GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

A Republican congressman (Curt Weldon, PA 7th) has publicly praised an anti-Bush video. And not just any anti-Bush video, but the one by BYU physics professor Steven E. Jones which accuses the Bush administration of deliberately allowing 9/11 to happen and placing explosives in the three tallest World Trade Center buildings to make sure that they would be totally destroyed on 9/11. Unbelievable? Just have a look here:

http://republican.meetup.com/92/boar...thread=1870074

The anti-Bush video that opened Weldon's eyes can be seen here:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...34652002408586

http://www.911blogger.com/2006/02/dr...nar-video.html

A bombshell from the FBI: The Muckraker Report spoke with Rex Tomb, Chief of Investigative Publicity for the FBI. When asked why there is no mention of 9/11 on Bin Laden’s Most Wanted web page, Tomb said, “The reason why 9/11 is not mentioned on Usama Bin Laden’s Most Wanted page is because the FBI has no hard evidence connecting Bin Laden to 9/11.”
For details, see
http://www.teamliberty.net/id267.html

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Interesting stuff. I wonder if there will be a movie?

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Is there an independent press source for this?

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Just the coolaid drinking kind.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Yeah I think something from a major news network would be nice. CNN, BBC, Fox, ect...

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

I don't know why people choose to believe this conspiracy theory that the US Government, specifically GW, organized the 9/11 attacks and that the towers were taken down via controlled blasts. Any one who has half a brain would know that structurally the building collapse under its own weight and those "blasts" were the result of air being forced out from between the floors as the compression from the collapsing floor above it came down. In fact the very people who build the buildings proved conclusively, that’s without a doubt, how and why the buildings fell.

As to the missile attack on the pentagon... ok tell that to the families of the people who died both on the plane and in the building.

This is akin to the nuts that went around saying Clinton knew that the bombing in Oklahoma (sp) was going to happen. Its just pure tripe being voiced by people out to sell books and make a name for themselves in the conspiracy community.

The sad truth about this is that any good American may not believe this crap, but would, and unfortunetly have, die to defend a persons right to say it.


EDIT
Is Isriel behind the 9/11 attacks? Forgive me for saying this, but after reading a bit from those links you provided, I get the strong impression that this might be the underlying theme here. Whether or not my speculation is correct I would like to point out that this could be a damn good book idea. I make no joke here, this would make one hell of a good book if a writer could do such a story justice. While no such book may never be written, it does spark ones imagination and desire to see such a book written.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

People want to believe these kinds of things because it takes less work to verify gossip than fact.

There never was a conspiracy by this administration to do 9/11, maybe exploit it, but not to do it.

It's common knowledge that these buildings are designed, incase of catastrophic failure, to collapse down on top of itself as to avoid collatoral damage to the surrounding buildings.

And doesn't ann coulter of fox news make the assertation that Clinton was behind 9/11? It doens't matter, a large majority of her work is turning out to be copied from others.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Ann is, well Ann. What can we say that hasn't already been said. She scares even me. But I have to be honest, I love the fact that she is just as good at bling bling flinging as the people on the left. Even the right needs the occassional crack pot to stir up nonsense and raise a few eye brows once in a while. Besides, some of what she sputs on about does make sense in an odd, yet far off logic, that only a twisted mind like hers, and those opposite of her on the left, could come up with.

I say let them fight it out, and who ever wins, we lock up in a dark hole someplace and force them to watch endless reruns of Three's company and the Waltons.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

I thought that's why the right had Fred Phelps? But I think Ann coulter hurts the right more than her anti-leftist rants, seriously. She doesn't know the difference between satan and satin at times.


I miss the era of .74 cent gas and neutral-point-of-view news.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

I tend to think that there is too much TV, internet blogs, and news radio in our lives.

Lets just say for arguements sake that the US Government, and our beloved President, a man who has not been credited with an over abundance of brains, masterminded the 9/11 attacks. How did they do this in such a short period of time? Why did Al Gore fight so hard to take the Presidency away from Bush after Bush won, or stole depending upon your point of view the election? I think its because Clinton and Gore knew that 9/11 was going to happen and they had it all worked out as to how they were going to blame it on Israil and the NRA. Lets face it, 8 and a half months isn't enough time to hire, train, and mastermind a major operation as those of 9/11. So the fault, if the government is behind it, doesn't lie with Bush and boys, its lies with Clinton and Company.

Think about that the next time some one spins a novel idea for a conspiracy about Bush and his people being behind the 9/11 attacks. Do the math people, just do the math.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Hard evidence that proves that 9/11 was not a government plot.

Popular mechanics

Now the far lefties will say that PM is really a government funded magazine out to promote the false evidence and hide the proof that the Government is behind the 9/11 attacks and that the buildings were brought down by controlled blasts..... *shakes head at their stupidity*

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

The Popular Mechanics bunk has been debunked:

Killtown's Rebuttal
Debunking PM #1
Debunking PM #2
Alex Jones Talks PM

And yes, this has been made into a movie called Loose Change. Originally it was supposed to be fiction similar to V For Vendetta but the producer found more and more real-life evidence for government complicity. Vanity Fair recently reviewed the movie here: http://s15.invisionfree.com/Loose_Ch...showtopic=7671

You can see Loose Change and other 9/11 movies at http://www.universalseed.org

And even the Presbyterian Church is waking up to the truth about 9/11:
http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2006/131/12.0.html

http://www.sendmeabuck.com./Quicksta...everforget.gif

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Thanks for the links. I have to be honest with you, I really don't believe those people who are attempting to prove that the government is behind 9/11 and the destruction of the two towers. Simply put those people are so off base that NO ONE takes them seriously. That is NO ONE with half a brain and any sort of IQ when it comes to structual design. You cannot debunk physics and the laws of nature.

As to your image there, we all know about how easy it is to doctor photo's, and we all know that many other buildings were severely damaged and later where dilibrately brought down because they were not structurally sound. Any one with an agenda could easily make a damning looking photo or video with enough talent, money, and desire to do so. Besides we cannot see the other side of the building so we do not know how damaged it truly is. For all we know, the other side of that building could be completely gone all the way to the back facete and that is what we are watching fall. Again there is no proof that the destruction of that building was dilibrate on 9/11 or that it even collapsed on 9/11.

I should tell you that I think this conspiracy that the GW and the US Government is behind the felling of the two towers to be an absolute joke that boarders on the histerically funny and suspect that most other people do as well. However given how many poeple where forever harmed by the events of that day, I can only now look at this nonsense that the US Government is behind 9/11 as an attempt to do more harm. A second wave of terrorism so to speak, one that supports what the terrorists did by trying to deny they even exist. I hate to say this, but only a handful of people actually support these conspiracy theories and those folks are often the subjects of water cooler jokes.

Now I would believe it, somewhat, if the people who are spreading this theory about would admit that GW had nothing to do with it and that it was Clinton and Gore who were behind it. They are devious enough to do something like this and blame it on the NRA or Israel. We all know how badly Gore contested loosing the election in 2000. Then just 8.5 short months later 9/11 went down. SOund more plausable to me that if our own government was behind this, that it was Clintons government and not Bushes that are the culprits. You can't hide from the math, and given just how much some folks consider Bush to be an idiot, its is really difficult to believe that he could master mind such a thing in such a short amount of time.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Slaughtermeyer, those sources are hardly credible. For one they never address the 400-odd missing people from the four crashed flights.

For two, one suggests a NUKE brought down the towers. A small, bunker busting nuke..which would still produce a significant amount of radiation and would *not* lead to the towers falling in on themselves. Reach much?

For three, they reference each other and use THAT as proof. Excuse me if I fail to find a conspiracy site citing another conspiracy site as reliable.

Site #2 *****es about it being a "hit piece" and then tries to rebutt it the same way. They also deliberately misinterpret things people said- asking to pull the firefighters out becomes "blow up the building". (I have *never* heard anyone use the term "pull it" to refer to blowing something up..but that's what they claim)

They also note the towers were designed to take a hit from a plane. What most of them don't mention is that the towers were designed to take a hit from a Boing 707. The biggest 707 has a maximum takeoff weight of 333,600 pounds. The 767 on the other hand has a maximum takeoff weight of 410,000 pounds. That extra 80k pounds probably screws things up just a little.

Your last link doesn't work. Here's a Google Cache link:
http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:q...=clnk&cd=1

Its also a publishing note, not an official church stance.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Atrocities, the problem with your Evil-Clintonian and Gore theory is that it doesn't take it account the Bush Sr's relationship with Bin Laden. Mainly the part where as head of the CIA, Bush Sr screwed the taliban and bin laden's fledgling group. It also misses all the businesses and individuals that stood to gain from such an event.

I don't see bush's administration being responible for 9/11 (except in ignoring the warning signs and later exploiting it more than george lucas with a prequel) as Bush really just wanted to get Saddam and please is saudi backers and religion base.

I don't see Clinton's administration being behind it because he had nothing to gain. Think about it and there is nothing clinton or the democrats could gain from it.

The 2000 Election with Gore is something to be looked at - but not until after the current leadership and party drones are out. I'm reminded of Lyndon Johnson's congressional run and there was questions about ballot issues. In particular, one picture from that event was a group of lyndon johnson supporters standing on/against a ballot transport box grinning.


But back to the point.

Using lex parsimoniae, law of succinctness, and applying it to this. Which requires fewer assumptions to be true.

1.) The theory that Terrorist, seeking to invent 9/11/01 as a terrible tragedy by destroying the economic, military and political centers/landmarks of the united states over religious differences they have with us. (ie. Terrorist view America as Evil Incarnate)
2.) The Theory that terrorist did the same as Theory 1 as revenge against bush - not knowing the outcome of the 2000 elections when they sent the plan into motion.
3.) Bush Administration plotted and organized the attack to push forward a neo-conservative agenda and religious-right agenda in america to steer the country towards the leave-it-beaver style america of the 1940's while eroding basic freedoms - not knowing the outcome of the 2000 elections when they sent the plan into motion (unless it was rigged).
4.) Clinton's Administration plotted and oganized the attack for some unknown reason or as suggested, target the NRA or Israel (who prefers clinton over bush anyday of the week) and did so not knowing the outcome of the 2000 elections (unless it was rigged).
5.) Al Gore planned and organized the attack for some bizzare reason that not even al gore could fathom. etc. etc. etc.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

On a side note, Slaughtermeyer's sites appear to be individual conspiracy theorist presenting their own "Truthology" as fact when it's really some guy playing connect the dots with the back of cereal box.

The Vanity Fair link is nothing more than a review and contains no verification of the facts.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Whereas the PM site has facts and even has many world renowned structural engineers providing their expert opinions based upon facts that can and have been verified by both on site evidence, video tape evidience, scientific evidence, witness statements, construction record, design records, structural engineering reports, computer anyalists, and so so much more. What do these conspiracy people have? Nothing. They have nothing but hersay, half baked rumors, Charlie Sheen, and a whole host of other non-informed people. No structural enginering experts, well none that actually have a reputation, experience, or are even known or respected within the structural engineering community. They have, and I hate to say this, people who appear to be little more than crack pots, conspiracy theory fanatics, mentally ill, and grossely mis-informed people along with a single professor, who I might add, also happens to believe that Bill O'Reilly is out to kill him. Need I say more?

They have no real facts. What facts they think they have evaperate into nothingness upon even the most mild scrutiny.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

If "the PM site has facts and even has many world renowned structural engineers providing their expert opinions based upon facts that can and have been verified by both on site evidence, video tape evidience, scientific evidence, witness statements, construction record, design records, structural engineering reports, computer anyalists, and so so much more," why can't the NIST come up with an explanation for why WTC building 7 collapsed?

When Dr. Sunder of the NIST was asked why the fate of the building was barely mentioned in the final report, he replied "“But truthfully, I don’t really know. We’ve had trouble getting a handle on building No. 7.”
http://newyorkmetro.com/news/features/16464/index6.html

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Slaughtermeyer, I cannot answer your question about Building 7 except to speculate that perhaps it was not discussed because it is simply not important. As to whether or not it collapsed on 9/11 or later is unknown to me. I do recall that several of the other WTC buildings did suffor considerable damage during the collapse of WTC 1 and 2. Given the proximity of WTC 7 to WTC 1 and 2, it is more likely than not, that its collapse, if indeed it did collapse on 9/11 on its own, was as a direct result of damage it sustained during the collapse of WTC 1 and 2.

There is absolutely no evidence what so ever that supports that WTC 7 was intentionally destroyed on 9/11 by the US Government. None.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

But there is evidence that WTC 7 was intentionally destroyed on 9/11, because the owner admitted that it was destroyed. You can hear Larry Silverstein's admission that the building was "pulled" (demolition industry lingo for imploded) about 3 1/2 minutes into the following documentary:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...56054823827684

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Like I said, I don't know about WTC 7. Thanks for the info though, it certianly does beg the question WTF. While I don't subscribe to the theory that the Government was behind 9/11, questions do remain as to whether or not our Government was aware of, or in some sick, however small, way duplicit in those events. Like I said, I would be more willing to accept these theories if they squarly identified the Clinton Gore administration over George Bush.

I am sure if I took the time to look into the WTC 7, I would find that the evidence supports what I said later. Either the building was taken down after 9/11 because of damage to its structure, or it collapsed one 9/11 because of damage it sustained during the collapse of WTC 1 and 2.

Either way, I sincerely doubt that the US Government was behind the attacks on 9/11.

BTW - I was a caller today on the John Gibbson radio show. William from Vancouver. It aired at 3:47 to 3:49 pm PST. When asked about this conspiracy theory, I had to laugh, and laugh I did. And it was broadcast.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

You don't have to believe that 400 people are "missing" to believe that explosives brought down three of the WTC buildings after passenger jets crashed into two of them.


There's also a 'theory' that holograms and not actual planes hit the WTC. I don't know whether theories like this are deliberately made to discredit the 9/11 truth movement, but they can easily be ignored.

Does MIT engineer Jeff King do that?
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...64959599063248

You can hear that term being used by a demolition worker when another building was blown up, in the first five minutes of this documentary:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...56054823827684

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

The history channel is airing a documentary about the truth of 9/11 sometime this next week. Who know's they might even reviel a bomb shell.

Has any one that was in the 9/11 commission said anything officially that supports the 9/11 truth movements theories about what happened on 9/11?

If Bush and his administration can't keep top secret NSA programs a secret, then why are we to believe that they can keep something as horrific as masterminding the 9/11 attacks a secret?

As to Clinton needing a motive to do this, I don't agree, Clinton would find a way to profit from such a plan, and Gore had a lot to gain if he had been elected. But I say this just because I don't like either man and there is absolutely no proof what so ever that they or any member of the US Government, in either administration, acted in, or help to plan, carry out, or cause the events of 9/11.

I guess what I am trying to promote here is the concept that Bush isn't behind 9/11 and that saying he and his administration is would be like saying that Abraham Lincon fired his own cannons at Fort Sumter and then blamed it on the Confederates in order start the civil war. Its not what happened and no one really would believe it.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

A number of the theories state that it *wasn't* passenger jets that were involved; that was what I was refering to. Reference all the "cruise missile hitting the Pentagon" BS. Also if you don't belive in a theory please mention that and/or refrain from linking to sites that use it as evidence!

No, but ALL your previous reference does. And the first part of the video has no time stamp- it isn't clear if the explosion they're talking about isn't the second plane. The squibs showing are freaking flying debris. And the engineer so much as says: "at this point none of the theories we have make sense."

Never does explain how the people in the building didn't *notice* the prepration for demolition, which is quite extensive. To say nothing of the amount of explosives needed. None of the engineers involved talked? None of the contructions crews did?

The clouds he's mentioning are quite common and appear anytime a building comes down. By the way, watch the controlled demolions of other buildings in these videos carefully. Where does the collapse start? Answer: the bottom. Where did the WTC collapse begin? There's also ONE set of explosion, not the ridiclously complicated "detonation zone" most of these sites espouse. (mostly because falling buildings tend to be rough on the precise placement needed for these things)

That'd be the first time I've heard it mentioned..assuming he isn't talking about pulling the last crew out. These sites are delightfully sneaky about how they do their video and linking.

Case in point- one of them linked to
http://www.civil.northwestern.edu/pe...Papers/405.pdf

as proof of controlled demolition. What it actually shows that if a single floor was damaged to the point where it couldn't bear its load, it'd take the entire tower down. Also explains why the top part of the towers didn't fall.

No other steel structure has collapse from fire- I'll give them that. None of those structures had an aircraft impact followed by a large fire, however.

EDIT: side note on the dust cloud- most of the sites refer to a "pyroclastic cloud", probably quoting the engineer above, who mentions a TYPE of event that produces such dust. It wasn't such a cloud- which is a damn good thing because if was it would have killed everyone for miles around! They are *extremely* hot- the coldest are generally above 100C and it only gets worse from there.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Professor Jones has stated that it would take 10 people each carrying 40 pounds of explosives making 10 trips in order to place sufficient explosives to bring down one of the towers. If the placement of the explosives was outsourced to the Mossad, why would any of their agents want to talk about it? Remember, none of the US government agents who participated in the conspiracy to assassinate Martin Luther King were exposed until 30 years after the event.
http://www.thekingcenter.org/news/trial.html

And it's quite easy to explain how the bomb-sniffing dogs didn't *notice* the preparation for demolition, because Securacom, the firm that handled security for the WTC (and coincidentally had George Bush's brother and cousin as directors) ordered the removal of the dogs during the week prior to 9/11.
http://911research.wtc7.net/cache/wt...y_wtcdogs.html

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

I didn't say a thing about dogs. Just the people going in and out of the building on a daily basis.

And you really don't shave with Occam's Razor, do you? Why outsource to the Mossad for an action on US soil?

Reading that trial transcript is surreal. Conspiracy to commit murder, maximum penalty $400? What the [censored] kind of law is that?

EDIT: by the way, did you think about that before you said it?

4000lb of explosive planted, in 40 pound bundles. 400 trips. And not ONE of these set of a red flag. There was no one who even commented on unusual construction in the building- because you can't just drop a 40lb bomb in an office, they have to be placed properly or they won't do the damage you need (see: 1993 WTC attack).

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Hey Pheonix if the people who support these theories don't want to believe in the truth and choose to subscribe to the concept that is viewed by most normal people as being a crack pot theory promoted by mentally ill and desperate people, then that is their right. I may not subscribe to their views, and to be perfectly honest, find them to be histarically funny, however, I would hope to die rather than tell someone that they don't have the right in this country to speak their minds and state their opinions.

If we shut them up, we shut everyone up and that is a road best not travelled in a seemingly free and democratic society.

Hell don't worry about the folks who buy into this theory, most are ok people who just enjoy a good conspiracy theory, while some are true and genuine crack pots in deep need of profession mental help, most are just nice people who are just ill informed, misguided or are too willing to buy into bull**** rather than do the research on the subject.

Those, such as the ones that Slaughtermeyer has provided links too, validate their theories by quoting each other, or inventing facts based upon assumption and then passing off as real and factual facts. Some have even gone so far as to create bogus "Professionals, video's, and doctored photo's to help support their contention that their theory that the US Government is behind 9/11 is real. When you challenge them, with the real facts, and debunk their facts, they cry foul and hollor cover up. Don't buy into it, this is just a natural defense mechanism designed to help shore up their position. It is what any of us might do to defend our stance on any subject that we believed deeply in.

When it comes to the truth, I think the 70% of America that does not buy into this theory, the 70% who actually knows the year 9/11 occured in, listen to the real professionals who just happen to know what they are talking about because they build and understand the physics behind building construction and structural engineering.

Do you honestly think that the poeple who built the WTC buildings would remain silent if they thought for even a second that they had been dilibrately destroyed by controlled blasts organized by our own government?

Like I said, most people don't take these kind of far out theories seriously. They enjoy hearing about them though, so they can poke fun at those who envisioned them. Its all well in good, in 20 years none of this will matter.

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Of course you won't say a thing about the dogs because it's one of the key pieces of evidence that explosives were placed.

Maybe because Americans might wonder why they were asked to kill other innocent Americans?

It's basically the same [censored] kind of law that says O.J. Simpson does not have to serve any prison time for killing Nicole, even though a court found him guilty of killing her.

Normally, a building of that size has maintenance corridors so you don't have to go into offices to place explosives. And if all of the placement was done at night when virtually nobody was at the center, how would anyone notice?

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Ok, so either I forgot to post or my post vanished into the aether. Odd.

Anyway, AT: I never said they couldn't say what they're saying. Doesn't preclude me from ripping into them, though. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif Anything that can't stand up to critism- conspiracy theory, Presidental policy, local policy, whatever- doesn't deserve to stand.

I've also had it with BS being lifted up as fact because no one bothers to object to it.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Um bad example there. O.J. was NEVER convicted or found guilty of killing her. He was in fact aquitted of her and Ron Goldmans murder. He was however sued in civil court and subsquently found liable for both of their deaths, but not for their murders. It is somewhat important to not distort the truth when it comes to easily verifiable facts.

The problem with objecting to them Pheonix is that its hard to avoid calling them names in order to illustrate how stupid the theories are. You see it would be like calling a retarded person retard. They simply don't understand that they are retarded so calling them retarted is a waste of time.

Since most conspiracy nuts are just ordinary people who are too lazy to get fully informed, or too hate filled to believe the truth, in this instance, GW isn't behind the 9/11 attacks, that they refuse to accept reality. Best to let them say what they want to say, and then walk away laughing at them. Trust me they are used to being laughed at. (Just don't do it too the shapily guy at work, he might come to your office one day and blow your *** away.)

Remember these are the kind of people that if you say the sky is blue on a clear sunny summer day, they will argue with you and say that it is not blue, it is purple. You and every one around you knows the sky is indeed blue, but the conspriracy guy will argue that it is purple until you either get pissed off and knock his *** out, or realize that your arguing with someone too dumb to realize that they are making a complete *** of themselves. And that buy arguing with them, you are being sucked down into their skewed reality. Just ignor the loones and the truth will tend to itself.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9/11_conspiracy_theories

That page pretty much sums it all up in the first box.

You are yet to provide one iota of fact to support your position Slaughtermeyer. You still haven't answered my challenge of Using lex parsimoniae, law of succinctness, and applying it to this. Which requires fewer assumptions to be true.

Instead you supply a veritable endless supply of "truthology" conspiracy nuts.

To me, this means you lack actual facts to support your arguements.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

At least Slaughtermeyer was kind enough to post the information for us in a manor that gave us all a chance to read up on and understand this conspiracy theory. He has also seriously impressed me with his cool headness and willingness to debate the topic without resorting to name calling or other insulting behavior. It is very refreshing and I cannot help but respect him for how he has conducted himself in this discussion.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

The 9/11 commission basically concluded that the FAA and the Pentagon lied to them. The Sept. 11 commission was so frustrated with repeated misstatements by the Pentagon and FAA about their response to the 2001 terror attacks that it considered an investigation into possible deception.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060804/...t11_commission
http://www.infowars.com/print/Sept11...n_911truth.htm

The 9/11 Commission was prevented from conducting a complete impartial and thorough investigation because its executive director was Philip Zelikow. He was a member of the Bush I administration. He got to know Condoleezza Rice very well there – they both served on the National Security Council. When they were between administrations during the Clinton years, they wrote a book together.

When the Bush II administration was coming into power she brought him on to help with the transition and then he was appointed to the foreign advisory board, so he is essentially a member of the Bush White House. And yet, as executive director, he ran the Commission. He had a staff of 70-some; he decided which topics were worth looking into, and which ones were not. When people would come and say, I want to testify to the Commission, I have something important to say, he would decide who would take that testimony. And so on. So essentially the 9/11 Commission was the White House investigating itself.
http://globaloutlook.ca/10P45.htm
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...01821567284154

The Operation Northwoods conspiracy, a 1962 plan approved by all of the Joint Chiefs of Staff to stage a 9/11-style operation by US agents posing as pro-Castro Cubans in order to generate public support for an invasion of Cuba, was not exposed until 35 years later. Fortunately President Kennedy refused to give the go-ahead for this conspiracy.
http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92662

I believe 9/11 would have happened even if Gore had been elected. Because Lieberman was just as willing as Bush to use the US military for the benefit of Israel, I'm sure that a way would have been arranged by the neocons for Gore to contract a fatal illness or 'accident' while in office. For details about the neocons that pushed America into the Iraq war, read this article written by a former Israeli MK in 2003:
http://gush-shalom.org/archives/article242.html

A document published one year before 9/11 by the neocons entitled "Rebuilding America's Defenses" stated that a "catastrophic and catalyzing event – like a new Pearl Harbor" was needed to put their plans into operation.
http://www.reopen911.org/docs/Rebuil...asDefenses.pdf

http://homepage.mac.com/leperous/.Pictures/neocon1.jpg

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

I think I know now why Popular Mechanics refuses to send anyone to the National 9/11 Debate. Here's an interview with a Popular Mechanics "researcher" on the Charles Goyette show:

http://www.911podcasts.com/files/aud...0823-am-c3.MP3

For those who'd rather read an abbreviated transcript:

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

So much for the theory that Israel is beind the attacks of 9/11.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

I pity the fool. I mean really, how stupid is this stuff? Very very very. I am constantly amazed that anyone can repeat it without just falling down and laughing at themselves. Or having to be prepared to give resuscitation to others who are choking with laughter at them. I suppose anyone who expounds this tripe should, just as a civic minded thing to do, learn and be prepared to give CPR.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

The FBI wasn't fooled by that questionable footage, it still believes there is no hard evidence connecting Osama to 9/11 because 9/11 is still not mentioned as one of the crimes for which he is wanted:
http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/terrorists/terbinladen.htm

And I never said that Israel was responsible for the entire operation. All indications are that Cheney outsourced the recruitment of the hijackers to the head of Pakistani intelligence because he was the one who was caught ordering the wiring of $100,000 to lead hijacker Mohammed Atta. The Mossad was the most likely culprit for placing the explosives in the three tallest World Trade Center buildings because Mossad agents were caught celebrating and filming "Mission Accomplished" on 9/11.
http://www.sundayherald.com/37707

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

ROTFLMAO - I have to say it, if they gave out and award for putting things into context, you my friend would have won it hands down with this statement. Job well done.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

It's actually not exactly. It sounds trite but buildings fall more or less straight down because that's the direction gravity is pulling them. Skyscrapers are designed to withstand stress loads primarily in a downward direction. They don't actually fall over like trees because the structural supports fail and they collapse downard way before the center of gravity can get out to the point where the building would topple over sideways.

You could build a building that could be tipped over far enough that it would fall over instead of collapsing down, but it would take so much extra reinforcing material that it wouldn't have much usable interior space for offices and stuff. Kind of like a tree. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

WTC7 fell for the same reason the twin towers fell, uncontrolled fire burned long enough to weaken the structrural support members to the point of collapse. A fire in any structure that is left to burn will eventually weaken and destroy enough supports to cause it to collapse. This is true for steel frame buildings as well as wood ones. It just take a little longer for steel and concrete structures. You don't see buildings collapse during fire much these days because the fire departments do a pretty good job of putting them out before they get to the point of structural collapse. But on 9/11 the fires were at such a height and and burned so hot because of the jet fuel that the fire department couldn't get to it in time.
The collapse of the north and south towers, on top of killing hundreds of fireman, choked off the are with debris so that noone that was left could get into a position where they could fight the fires burning in the surrounding buidlings.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

I suggest you forward your explanation for the collapse of WTC7 to Dr. Sunder of the NIST. Dr. Sunder may find it helpful because he has been unable to come up with an explanation of his own. When asked for an explanation of the collapse of WTC7 and why the collapse of the building was barely mentioned in the NIST report Dr. Sunder replied: "But truthfully, I don’t really know. We’ve had trouble getting a handle on building No. 7.”

http://newyorkmetro.com/news/features/16464/index6.html

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

9/11 was the work of Usama ibn Ladin and his nutcase terrorist group. 'Nuff said.

Google:

• 911 Myths.
• Popular Mechanics.
• Screw Loose Change (blog and movies).

The only thing that made me wonder about Loose Change was that Usama wrote with his right hand. That's it. And, of course, it didn't take much research to find out [hint: he's an Islamic fundamentalist].

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

None of those sources even try to debunk the fact that the source of the anthrax in the post-9/11 anthrax attacks was traced to the Army Medical Research Institute of Infectious Diseases at Fort Detrick. Top Bush Administration officials started taking the anti-anthrax antibiotic Cipro one week before the first anthrax attack took place.

http://www.judicialwatch.org/1967.shtml

http://holt.house.gov/list/press/nj12_holt/121206.html

http://infowars.net/articles/decembe...206Anthrax.htm

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Actually, people did notice quite a bit of suspicious activity in the Twin Towers during the weekend prior to 9/11. You can find out more about this the final 30 minutes of the "9/11 Mysteries" documentary.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...90071483512003

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

You really need to let this go my friend. The point of silliness has long since passed into farce obsession. If by any remote possibly, and I do mean remote, that this whole thing was a Government set up, then it sure as hell was set in motion LONG before the silly Bush man was ever elected to office.

Also I had this accident last August where a sand bank just gave out from under me as I rode my quad over it. There was no advanced warning, it just happened at the precise moment I started to cross it. Do you think the guys who made these documentaries, you know the ones who keep calling accredited scientist and engineering professionals liars, would make a movie about the conspiracy to collapse the sand bank out from under me?

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Wow...I didn't think people seriously believed some of the crap that has been expounded here...

US/Israeli conspiracy...yeah, that's plausible...much more plausible than Islamic funamentalists who despise 'Western' cultures and their 'decadence'...

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

Truthfully I didn't pay much attention to this thread after my post so I just noticed yoru reply. What's outrageous is this New York Magazine article you link too came out a full year after the Popular Mechanics Aritcle, but they are giving quotes from Dr. Saunders from early in the investigation before all the facts were in. They've conveinently ignored any evidence that doesn't fit their conspiracy theory.

From the Pop Mech March 2005
If you ignore the facts, it's easy to come up with many plausible theories. But it takes a real art for self-denial to ignore inconvienent truths like "gravity makes things fall".

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

9/11 was not a conspiracy.Only the far left liberal nutjobs claim that,

The only real thing GW needs to be impeached for is allowing the flood of criminal aliens and terrorists across our borders and even considering the fact of allowing them amnesty.Not to mention the fact these illegals dont pay taxes yet are given medicare,EIC,and other services all on the tax payers dime.Bush has truely sold out those who put him into office.Im totally disgusted!

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

You guys really just need to ignore these kind of conspiracy threads. No matter how much evidence you post proving that these conspiracy theories are just half backed inventions of twisted and ill informed low brow anti-American whack jobs, they won't believe you. For them ignoring the truth, the evidence, and laws of physics is a way of life. Hell they made a movie that is prominently featured on both Google Video and You-Tube. These two seemingly left wing loving sites tout this tripe filled movie as being the best movie ever made about the events of 9/11. I guess fiction does sell. Most people who have seen this movie will admit that it is complete bunk, but hey, the conspiracy loving dim wits of the world believe in it so who the hell are we to say to them that they are crazy? Oh wait, that would be inferred by our laughing hysterically at them as they continue to believe that George Bush was behind the 9/11.

What I love is now that this movie is out, nut jobs use it as proof that their whacked out theories are valid. And the movie uses these whacked out nut jobs theories as proof that there was a conspiracy. Its just one whacked out nut job pointing to another whacked out nut job and saying "well he said it happened" back and forth like some retard circle jerk.

In fact that is the best way to describe this whole 9/11 conspiracy thing; a whacked out crazy left wing circle jerk.

Re: GOP CONGRESSMAN SEES THE LIGHT!!!
 

- Geo

Excellent comment. This one is an award winning statement. Well said Geo.