experimental weapons systems like OICW
 

Hi!

Just recently I downloaded WINSPMBT, played some scenarios and am very pleased so far, that you have been able to adopt this great game for users of modern machines.

But in comparison to the old SPMBT I missed the experimental weapons systems like the OICW or the LOSAT. One of the most interesting things in the old version was to simulate those systems possible performance. Ive tried to generate battles around 2020 but couldnt find any of those experimental weapons systems, only a pic showing a soldier pointing the OICW, but no detailed listing in the unit menu. Were those weapons left out for some unknown reason?

Many thanks for your great work though.

Re: experimental weapons systems like OICW
 

try unit No 747 (cavalry scouts)

That is I think the "OICW" - split into the 2 game components, rifle and G/L. Weapons 81 and 82, and unit vision 20. Those units are probably "what-ifs", as the thing has not been fielded, and could be canned/changed/delayed whatever as with any future system.

Cheers
Andy

Re: experimental weapons systems like OICW
 

dracule, vorbesti romaneste? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: experimental weapons systems like OICW
 

Thanks for the tip and the clarification. So I am right that the complete experimental TOEs were taken out of play. Too bad, liked that option very much.

To flashpointpro: No, I'm not Romanian, just an old fan of goth- and vampire-culture and maybe feel a bit inclined to what the Romanian writer Emile Cioan calls "destin walak".

Re: experimental weapons systems like OICW
 

I think the LOSAT is renamed KEM (maybe Kinetic-Energy-Missile) in th US oob. Maybe these new systems like some -non-line of sight- missiles can´t be modeled correctly.

Re: experimental weapons systems like OICW
 

nothing that requires third party hand-off using a designator can be modelled in the SP game engine. So no COPPERHEAD for example.

Anything that remotely homes in is best handled in other ways. Forex SADARM may best be modelled as a cluster munition (and assume a salvo of them, as you will get multiple killes with cluster munitions).

Cheers
Andy

Re: experimental weapons systems like OICW
 

Hi,

The OICWS a.k.a. the XM29 has been split into two seperate weapons systems, the XM8 Rifle and the XM25 Grenade Launcher. As a result of developmental problems withe the 20mm airbursting ammuntion, the caliber was upped to 25mm which would have made an already too bulky weapon system even more unwieldy. The XM8, made by H&K is heavily modified G36 as was intended to replace the M-4/M-16 series rifles. The XM25 is a magaizine fed 25mm stand-alone grenade launcher intended to replace the M203 40mm grenade launcher. It will be able to fire flechette, hight explosive air bursting, thermobaric and non-leathal ammunition and uses an advanced computerized sighting system. The 25mm ammo is the same used by the XM307 OCSW, which will replace the MK19 and in some cases the M2 .50 cal. As of November, the XM8 project has apparently been put on hold as operational experience from Iraq & Afghanistan has called into question the effectivness of the 5.56mm round. As far as I can tell, the XM25 is still on track, and may begin field testing in the next year or two.

In the US OOB slot 081 is the M29 OICWS. 082 is the M25, though it is incorrectly listed as 20mm. Slot 215 is the M307, and 009 is the M8 Rifle. 049 is the M307's cousin, the .50 cal M312, which is essentially a M307 chambered for .50.

Re: experimental weapons systems like OICW
 

Correct, the MGM-166 LOSAT is in SpMBT as the KEM, slot 162. Technically the LOSAT (Line-of-sight-anti-tank)is the nomenclature of the whole system, which includes the KEM (kinetic-energy missile). Despite very successful field testing, in 2004 the Army decided not to put the LOSAT into production - possibly due to a combination of cost and the current vision of "transformation" taking place under the current administration (which also canceled the RAH-66 and the Crusader SPA). The lead contracter, Lockheed Martin, is continuing work on the Compact Kinetic Energy Missile, which is a scaled down KEM.

Re: experimental weapons systems like OICW
 

For those of you who don't know, the XM8 program was stopped and a new program to develop a weapon like it (which might still include the XM8) called the Modular Weapon System Program was initiated. This was done after other companies complained HK was getting a quick contract without bidding simply having developed part of a system generally believed to be canceled now (if OICW Phase III, aka XM29 ever gets off the ground I'll be surprised).

The XM25 is not intended to replace the M203, but supplement its true replacement, the XM320 (aka HK AG-C), and the 25mm ammo used in the XM25 is NOT the same as that used in the XM307. The XM307 round is longer than that of the XM25. The XM312 (now known as the XM307K50) is to be used as more of a transitional weapon, and can be quickly configured to fire the longer 25mm ammunition of the XM307.

Note that USSOCOM has also adopted a seperate family of weapons, and might well be adopting a seperate UBGL, all products of the SCAR program (and outgrowth of about 5 previous programs starting with the original SOPMOD). These weapons are made by FN and the 5.56x45mm and 7.62x51mm elements are already being field tested.

Re: experimental weapons systems like OICW
 

Hmm... Does the XM25 and XM307 share the same projectile family, just with different length cases ala the M203 & Mk19? Or are they completely different rounds?

I've heard the SCAR will also be available in a 7.62mmx39 version that will accept standard AK magazines.

Anyword if the new rifle project will be looking at alternate calibers such as the 6.8mm SPC or 6.5mm Grendel?

Re: experimental weapons systems like OICW
 

I know this is kind of off-topic, but does anyone know what the Commanche's replacement will be or what it will look like? Those Apaches are getting old, and it takes maybe a decade to design a new helo, so they must be working on something now.

Re: experimental weapons systems like OICW
 

I believe the 25mm ammunition is the same family, but I don't know for sure.

According to FN the SCAR will be able to be chambered in 7.62x39mm. As far as I know this requirement was dropped by time the SOF-SCR program morphed into the SCAR. The SOF-SCR program had a number of alternative caliber requirements, and as far as I know none of these made it into the SCAR requirements. 6.8mm Remington SPC was generally found to not be ballistically superior to 5.56x45mm M855 or Mk 262 Mod 0/1 that its fallen out of the limelight.

As for Commanche replacement, Commanche was supposed to be the replacement for both the OH-58D and the AH-64D from what I gathered. The concensus behind the Army's decision to cancel the program seemed to be based on the ideas that the OH-58D was a far more capable system that people wanted to believe and could easily be upgraded, and that the AH-64 could be diversified from its primarily anti-armor role. Furthermore, the fielding of a whole new generation of UAVs made the need for a dedicated deep recon helicopter non-existant. In my opinion expect to see both the OH-58 and AH-64 platforms soldier on for quite a while, just like the UH-1 and AH-1 platforms with the USMC.