Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

I had the idea for a special Scenario MP game.
In the Alliance vs. the Dead thread i suggested it already:
Thread

The base concept of the game is that it will be roughly a fantasy Barbarian Invasion.

2 players will be allied and play Western and Eastern Roman Empire, the other players will also be allied and play the Barbarian Invaders.

Settings:
-Most recent CB Mod, 5.2 or newer.
-Zen's Europe Map
- 6-8 Players

If you are interested post and then suggest/vote for my suggestions open for discussion which i will post now:

1. Roman Nations
suggest 2 Nations
2. Barbarian Nations
suggest up to 6 Nations
3. Should conquering the sea provinces be allowed?
a) yes
b) no
4. Victory Conditions for the Romans
a) Barbarians are very strong. In this case the Roman Victory condition will be to survive till turn X.
b) Somewhat balanced start. Romans have to kill 50% of the Barbarian Nations.
5. Victory Conditions for the Barbarians
a) Kill the Romans before turn X
b) Conquer either Rome or Byzantine
6. Magic Sites Frequency
suggest frequency
7. Shall we play with 500% Supply and 200% Resources (compared to Vanilla)
a) yes
b) no
8. Shall the Romans have many castles (simulating Limes + better roman infrastructure)?
a) yes
b) no
9. Fast Research, i.e. everyone gets a few immobile special researches in his capitol which give 100-200 research per turn.
a) yes
b) no
10. Shall the starting armies be rather national or may the nations also have some mystic help by ancient monsters, their gods etc.?
a) keep them national
b) also add monsters
11. Human pretenders only or free pretender chosing?
a) Humans only
b) all allowed
12. Shall artifacts and magic items be distributed too like in the artifacts game?
a) absolutely
b) no

P.S.: Morkilus, Huntsman, Folket, RonD and Arralen have reserved player slots till they state otherwise because they already showed interest in the old thread http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

Thanks for reserving a spot for me, but I'll give it up if anyone else is interested and all the spots are taken, since I'm in 3 games already. I'm not sure about starting rules, since I'm pretty inexperienced, but... sounds like you're interested in getting the game off to a fast start.

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

1. For the Roman nations, you already made the obvious suggestion in the other thread, Broken Empire and Pythium.

2. Again as on your map, except that T'ien Ch'i doesn't belong in Europe, so I'd replace them with Jotunheim. I'd also suggest Arco in Palestine, just so that the Roman nations don't have a monopoly of Astral magic.

3. I'd say yes to conquering sea provinces. If the map has seas, might as well use them http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

4. I'd prefer that the Roman Nations are strong, but that there are around 6 Barbarian nations. Victory for the Romans is to hold 2 Barbarian capitals (it migh be easy for them to cooperate and rush Ulm), victory for the Barbarians is to sieze either Rome or Byzantium.

5. See 4.

6. Oh, 50% http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

7. No.

8. If there were 6 Barbarian nations, it would be appropriate for the Roman nations to have 3 castles each.

9. No. Research will be fast enough without any added boost, at least for the Roman nations.

10. Undecided, but with slight preference for national - if someone can come up with an appropriate set of monsters, I wouldn't object.

11. I like the idea that the Roman nations hold more territory and castles but must use human pretenders, while the Barbarians can use anything they want, and are strongly encouraged to use monsters or Titans. It might even be fun to specify the most thematic pretenders - i.e. Jotunheim must use a Son of Neifel, etc.

12. Possibly, depending on balance. It is going to be hard to balance things, but the Roman powers starting with some "ancient artifacts" might be thematic.

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

1, Broken Empire and Pythium, a must.

2, I would like a theme of all monsters or all human with monster pretenders. A all monster with 4 barbarian tribes would be Pangea (possibly carrioin woods), Jotunheim, Abysia and C'tis. Or perhaps exchanging or adding Caelum.

As humans Man, Ulm, Marignon, Vanheim, Then Chi and Arcosephale works great.

3, no, but I will with whatever the majority say.

4 and 5, I agre with Truper

6, no idea, perhaps low, with barbarians starting with some extra special sites.

7, no

8, One fortress facing each opponent and one fortified City in Rome and Byzantium.

9, I think romes research should be somewhat crippled, so that they will have to relay on national troops facing a mystical enemy. Perhaps forcing romans to take drain 3. The two roman empires will have much more income then the others, so they will outsprint the others in research unless we do something and I would feel better the other way around.

10, national troops only.

11, I like the theme about I like the theme about roman steel agianst the unknown worlds magic, so I want romans to have humans while the barbarians have more mytical creatures.

12, no, but I may v'be convinced if someone has a good idea.

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

1. BE/Pythium
2. The suggestions so far make sense.
3. Yes I would prefer that this be a *dom2* game with teams and a particular theme. I am not in favor of trying to make this some sort of "alternate history war game" (AHWG). Outlawing sea provinces would make sense for the AHWG, but not for dom2.
4. ? Maybe for the Romans to occupy some percentage of the original barbarian provinces. Maybe even require the Romans to build forts in some percentage of the originally barbarian provinces (so the provinbces are truly civilized). But I'm flexible.
5. see 4.
6. 50. Something that doesn't swing the balance too far either way.
7. Not tried that, so I suppose I have no opinion.
8. Either way is OK. I suspect the Romans would build castles if they start with them.
9. no
10. Adding a few monsters for the barbarians might be fun, but it could also allow an early exploit if someone thinks of something clever.
11. Either way is OK with me. Truper's idea might be fun.
12. No. I think it will be tricky enough to have this game balanced as is.

If Folket's idea of Romans required to take drain is adopted - count me out. I understand his rationale, but the idea of playing a magically crippled Pythium doesn't appeal to me.

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

i agree with what others say but i think there should be atleast a few barbarian monsters

ps: are there any free spaces left because in my current mp game im gona die soon

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

RonD, since we start with so many provinces there will be no such thing as magicaly crippled. Everyone will be able to afford to research.

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

Shovah, there should be one spot open assuming Truper is playing too. If not, you can have mine; I'm not dying in Artifacts any time soon (unless there is a big conspiracy afoot)

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

is it a barbarian spot? is yours?

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

Yes, I imagine it would be though I still don't know who's playing or not.

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

I'm going to have to bow out of this as well. Something's come up in Real Life and I'm just not going to have the time. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif Have fun!

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

i wouldnt mind being jotunheim if they are added. if not just tell me who there is and i will have to chose

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

Summary of the rule Poll:
1. BE + Pythium
2. Since RonD said he agrees with the above suggestions i didn't count his vote since it was not specific enough.
The 6 winning nations are:
- 3 Votes
Arco
- 2 Votes
Mari
Ulm
Vanheim
Jotunheim
Man

Machaka, Tien Chi, Ctis, Abysia and Pan got 1 vote.

3. Conquering the seas will be allowed. RonD summed it up nicely http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

4. + 5.
Trupers suggestion:
6. 50%
7. Vanilla or rather CB supply + resources
8. Number of castles is up for discussion. Truper's and Folket's suggestions are very similiar though and the reasoning behind is imho good.

Up for discussion is though if the free extra castles the Romans get should be the same type as the castle they chose with their pretender design. Where exactly they get their free castles is also up for discussion.

9. Truper and Ron want vanilla research.
Folketts suggestion has some appeal but otoh at least pythium is meant to research fast and they need it imho. Their troops are only so-so.
So i vote for no special research rules also.

10. The barbarians will get a few starting monsters. Folket voted against it but Truper and Ron said some monsters might be ok.
Because the barbarians will have not very much provinces at the start some upkeepfree monsters like cave dragons, wyverns etc. are imo both thematic and a good solution to give the barbarians a small boost without hampering their economy too much.

11. I like Truper's and Folket's ideas.
Let's say the romans have to chose humans while the barbarians should chose monsters. Maybe we should ban certain "unthematic" pretenders like VQs for the barbarians.
If humans should be disallowed for the barbarians is also open for discussion.

12. Folket was undecided and RonD voted against artifacts.
I like Trupers suggestion though to give the Romans a few ancient artifacts to balance with the Barbarians.
Since the Romans will have human only pretenders i think it will be a cool idea to give them a few artifacts.

I will now prepare a beta version of the map and offer it for download.

One additional minor question is open for discussion:
Which indystrength should i chose for the sea provinces?

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

Why is the VQ unthematic? Transylvania, home of the vampire legend, would theoretically be a barbarian province if I remember my Roman history correctly.

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

but not really thematic with any of the chosen barbarian nations

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

Don't know about anyone else, but I'm ready for a Transylvania mod. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Complete with werewolves, wereboars, and lots of BATS. It would probably have to have a death theme though, so http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

ulm black forest any-one?

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

Heh. Did the new Underworld come out where you are? Who wouldn't be ready for Transylvania, if Kate Beckinsale in tight leather was involved. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

(Although - wereboars - sounds more like Stephen Erickson, brit author)

Re: Barbarian Invasion - Rule Discussion
 

Sorry about the recent silence. I have university stress atm but only till february 9th.
So check back in 2 weeks we will get the game running soon after february 9th. Or at least i hope so http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif