UAV Issues
 

Andy & Team,

I know I brought these up in the YAHOO forum, and that they are for later updates (HOPEFULLY), but I still have some issues with how UAVs are modeled (and how ground units respond to air threats in general).

1. Platforms (UAVs, et al) using stand-off weapons should
NOT fly over the target after launching the weapon.

2. UAVs still, IMHO, are too easily killed. Given the small
signature and operating altitude, I don't think that
everyone and their mother should be engaging a UAV.
Also, do they really have enough signature to be
engaged by all the myriad MANPAD SAMS?

3. In general, it seems like EVERY unit on the map can take
a crack at an incoming air platform. That does not seem
realistic/reasonable. Buttoned vehicles would need
to be facing the direction the AC is coming from. Also,
some fire discipline seems to be in order. I have tanks
trying to engage A/C that should be too far or too high
to reasonably engage, IF they could see it.

I have had some air strikes that take 2-5 minutes to
process because of all the AAA/SAM fire. Does
FACING impact the ability to engage an A/C?

4. On the BOMBARDMENT Screen, it would be nice to have
letters after the platform designation to help keep
straight which units have which load-outs:

EX: A-10 MSL, GUN, CW (Cluster Weapon)
B-52 HE or B-52 PGM (for JDAM loads, etc.)

5. The effectiveness of airborne cluster munitions seems
a bit low???

6. Reasonably, since UAVs are firing PGMs, shouldn't the
kill rate be higher? It SEEMS like it's about 50-50
for a hit of any kind, and 25%-50% for a hit to generate
a kill.

I LOVE the new version of the game. Just listing some things from the YAHOO lists from last WINTER, and also to pass on some info on the new game.

Buddy

Re: UAV Issues
 

If you click on the first little icon on the right of the name of the unit in the bombardment menu,(the one represented with an eye) you will pop up all the information about that particular unit, loadout included.

Re: UAV Issues
 

THANK YOU!!

Is that new to WinSPMBT or have I been missing this all along???

Buddy
(Blaming chemo moments, not "senior moments" <grin>)

Re: UAV Issues
 

The info button has always been ther eonthe bombardment screen

Cheers
Andy

Re: UAV Issues
 

DOH! Mea Culpa.

BK

Re: UAV Issues
 

If one hex is a yard or a meter, what would the standoff be for any given type of manpads, if a aircraft is in the next hex can a strela engage, or even a stinger, wether its a manpad a linebacker or a avenger? And what about sams in general is there a rule of thumb for standoff?

Re: UAV Issues
 

Each Hex is 50 Meter's across.

Re: UAV Issues
 

Standoff range for missiles ( be them SAMs, ATGMs or AGMs, even rockets) are given by the 'sabot range' value. For MANPADS that gives generally less than 10 hex, more for heavier ones, but since they fire off-map against strike aircrafts (standoff attacks), sabot range should only be under 200.

To have standoff values you have to scurry any technical docs you can find, but AFAIK these in the game are pretty well done. What would be appreciable though is relative and credible values for SAM accuracy and radar potency. These data are hard to find.

Re: UAV Issues
 

Every SAM is different. Many have minimum ranges. If you look at weapon 133 in the USA OOB with MOBHack you'll see a line..

"SABOT RANGE--Also Minimum range for some weapons" eg ATGM"

This also applies to SAMs and in the case of the Stinger SAM it's 2. The Patriot is 30. A Redeye SAM is 12

Those ranges are in HEXES so the Redeye has a 12 hex = 600 metre/yard minimum range for it to be deployed. Anything under that minimum wouldn't be fired on.

Don

Re: UAV Issues
 

I have to agree that the UAV are way to easy to kill. They are small, hard to see and shot at. I have only had 1 UAV be able to make more than 1 flight. it made 5 before it was downed by a INF squad with AK-47 fire.

I think they should be like bombers but able to come back several times.

never had a bomber shot at.

Re: UAV Issues
 

I agree with Shadowcougar. At the very least, UAV's should be immune to small arms fire. And missiles should only get a reduced chance of hitting (Like .1%, 1 in 1,000).

Re: UAV Issues
 

When that is not done, reduce the size and raise the EW ratings of your UAVs. That should make them harder to kill. I think all would agree that the armour rating should stay zero.

And UAVs are meant to be low-altitude because they work the same way as the classical OP aircrafts.

If you find your UAV too easy to kill, consider that if you have 50 people firing at it even with MGs at the same time, with 3% hit chance, you can have one bullet hit all the same that will down the thing.

But I agree that targetting can seem too easy for ground units.

Re: UAV Issues
 

hmmm.... doesn't that mean you'll be able to empty the enemy SAM units by running UAV sorties a couple of turns before sending in the air strikes/helicopter assault...

Re: UAV Issues
 

Well, that is one of the points of spotter aircrafts, and SEAD strikes additionally... Both benefit from being sent before the strike planes (well, actually you player benefit...).

That is also why, when you have a big air opposition, you'd better set some to short range so they don't waste too many shots; and buy some ammo sections along. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: UAV Issues
 

UAV's fly at 5000 feet or higher. they are out of the mess of AK and mg fire. that is what I am saying. Predator flys up to 30,000 ft as does the Globial Hawk(in fact higher). Spotter ac and SEAD craft fly slower do to using the mk 1 eyeball instead of cameras and other devices. there are other uav's but I don't beleieve that they fly into AK fire envolopes. they would be very hard to hit wirh IR SAMs but Radar and Laser guided SAMs would be possible. Also big AA would have a chance to engage. they are small but don't jink at all.

They should be hard to hit and not disposible after a half a mission.

Re: UAV Issues
 

isn't that the point of UAVs? Light low-alt UAVs can be shot at by just anyone, but that means they will spot them, won't they? So no firing at them would require reducing range...

I think the point is not Predators getting shot at, but Predators being in control of battalion commanders at all...
What I meant with spotter planes is that UAV use the same code. So nothing can prevent them flying 200ft high.
Aren't there smaller UAVs in the US army?

Re: UAV Issues
 

ShadowCouger hits it on the head! At 5,000 feet, I doubt the visual and sound signatures would even be noticed by your average INF or ARM unit.

FLAX/AAA MIGHT be a threat, but you still have the detection issue to begin with. On a busy battlefield, who has time to stare at the sky (other than the SAM/AAA units).

Also, and I'm not sure the engine will support this, the UAV is under INTELLIGENT control back in REMF-land. If a target moves it should be able to track it.

Plus, it seems the UAV hit rate (on enemy units) is a bit low: Steady platform, moving slow, can SEE the target, etc..

Buddy

Re: UAV Issues
 

There is the HUNTER RQ-5A (used by US Army, USMC, France, and Belguim)and will fly as high as 20000 ft. they use the Global Hawk. they use the predator. they also have some smaller ones either in use or under devlopment.

the new ones are very small and quiet and very difficult to kill. mt no 1 argument is uav's are to easy to kill.


http://www.army-technology.com/projects/hunter/
http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?fsID=175
http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/predator/
http://www.vectorsite.net/twuav08.html