Any news on DOM-III
 

I wonder if there's new information wrt dominions-III.

I recall with yearning that the dev constantly updated dom-II progress. Occasionally they released a screenshot or two as well.

Anyway, I hereby make my plea for updates on dom-III http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Hi,

Dom 3 work has been slowed by other work lately. My work at school has been taxing (the most disturbed months in my entire working career) and JK has recently changed employer. We have also been trapped in a Guild Wars spree and have used much of our spare time with that game.

But now I'm getting bored with GW and school's out for summer (still have some work, but no students anymore). I have a healthy dominions urge and will probably restart my aboleth project.

Screenshots will probably be sent to different magazines and not appear here until later.

We haven't written anything in the dev diary lately, but that will have change.

Today is the national day of Sweden. For the first time ever it's a 'non-work-day' or whatever you call it. So I intend to get some IW-work done.

Thanks for the interest. I think I needed some to get me going. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

May I suggest using the Berserk spell to get some more interest? Or maybe Imprint Souls? That should solve any morale problem, I think, and being Mindless is quite nice really. Well, maybe not that nice, but you've got some nice perks when you are a Mindless. Not too good to be a Sorcerer and get all the girls, but still.

Thanks for the news about the development of Dom 3.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Bad devs! Don't make me administer spankings!

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Some people like that kind of thing, so it might not speed up development. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Sure it will, "I'll only spank you after you finish the UI!"

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Well. I'm sure there is interest in plenty.
Besides the fact that dominions is a great game, there's also a "vacum" in the market of fantasy TBS games.
Now that stardock has put MOM-II plans on hold and Triumph studios won't be continuing their AOW series (blend and boring imo but fantasy TBS nonetheless), there's really nothing for a fantasy TBS fan to look forward to besides dominions.

So here's for the dominions devs http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image.../beerglass.gif. for giving us such a great game.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

The only other such game I can think of is the Heroes of Might and Magic series, but they are not exactly in the same market (the sequel is currently underway). There might be a sequel to Disciples too, but I am not sure on that.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

I agree on both games. Both are simplified in many ways but have added value of great music and gfx (especially disciples!).
Ok, so there's also HOMM-V and Disciples 3? to wait for http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

It's scheduled by the editor (there's a dedicated page and you cans send disciples 3 postcards), but there's few about it (no screenshots yet). It's certainly very early in the game development.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

I didn't like the battles and battle maps in the Disciples series. Heroes_III was the best of the Heroes series so far.
Dominions_III will most likely be greater than Civilization_IV... hopefully they are planning some marketing strategy.

I recommend dropping of CD-Demos at the big software chains like Software Etc. , E.B. , and Best Buys.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

If you like the fantasy strategy with a bit more depth than homm or disciples, I recommend you Ogre Battle for the Snes. You can find both the emulator and the game on the net, and believe me - it will keep you busy until dom 3 has been released. Granted, the graphics are not up to date any more - but I consider Dominion players to prefer gaming depth over cutting edge technology anyway.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

While I appreciate your devotion to Dominions I think that last statement is ludicrious. Civilization IV has much more money behind it and will undoubtedly be a better overall game than Dom3. The mechanics and gameplay of Dominions 3 might be more attractive on certain levels and I know will be another fantastic game, I don't think it's fair to judge Dominions 3 against a juggernaut like Civilization. Especially after seeing the screenshots and concepts.

The same goes for HOMM V. While you can tell nothing from the screenshots and you don't know if they failed to recapture the magic of HOMM 3. Ubisoft has poured money into the development and has a very good QA team (not multiplayer servers however).

I am certain however that Dom3, just like Dom2 will age very well and provide something that none of the current TBS or TBS-hybrid will. And knowing IW's track record, will be supported much better.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Almost anybody i know was extremely disappointed by Civilization 3.
And though Civ 4 has a bigger budget i don't think it can beat dominions 3.
I have not read anything about Civ 4 but i know Civ 1-3.
Civ 4 compared to Dom 3 will be like sudden strike compared to combat mission. It will just lack depth.
Warfare in Civ 1-3 was extremely simple and i doubt that it will change a lot in Civ 4.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Um? Zen are you connected with illwinter? Cause your last post sounded like you where?
Sorry, for asking but im new here.
And in my opinion:
Dominions2>all games
If dominions3>dominions2
Then Dominions 3 > all.
I have jsut never played a game with so much strategy and tactics and content.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

In my opinion... Civilization_III is not as good as Dominions_2 on several levels. First combat and combat strategy is much more unique and detailed. Second there's more of a real feeling to controlling hundreds or thousands of units in dominions... unlike CIV. Third more unit types exist in Dominions. Fourth No real commanders in Civilization just units. The list goes on... but to sum it up currently the only advantages that civilization_III has over Dominions_2 is diplomacy and a better editor. I will probably buy both CIV_IV and DOM_3... but if I could only choose one it would be DOM_3.

Hopefully HOMM_5 will be great... that's more of a wait and see. HOMM_4 was a wreck of design.

Hopefully the DOMINIONS_3 editor will be more user friendly... then we'll see more maps. I recall AgeofWonders:SM and Heroes_3 as having the best editors for TBS.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

I wish I could remember what games had editors that can create maps with the right size and style of map icons that people want. We could work on a "how to convert to Dom2" page for it

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Civ III was indeed a dissappointment. It was more complicated and pretty, but not actually better than Civ II.

Indeed, the best that series ever got was Alpha Centauri (which was made by a different company, but the same people, so it's part of the series). Brian Reynolds is doing Rise of Nations, which is real time, and Civ IV promises to still not actually have the original staff that made Civ II so astoundingly awesome.

Alpha Centauri II is not on the table, and the people doing Civ IV seem to still not actually get it, so there's no help from that quarter. HoMM in all its incarnations has always been a great game, but has also never ever been good in multiplayer and there's just no reason to play it that way.

Seriously, other than Dominions III, what turn-based strategy would you actually play with and against your friends? My Crystal Sphere doesn't see all that far into the future, but I'm just not seeing anything else even being offered that is going to be a decent TBS multiplayer game. This is a genre that has been completely lost to the Playstation Generation.

The closest competition Dominions III is going to have from anywhere is the next installment of Advance Wars for the Nintendo DS.

-Frank

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

More money probably has a reasonably strong correlation with better production values, but surely what is the "better" overall game is going to be in the eye of the beholder.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Which incidentally the new RoN looks awesome. But I have higher hopes for Civ4 simply due to the fact that they have made advancements and recognized their mistakes and in Civ4 rectifies most of them AFAIK. I still don't think it's an accurate comparison to put Dominions in the same caliber of game as one that has a budget in the millions. I love Dominions and will love Dominions 3, but like with any other game there are things which need improvement and lessens the game experience. (Such examples might be UI, micromanagment, etc.) This may vary from person to person what people feel should always be included in every game, whether it be graphics, UI, etc.

Laser Squad Nemesis, Age of Wonders:SM (potentially Spartan Total War) comes immediately to mind. While I agree the genre is now mostly a niche genre, European developers continue to churn out unhyped nuggets of gaming goodness.

This doesn't mean that Dominions 3 won't be a fantastic game, but putting it up against the kind of competition and resources of a huge (non-indy) brand is setting yourself up for disappointment.

Dominions might be superior in every aspect due to cost/effort ratio (being able to do everything it does well with only X investment of time/programming) but it doesn't erase the fact that unless Sweden changes their tax laws or Dominions 3 sells millions of units that you can't compare it to Civ4 realistically.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

I think they could be realistically compared in the "how much enjoyment do I get out of one vs. the other" department.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

It sure could. Then do it by units sold. More people (whatever their tastes) enjoy certain types of games more.

I sincerely doubt that Dominions sells on a Civilization scale. That doesn't mean it's an inferior game in any way shape or form. But that the tastes of consumers dictate how they purchase games.

Just like how some people for their TBS goodness prefer EU2 or other severely complicated games that I may not enjoy as much. I wouldn't say either way Dominions or EU2 is a better game than the other, only that one game caters to one specific subgenre of TBS and the other caters to what I enjoy in a TBS.

This is more of an industry thing I think instead of a consumer thing. A good read on this would be the Shrapnel Blog about niche games and general vs hard-core stragtegy from their perspective instead of the straight consumer end find it here

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

No, they can't. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

I have gotten more hours of enjoyment from Dominions 2 than any other game, bar none. Civ 4 may or may not be a disappointment, but I cannot imagine it being better than dom 2, let alone dom 3.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

A lot of people like crap. That doesn't mean it's better than something fewer people like; it means it's more popular. By that standard TV Guide is "better" than the NY Times.

Lowest common denominator and all that.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

I agree with Reverend Zombie... CIV_4 is currently more popular because they have a big publisher and larger advertising budget.
Lots of gamers are afraid to purchase something over the internet as well compared with just walking into a store.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Everyone who likes World of Warcraft are the lowest common denominator? Or just the 90% who like crap which also includes the good 'games'.

Some people also don't like FPS, RTS, or Fantasy or Sci-Fi and it has nothing to do with them liking or not liking crap.

I have friends who I play games with who didn't enjoy Dominions 2, are they suddenly tasteless because they don't enjoy everything Dom2 has to offer?

No. Some of them don't like the pace, some of them can't get past the UI, some of them have issues with graphics, others don't enjoy some of the mechanics of the game. It has nothing to do with how good Dominions 2, but merely their preference.

I think that's why Shrapnel is what it is, the same with Matrix games and Stardock. You have to get lean, mean and approach consumers with a plan to deal with personal preference especially as a working business model.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

I disagree. I think the reason Civ_4 will be popular because of the groundwork that was laid with Civ and Civ2 to produce a good TBS game. That being said, Civ_4 will do good or bomb on it's own merits. It does however have the benefit of being it's own IP and recognized as having the potential of being a very good game.

Dominions has this to it's own extent but not on the same level.

Just as the deal with Stardock and Master of Magic. It's brand recognition, devotion and possible success that allows the risk vs the reward so that Stardock decided to take the leap and try to make it work financially.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

You seem to assume that I argue that everything that is popular is crap? Not so. But not everything wildly popular is good, either. See, Revenge of the Sith.

My point is that claiming something is "good" or "better" than something else because it is more popular is a fallacy, which is what you were doing with CiV4 vs. Dom3.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Nobody mentioned Wesnoth for TBS?

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

[img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Lightning.gif[/img] [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Lightning.gif[/img] [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Lightning.gif[/img] I NEED REGULAR UPDATES ON THE ESTIMATED RELEASE TIME FOR DOMINIONS 3!!! [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Lightning.gif[/img] [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Lightning.gif[/img] [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Lightning.gif[/img]

It's fair to say that I am on the "Dominions 3 Diet". I am seeking to lose 10 pounds, and my reward will be a sassy new 20-inch IMAC. But, my DEADLINE is the release of Dominions 3, because I will need a new computer to play the new version of the game. (If I am wrong, don't correct me on the technical requirements for running DOM 3, because it would spoil everything.) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif

If Dominions 3 is coming out SOON, tell me now, because I will need to hop on that stairmaster more often. I might even need to make more radical changes to my eating habits (e.g., no more pizza or maybe even giving up water).

[img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Burger.gif[/img] [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Cake.gif[/img] [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Cheese.gif[/img] [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/PointRight.gif[/img] [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Poison.gif[/img]

[img]/threads/images/Graemlins/icon34.gif[/img] [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Fish.gif[/img] http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/carrot.gif [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/icon30.gif[/img] [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/PointRight.gif[/img] [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/icon43.gif[/img]

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Wesnoth rocks.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Don't give up on water. Bad idea
Eat lots of greens.
Eat brown rice and cuscus(sp?)
Leave pasta alone
I think the best eating style in the world = japanese.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

If it will show up: קוסק&# 1493;ס =P
As for the date DomIII comes out at, Im 100% it will be before the latest game of Duke Nukem (Forever? =P).
That should give you a rough estimate http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

<font color="#CCC4B7"> which should be right before pigs grow a seventh leg, in case you are unaware of the Duke "folklore" </font>

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Yeah - among other things, Disciple's mechanics (like several other games) put some really artificial constraints on gameplay. IIRC, basically only the heroes could move onto the next scenario, and the experience was only given to units that damaged/killed. Net result was that you only wanted a very few units to be getting into combat, which was itself very simplistic and not terribly rewarding.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

I think Disciples has it's strong points.
I agree that it is simplistic in many aspects but,
It has nice RPG feeling in the sense that you can develop heroes and units.
And it really shines in the esthetics department, the hand made drawing are very good. This, of course, is a matter of personal taste.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Did I already mention Ogre Battle?

It is very much like Disciples, except that you take your complete army into the next mission. And your soldiers choose between different professions, depending whether their alignment tends toward evil or good

Oh, I already mentioned it?
Sorry to bother you http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Not to mention Final Fantasy Tactics, Brigandine, and the Suikoden and Vandal Hearts series, all for the original playstation, thus cheap (if you can find them) and presumably capable of being played via PS emulators. All of them had different manners of fantasy combat with different units / critters / professions, etc.

Or action / RPGs such as Vagrant Story (one of the most amazing things I ever saw on the PS, with great characters, cut scenes, and voiceovers : "Shouldn't we wait for the reinforcements?" "I am the reinforcements." Or Valkyrie Profile, or various other gems that came to be on the consoles.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Yay!!! I can eat sushi every meal.... yay!!!!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Yeah Zen--

You're definitely in the minority of the minority that is Dominions 2 fans. CivIII can't hold a candle to Dom2, despite the vastly larger budget and huge popularity. Or, actually, because of the vastly larger budget and huge popularity. Any game with such a huge budget is going to be marketed at a large audience so it can make money (or someone is getting fired, right?). Any game marketed at a large audience is going to be hindered by the "common-denominator" factor, therefore probably not as good as dom2 because it isn't limited in that way.

Also--most of that budget is going towards graphics, which any true gamer knows is mostly irrelevant to a good game-playing experience.

So, mass marketed games are a large number of people making decisions about the game with regards more or less only to profits, not to a good gaming experience, and on top of that, they're wasting most of their money on a less-important part of the game (graphics). These games are just bound to be worse than a small project done by gamers for gamers. I'm not saying they -have- to be worse, but if they're not, it's pretty damn awesome. Get me a copy of that game.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Disicples was a fun game, but Dominions2&gt;civ 3+disciples

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

I never said Civ3 was on par with Dom3. If you see the references it was considering the entire series (which you can see applies to games with sequels). I may not at this point say that Civilization or Civiliation 2 is as good as Dominions 2 *right now*. But I do remember when they came out and I played them, I enjoyed them very nearly as much as Dominions 2. Dominions just is more fresh in my mind since it's been a while since I've played them.

So let me see the arguement. Because a game is marketed to a large audience it is going to be hindered by that fact and won't be as good as someeone who doesn't have the kind of budget to market to a large audience?

If that is the arugement, how much money does it take to have a good game that does appeal to a large audience since it can be defined by monetary means? If a good team makes a good game that is marketed to alot of people or a good team makes a game that is a niche game, it shouldn't matter since it's not the money that is the determining factor, but the development. By what your saying it means that Dominions 2 will never be as good as it is right now since it doesn't take alot of money and would actually be better if it spent less money, especially on things that are considered 'fluff' (like graphics). So cut out Kristoffer O. and the money he gets from Dominions 3 (lets assume after taxes and work effort its something like $0.000003 an hour) will make it even a better game.

I didn't know you worked for Firaxis in it's financial department to confirm this. So the majority of what Civ4 will be from Civ3 will be graphical and it will be a total flop, in direct contradiction to what is being reported in interviews and the development journals.

Assuming that isn't what you meant but that if that is what is going to happen, I agree with you. Civ 4 will be a waste of a game and nowhere even close to Dominions 2, let alone Dominions 3.

Profit is a high priority in any business but depending on the business. The sacrifice of quality for profit is the balancing of the fine line as any business owner will tell you. And while I may not know the Gaming Industry like the back of my hand or all the ins and outs (if you happen to be one that does, then I'll take your word for it) developers work as hard as they can to make the best game they can in the amount of time they have to work with because it directly impacts their future.

Whether or not it is successful is entirely up to how they do.

I agree with you. Maybe I just have more faith on this particular project because I've been following every worthwhile TBS I've seen lately (there aren't that many) to quench that hunger for it.


Edited for stupid typos.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Also, just for the sake of arguement. I don't think the Civ 4 graphics are all that superfantastic. Especially when you consider immersion.

The new RoN with it's weather effects, enviroment variables and such is a huge step up in graphics for a "strategy" game that add to immersion.

I certainly wouldn't buy Civ4 for it's graphics.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

You have cited the best of the best of the PS games, I think these almost unknown games are the best of the best in "athmosphere" and story. They have a mysterious, obscure and dramatic story. PC games are nowhere near (reagarding script).
It is impressive how, in the modern days, high tech is cheap and good ideas are scarce (I'm thinking of SWep3, but the concept is similar)

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

And I will certainly not buy it because of it's graphics - they plainly suck, judging from the screenshots:

- comic-style leaders

- Troops are portrait realistically as possible (real-time 3D rendering, I suppose ..), there are even squads (to tell the army size?). As in every "good" RTS game, units are bigger than buildings and even mountains. I hate that. Either do realistic graphics, or do icons. I must admit the first will not work with a strategy game because of scale. (Yes, I hated Panzer General 3D as well)

- Woods don't look like woods, but like some lonely trees only

etc etc.

And even if the graphics where ok, there are lots other things that simply suck ...

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Civ always had scale and logic problems -- fighter jet sorties that last a year, missiles that could be launched from cities *into* a submarine at sea, the inability to fly units over enemy units lacking any AA capability whatsoever, no concept of supply lines, free field upgrades...

...but more irritating to me than all of that was the tendency to put in an AI with delusions of grandeur, so that even when you *obviously* could erase it from the world at your whim, it would stridently demand certain percentages of your treasury or your latest technology (even if it lacked the espionage capabilities to know what you had). Or otherwise needlessly provoking you by dropping colonies on tiny areas of your islands. Might as well annihilate them just to end their nonsense.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

Of course Civ and Civ2 were good and help with the sales... but the sales also come from having a big publisher and advertising/marketing budget as well. Dominions does not have this so it will obviously not do as well.

I agree... it's possible Civ_4 might be better than Dom_3 or vise versa. Too hard to tell right now.

=============================

The point I was trying to make is that I believe a majority of the CIVILIZATION gamers would find DOMINIONS_2 to be a better game than CIVILIZATION_3. And because DOMINIONS cannot match the advertising/marketing design of CIVILIZATION it will remain this way.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

20 turns / 400 years to "build" an archer... with a city thus unable to even START building a temple (a 4 to 40 week project) for 400 years. An aircraft carrier needing upkeep equal to a paratrooper. Cities falling into unrest because their garrisoned nuclear missiles are moved to a remote location. Any victorious unit suffering no (permanent) losses, or at least losses that cost anything.

If they would just make Civ marginally more realistic with each generation, I'd love it. But no... strategic resources were added, so you can "move" and "use" tanks under a total oil embargo (no strategic reserve allowed!) and your economy functions at 100%... you just cannot "build" tanks! Of course! And your cities fall into chaos unless you constantly give enemy nations advanced technology so they don't cut of your vital silk and spices... if Bush gave North Korea 'nukyuler' secrets in exchange for a kim-chee supply-line, I humbly suppose that Americans would finally realize he's an idiot, rather than celebrating "We Love The President Day." But then I'm young and don't remember when England overthrew its government because German subs were sinking the vital gem and fur imports. Or when German tanks magically roamed North Africa without burning any gasoline, but lost anyway becase the rubber embargo prevented them from building new Marines (at 6 years per new unit).

I don't care about graphics too much. Graphics can be really neat, but iff the devs would spend a trivial effort on creativity or realism, Civ IV might end up being worth buying. If they don't, a $10M or even $10B (and that can buy a lot) graphics do-over will not entice me. I didn't like Civ III nearly as much as II.

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

And don't forget the expansion pack, "Civ IV: The World Pays for a Patch Edition."

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

You know that not a thing of what you have mentioned seems to have changed?

Re: Any news on DOM-III
 

About Civ4 : I don't expect much from it, except more eye-candy and (surely) simplified mechanisms... I was enthusiastic about Civ, happy with Civ2, get bored with Civ3, now what's the point of doing a 4th sequel ?