mine clearing not working
 

I am playing a generated campaign in 1965 and not only is the AI using many mines (saw other post) but I am unable to clear much at all. Using Mineroller tanks, CEV tanks, and multiple engineer units. Outside hex pointed in direction, inside hex, spotted mines (sometimes see on map when artillery or enemy runs into, but not spotted by my troops). No matter what I do , I have run many turns with engineers posed to clear and have only once clear a hex in this particular battle. Others have been fine. An Assault map default large. Thanks for any help. Save available upon request. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

Re: mine clearing not working
 

Hi,

could you send me some savegame files at Pyros@myway.com or you may edit your post and attach them there(first you should zip all of them).

cheers,
Pyros

Re: mine clearing not working
 

Here are the saves of several turns into the battle with engineers and mineroller tanks in position. Thanks.

Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

I've now played (or tried to play) two assault missions in WinSPMBT. During both games I've encountered problems with mineclearing.

First game was Israel vs. Egypt 1973, an assault over Suez. Well, I was able to cross the Suez but my engineers just didn't clear the mines and dragon teeth on the other side of the canal. They were all "ready" and spent like four turns next to the mines without clearing anything. We were forced to end the game as there was no reason to continue if the mines weren't being cleared.

The second battle was Finland vs. Sweden 2005. My opponent encountered the same problem and we were forced to end the game. The funny thing was that in the same battle my own engineers accidentally cleared some barbed wire. How is this possible?!

It seems that the assault games are unplayable in WinSPMBT. It's very irritating to spent maybe tens of hours in generating the map, purchasing, deploying and moving your troops just to learn that the game is unplayble. I consider this to be the biggest bug in WinSPMBT, which is, apart from this, one of the best games I've ever played. I hope it will be fixed in the upcoming patch.

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

There severel way ot of it:
1. You can turn mines off in the prefernces
2. You can use helo assault to fly over mines
3. You can use mine-clearing tanks. You have to put at least 4 mine-clearing tank (better put 6) before the mine hex to clean it in one turn. That is not counting move turn. Only tank at rest is doing cleaning.

Re: mine clearing not working
 

I tried this, and saw several mine roller tanks sitting beside mine hexes, but pointing in any old direction and not towards the mine hex. After pointing the engineers and mine roller tanks AT the target hex, they started to clear the obstacles. Ditto, if the hex was entered (and the engineer or rifle section was not blown up).

Rallying several of the engineers who had poor morale helped, as did pointing multiple engineering assets at the same target hex.

Cheers
Andy

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

Were your engineer assets unsupressed?

What experience level were they?

Those alongside the target hex - were they [/b]pointing at the target hex[/b]?.

Try the attached simple test scenario for engineer training (there is only an HQ on the OPFOR side).

1) move engineer assets towards target hexes and point them at the hex (Manual "Mines and Field Engineering", Note No. 2). press end turn a few times to see clearance in action.

2) Now, move assets so you have multiple engineers pointing at the same target hex, press end turn a few times, and see how the clearance rate increases.


Cheers
Andy

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

It may be a bit premature but I think I may have found a bug in the mine clearing routines. The rules for mine clearing as we know it are...
1) Be in adjacent hex
2) Face toward the mine
3) Don't be suppressed
4) Don't fire weapons
5) Don't move around a bunch

The bug that I think I noticed involves saved games. Restarting a saved game (Iwo Jima Part 1 DOS SPWW2) yielded no mine clears until I had moved all units away from and back to mines. I am probably wrong. I'll work on finding out if I am right tonight.

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

I was the attacking side in the 1973 game playing Israel which had a base experience of 80. So experience shouldn't be the problem. My engineers were also unsupressed for four whole turns without moving a bit. They also faced to the mines, so no problems in that either.

Thanks for the test scebario, but I've tested the engineers several times before and after experiencing this bug. In the test scenarios I've built I've never had any problems. And as for the Finland vs. Sweden game, my opponent (the attacker) was experienced player and also found the bug.

I attach a screenshot from the Egypt vs. Israel game. It's somewhat misleading as those engineers have just suffered couple of losses in artillery fire. But before that they were unsupressed and didn't move for four turns.

Is there any explanation for the fact that in the Finland vs. Sweden game my own engineers were able to clear barbed wire and mines but the opponent wasn't?

Cheers,
Jukka

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

I have not had any issue with engineers not clearing mines. I have had mech ing clear mines in the Silver Lions campaign post in this forum.

I haven't tried from a saved game.

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

When you run your tests save the turns before AND after if possible and if you can duplicate this in WINSPMBT it would me more helpful than in SPWW2

Don

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

**IF** you see this again make a save of the turn that shows the engineers doing nothing but continue to play your game. Once you are done your game go back to that save and see if the engineers behave any differently when you restart it. If they still just sit there forward us that save game with info on where we should be looking

Don

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

Of course I could always run the tests in the Beta version of the WinSPWW2 release. All you have to do is send it to me! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

There DOES seem to be a problem but it's also seems to be a narrow series of events that trigger it. I saw it last night in a test save but Andy says his tests work just fine. It *IS* releated to saving the game though. Just starting it up and playing through won't trigger the problem and neither will starting up a save game then moving the engineers to new hexes to clear mines. If you do they will start clearing again.

We are looking at this now from a number of different angles

Don

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

I tested last night as I said I would.

The mine clearing bug occurs if...
The game is opened and a saved game is started where mine clearing units are already in hexes adjacent to the mines.

I'm attaching several saves just because I said I would and you asked but obviously your on top of it.

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

What I discovered in my testing today was the engineers would start clearing again after a one turn pause. I did have one test where the engineers just sat their looking at the mines for more than one turns but in that test they were clearing their own mines and that may be a factor to consider.

However, this goes a long way to explain whey there are conflicting reports about the bug. Anyone who sits down and plays a game right through will never see this. Anyone who plays PBEM or only has a short amount to time to play in any given day and makes a lot of saves will see this all the time. Anyone who is somewhere in the middle and may play a number of turns one day then have to save every turn for a couple of days for one reason or the other will see it seemingly inconsistently. Your tying it to the save game was the piece of the puzzle we needed. Thank you for that clue. It helped a lot. This is why we need as much info as possible when we get a bug report.

Don

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

I just tested your " Mine test T4 start " and it duplicated what I saw today. They sat there and did nothing for the turn after I re-started the game but started clearing again the turn after that.

Is that what you saw as well?

Don

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

No what I saw was from the moment I opened a saved game (open app, open save, commence play) the Engineers just sat there looking stupid for as many turns as I wished to sit through UNTIL I moved them away from mines and back again. At one point I opened Save 2 and pressed End Turn repeatedly with no mine clears for 5 or 6 turns.

Mine clearing worked fine as long there was no "End Game" & "Open Save".

Mine clearing worked fine after saving game as long as game progressed after save (End Game not clicked, no return to Desktop, etc).

BTW the bug exists in DOS SPWW2 as well.

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

Looks like we found what was wrong in the save game process. (Being able to debug with real breakpoints beats the old DOS print to text file debug method no end ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif )

Testing the fix out now.

Andy

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

Confirmed fixed

Don

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

Yeeeeeehaw! How many thousands of gripe reports did I help kill off? [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Dagger.gif[/img] Happy to help.

Josh

Re: Mine clearing not working in PBEM games:(
 

Awesome, very quick response and fix. I had been saving before each end turn and usually short sessions. Thanks http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif