenging and loads of fun, it would be a shame to miss them because of that numbnut Hovis.

You should be able to skip the during play cutscenes by hitting the spacebar or escape key. The main story scenes are unskippable, IIRC.

Re: OT: You Know I Hate
 

Yes, Hovis. Thats it. lol. I really don't get it though... I've played the campeign dozens of times unmodded, and many more modded. I never had to do that race more then twice. Whats wrong?? What ships are you using? do you use the engine kill trick? Do you use cruise? I just can't figure out why you can't beat it... (You ever gunna email m back BTW? lol)