Question for next balance mod.
 

It seems to me that some races have unnecessarily needed "free points" which gives them a bigger advantages than races that don't. Basically I'm speaking of races such as Caelum, Jotunheim, C'tis, Abysia and even Ermor to some extent. Races that are already powerful so why do they require the free points extra from climate?

Re: Question for next balance mod.
 

Well, I have only played the demo, so I am not very reliable, but it could be that the races are designed to rely on those extra points. So maybe they're units are more expensive for the same effectiveness? I believe, also, that they still suffer the damage of lower weather scales, they just get bonuses to make up for it.

Re: Question for next balance mod.
 

I think that's the theory but I don't think it quite makes up for it .. 120 points is A LOT. Especially when you look at Abysia and Jotun's national troops, which while expensive are pretty effective.

Re: Question for next balance mod.
 

Well just try those races in multiplayer. If they are so good with the free picks, they should be picked first most often. Oddly enough that is rarely the case http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif .

Re: Question for next balance mod.
 

Well in all the games I've played, Jotun seems pretyt popular. =)

Re: Question for next balance mod.
 

Well by giving some races bigger advantages it allows more variation when going against AI or human opponents.
For example if an experienced player wants to introduce a rookie to the game most likely the rookie will be suggested to take Ermor. And the experienced gamer would play one of the weaker races and a weaker pretender. As a result a good game can be played... if all the races are equal then the only way a veteran could easily introduce a rookie would be by editing the .map file or installing a mod.

Re: Question for next balance mod.
 

I'm not so sure about that ... since the experienced player can just not use all his points to handicap himself. =)

Re: Question for next balance mod.
 

Exactly the same reponse for your original post. If the experienced player views Ermor has having too many points he simply can just not use all his points to handicap himself. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Question for next balance mod.
 

What nations are you comparing to? Pythium, Arco, R'lyeh, etc.? They all have rather effective troops.

Re: Question for next balance mod.
 

Temperature scale isn't all good. Every pick the temperature differs from your nation's preferred, you lose income, resources and supplies. Unless you have strong dominion, seasons effect this. Unless your dominions spreads very fast, you'll have to preach in conquered provinces before they are in your preferred temperature, and then wait until they catch up with the warmth.

The nations that need spesific temperature need high dominion, possibly with a special theme improving dominion /temperature spread.

Also, some nations require less resources. E.g. Mictlan can survive with Sloth 2 or 3 AND use its many national units (mainly Jaguar Warriors, of course). Jotunheim can't, especially not Niefelheim. Pythium starts with 7 gems, and has free communion slaves. The thing is, many of the nations have something special, something that makes them worth it.


It's also often the case of how you play, as well. I don't remember how Gandalf used to say it, but the nations are just tools which the player must use. A player must choose a correct tool for a spesific strategy, and e.g. Pangaea can be deadly stealth nation. Gandalf has these wonderful stories of Pangaea scouting provinces with the Black Harpies, then conquering a province via Call of the Wild with (possibly) some stealth support, then building a castle, lab, temple with the stealthy commanders - and when your enemy finds your "capital", he'll be very confused! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

EDIT: you don't recruit provinces...

Re: Question for next balance mod.
 

Oh I didn't realize that about the temperature scale. At first I literally thought there was no downside to taking those points.

Re: Question for next balance mod.
 

also, i've found, that if you feel taht way, then just don't take the races you think have a disadvantage. the vets will gladly take them and whoop you with them.

for example, i find undead very weak, because they just get banished away by the groups. i know it's not the case, especially with soulgate's MR, but i still feel that way, so i dont' play undead races, generally.

Re: Question for next balance mod.
 

I have been invoked by name. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Learning this game comes in stages. It usually starts with thinking that Ermor kicks ***. Then Ulm is the ultimate. etc etc. The lesson to learn is that there is no best, there is only pros and cons.

This is not a "chess balance" type of game with equal pieces just a different color. Its a rock-paper-scissors balance. And its not even at playing piece levels like most R/P/S balance games. Its at nation level. They all can beat someone and they all have trouble with someone. They all have advantages and disadvantages that CAN make them your best choice, and it can take a year to explore them all. If it looks like an automatic choice, look again. If it looks like a worthless choice, examine it harder.

EVENTUALLY (well beyond the worth of the cost of the game which is what I LOVE about it. You really get your moneys worth) you might get an understanding of what each of them can do well. Then you will have an idea of which of them will serve YOUR style of playing. There is no best, there is only pros and cons. The "best" will be whichever nation YOU can play the best. And it will not have anything to do with what nation someone else plays best so dont even bother thinking about that.

For me (just as an example).. Ulm meant tank commander. Didnt suit me. Ermor meant swarm. Didnt suit me. Jotunheim meant defensive which I did pretty well. Arcos meant "dam burst" strategy which I let my brother-in-law always play in our games because he did it better. Tien-Chi worked well for barbarian horde tactics which my son loved to play. Man was air-drop which I did well on large maps doing the chicken-pox strategy.

I fell in love with Pangaea. For one thing I have always loved to focus on whatever everyone else is writing off to figure out what good it is. And then because it fit my style. I love being the surprise. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Gandalf Parker