National Units and Summoned Units
 

Great news it appears some new national spells now exist... making each nation more unique during the game. I'm pulling this topic which evolved from another topic which Illwinter can use as a quick reference. A new thought which springs to mind is if national troops could be valuable in ways other than just the battlefield thus gamers would see them for the majority of the game. I will update this original post at least once a week.


Most summoned units have multiple advantages over national troops. Some of these include:
Never flee in battle
Never needs food
No gold upkeep
More powerful

Ways national troops can be improved:
1) Allow most nations to have their national troops increase population for whatever province they reside. suggested by NTJedi
2) Allow national troops to be upgraded making their gold/food upkeep more acceptable. suggested by: DominionsFAN
3) Allow some method for national troops to be upgraded with gems. suggested by NTJedi
4) Allow national troops to provide increased morale, defense and attack for province defense... seems logical their presence within the province would have this effect. Perhaps for this bonus to work the national troops would have to be equal to the province defense, thus 10 PD needs 10 national troops for the bonus. suggested by NTJedi
5) Providing national troops with increased statistics by receiving faster experience upgrades and the ability to receive higher experience thus 10 stars instead of 5 stars. suggested by Sandman
6) Providing more summoned troops with a gem, gold and/or food upkeep making national troops more feasible. suggested by VedalkenBear and Oversway
7) Add additional national troops which can be summoned from spells specific for each nation. suggested by: DominionsFAN
8) Remove gold/food upkeep and raise morale for SOME national units which helps balance the summoned and national units. suggested by VedalkenBear and Oversway
9) Provide improved/unique bonuses for national troops such as 25% resistances or other traits. suggested by Nerfix
10) Allow new research path which improves statistics of national troops. suggested by Cainehill
11) Allow new buildings such as an Armory, Forge, etc. where national troops can be made stronger. suggested by Cainehill
12) New national spells (like global) which are casted to improve existing national troops. suggested by Cainehill

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

I don't like number one. It's gamey and illogical.

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

During wars in history soldiers are known to socialize with local females... only for nations like Ermor would this not be the scenario.
Currently the game has no method for restoring a population which has been almost dropped to zero, because the few events and one global spell only effect a percentage. Since the game has many spells, effects(pillaging), and events which lower population I felt this was an effective and needed method for increasing population.

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

Why didn't anyone suggest population to naturally increase?

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

Just give a 'colonize' ability to a few units - Man's Forester, Ulm's Engineer, for example. They can add 200 (say) people to a province with a population of less than 4000 every turn.

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

Marignon gets the Don Juan hero, who seduces 100 women each month. Population increases by 1d10*10 after 9 months http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

100 each month O=
That's more than 3 women a day!

And in a few years he will even break King Solomon's record! (Although unlike Solomon, they won't all be his wives)

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

What is that guy? some kind of hive mind? Time paradox who lives each day thrice?


Mental note, exicute the mind controller. mind control is forbidden.

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

IIRC, one of the more famous and flamboyant basketball players (Wilt Chamberlain) of the pre-AIDS days supposedly did, mmm, 20,000 women? That'd be 3 a day for 18.26 years.

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

lol and if you think that it is true, you are a tard. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

Kid, considering that you and I have received warnings from the moderators for our previous discourse (personally I think they should have banned you for foul mouthed abusive personal messages), you probably ought to learn to just say "no" when you think about writing another insulting reply to something I write. For that matter, when you ever think about replying to something I write.

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

Well that's the intention of the growth scale however it only does a percentage thus even farmlands with 20 population can never recover.
A natural flat increase across the board might upset those playing Ermor which matches their theme.

Since nations like Mictlan can't have troops to match the quality/power/upkeep of summoned troops some benefit(s) outside the battlefield can be setup to make them needed for the majority of the game.

That's interesting... I'm eager to see what the other heroes can do.

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

I have suggested it repeated times:

<font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre>
P: current pop number of the province
B: 'theorectical' pop number the terrain starts with
S: number of growth scales
G: growth-%tage
T: new taxpayers you get per turn

Between 0 and 2*B and in positive or 0 growth dominion,
pop would grow as follows (death scale works as before):

|2*B |
T = |--- - 1| * G * (S+1) * P
| P |
</pre><hr />
Still not perfect, but would go a long way to make populated provinces something to actually protect and keep under your growth scale. And give some incentive to choose one, which no-one does with the current scales values and growth (die-off?) model:
It gives 1x growth at starting pop, cuts off the growth at 2x the starting pop and even results in declining pop if the province gets overcrowded for some reason.
But it gives reasonable growth if there's a big empty province, eg. 2000 pop in a big grassland which could accommodate 22000 pop without problem.

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

I sure hope something is done to national units. Then I can stop calling this game Summinions II. It's the only thing about this game that keeps me from playing it often; I wonder what percentage of the viable strategies out there involve summoning at least a portion of your armies.

=$= Big J Money =$=

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

Well, I guess the vanilla game wont have "strong" national units. Modding will be powerful enough to change this in a way, I will add summonable national troops to my TC mod with different levels. Well they will be summoned as well, but those wont be "monsters" but regular troops with better stats and equipment.

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

I think that the easiest way to do it would have some sort of minor bless effect based on the pretenders current path levels be added to national units. Being that the largest problem is that they do not scale well, this would help increase their power as the game goes on, hopefully increasing their longevity.

Re: National Units and Summoned Units
 

Most of them do, but that's hardly a problem. Would you rather the game had useless magic like the Age of Wonders series?