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Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
Almost 2 years since the last release, version 0.16.00 of Adamant Mod has finally been released.
There are many, many changes in this update, which you can review in the History file. Download links: Torrent (need uTorrent or similar) Adamant FQM - 46.6 MB (all images) Adamant Full - 21.6 MB (no system images) Adamant Lite - 2.6 MB (no shipsets) |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
46 megs! OMG that is one huge mod! How do the AI work?
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Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
Good question; why don't you play and tell me? hehehe. Seriously though, I updated the research and design files to incorporate energy and machine races. I didn't do a tremendous amount of testing though...
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Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
Congratulations on getting this version out. I wish I had the time and resolve to get v0.30 out of Space Food Empires!
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Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
Yes definatly congrats on the new version. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif This is a very impressive mod Fyron. Expansive with lots to explore. Job well done.
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Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
Nicely done. I can see I'm gonna be playing this one for quite some time...
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Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
Oh dear... the "Adamant FQM" file has already used up 1.6 GB of bandwidth. This month will be a tight squeeze. Please use the torrent people! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
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Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.01 Released
Adamant Mod version 0.16.01 has been released.
You can get the patch here. Version 0.16.01 - 07 November 2006: Files Altered: Components.txt, Facilitiy.txt, RacialTraits.txt, Settings.txt, AI_Facility_Construction.txt files, AI_Design_Creation.txt files 1. Changed - AI now builds planetary happiness facilities. 2. Fixed - Neutral AIs now have proper AI files. 3. Changed - Happiness racial characteristic can no longer be lowered below 100%. 4. Chanded - Emotionless trait now costs 1500 points (up from 500 points when combined with lowering Happiness to 50%). 5. Fixed - SY Expansion - Minerals is now buildable. 6. Added - Research Centers now have AI Tag 06, so the AI can build them over Metropolis. 7. Fixed - Small RW Generators require 6000 kt of cabling/plating, instead of 2000 kt. 8. Changed - Revamped fighter weapons. 9. Fixed - AI will now design troops. |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
i just tried this mod in a fit of bordom.
I am now kicking my own *** for waiting so long |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
Planning on any more additions for it?
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Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
Do you have any requests for things you'd like to see?
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Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
I want to see a pacifistic race. You know a race that doesn't believe in killing at all. A race that is uber powerful but only uses non-leathal weapons. A trading powerhouse, with heavily shielded worlds and cultural influence that inspires other races to love them.
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Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
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Using the Titanium Armor I (light: 1/10 kt medium 3/23kt heavy 10/50kt) and the Rail gun I (DAM 20), a mix of 3:1 medium/light armor defeated all-heavy armor with the same "armor weight" every time. Obviously, damage-"spillover" on the low-number-heavy-armor design and high amount of armor components on the other one outweights the tendency to target heavier components. All-light armor seems to suck, though, but that's easily explained by spillover damage - which is sufficient to kill 2 full armor components in the test case. Quote:
Especially MONSTER SKIN does not make sense as "dense armor" .. neither balancewise nor rationally: Monster seem to have very few internal systemsm, but lots of armor. Having to peel that completely off to even hurt them (and its regenerating!) is not only incredibly difficult, but illogical as well. CRYSTALLINE ARMOR could need some changes anyway: It looks pretty much unchanged with non-leaky 30/100kt and a 2nd ability whose description reads "not depleted by weapon fire" but means "channels hits into shields"; obviously the same ability is used to build the leaky shields, but somehow the armors' abilities description got changed to that of the shield - without need, as they are seperate entries. Btw., its plain wrong anyway: A) it's not true for the shields and B) does not apply for the Armor Only thing that really changed about the Crystalline Armor is the price: with 500/0/25 it's horribly expensive : to make the player use only 1 component per ship? As troop armor, it does not work out that good, though: - Titanium uses Troop Mount (results in "Troop Titanium Armor I" with 1/30kt, 20/0/0 cost) - Crystalline doesn't (results in "Crystalline Armor I" with 1/6 kt and 5/0/3 cost) I wonder why "dense" armor doesn't use a mount that scales it to the size of the vessel? The MEDICAL BAY is problematical as well: - to big for lots of ships (300kt,needs Frigate at least, what is a long way to go if you start with low tech) - too expensive to be put on bases over every colony (5K/11K/3K ressources!) => plagues are guaranteed disaster; makes plague bomb 1 a very 'attractive' weapon And last, but not least - the Puntherrain Empires RACE DESCRIPTION seems to come straight from Altavistas Babelfish ... |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
Using the Titanium Armor I (light: 1/10 kt medium 3/23kt heavy 10/50kt)...
The example I spoke of was a ship with all light armor vs. a ship with all heavy armor. This saw the heavy winning, right? Medium armor is a happy middle ground. Fewer overall hp than light, but still more hp/kT than most other components, like heavy armor. Generally, light armor's main purpose is to fill in kT gaps, and to be used on units. Especially MONSTER SKIN does not make sense as "dense armor"... Monsters are meant to be particularly tough. At least their shields are not leaky, so you just have to take them down once (save the 10% regeneration per round). http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif CRYSTALLINE ARMOR could need some changes anyway... CA is a bit of an oddball; its SGFD isn't particularly useful anymore, since shield generators have as many SGFD as shield points (except for magic shields, which have a few extra shield points). All it has going for it is the denseness. I could never really think of a better role for it, so I left it alone. As troop armor, it does not work out that good, though... D'oh; so many armors to create beefy troop versions for, looks like I missed CA. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif I wonder why "dense" armor doesn't use a mount that scales it to the size of the vessel? Due to the nature of SGFD, a high amount of HP per component on dense armor can result it invulnerability. With sufficient SGFD ability and shield point capacity, you can shrug off the damage from any weapon that does less than twice the HP of your dense armor. Take a look at stock CA III; it has 150 hp and 15 SGFD. Add 1 high level shield generator for 300+ hp. Let's say you have a weapon doing 140 damage per hit. In the best case, the CA target has 140 shield points currently. Your first hit drops the shields to 0. The next hit does 140 damage to armor, and generates 140 shields. The way that partial damage works is that it is just added to the value of the next shot. So, when you hit a second time, the 140 partial damage to the armor is added to the 140 damage your weapon does. 140 points of it depletes the 140 shield points. The remaining 140 damage hits the armor, causing 140 partial damage points to accrue, and generating 140 shield points. The next hit gets the partial damage added to it, for 280 damage against 140 shield points. Repeat ad nauseum. This is why the dense armors like Neutronium are small, with low overall hp. It is impossible to create an invincible ship with Neutronium and leaky shields. Even the ruins-based Xentronium is not too much help; at 100 hp/comp, it is vulnerable to weapons doing 100 damage, of which there are plenty (especially with heavy mount) considering its rather high tech reqs. Plus, you can only mount 3 of them, so you probably will have a lot of Neutronium to round out your armor defenses anyways. Btw., its plain wrong anyway: A) it's not true for the shields... Conceptually, the shields represent a nebulous energy barrier that serves to reduce the energy of incoming weapons fire, as opposed to the impervious wall of force as perceived by the stock game. This barrier is not depleted by weapons fire; it remains active until the generators themselves are destroyed. Yes, technically the shield point values go down as weapons hit, but then they come right back up. The shield point levels aren't what the description refers to. The MEDICAL BAY is problematical as well: - to big for lots of ships... - too expensive to be put on bases over every colony (5K/11K/3K resources!) Indeed. Note that all races have access to system hospital facilities, which cure plagues on any planet in the system. Due to the nature of the ability, they allow one turn of damage from the plague before curing it, but they are still a sage investment. They even generate a bit of research to ease the pain of devoting a slot in every system to them. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Ship-mounted medical bays are meant to represent a huge investment of medical resources and personnel. Though, I could have sworn I had made them count as cargo for mounting on transports... hmm. |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
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In a low starting ressource/tech game with medium tech costs .. no way to get that. I was barely able to get to Med Bay III at turn 120 - and that one comes at the 100k research levelas well. Quote:
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Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
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I was reading the old thread for this Mod. And well i liked alot of your ideas. The Weapons bewteen the Races do seem to be a bit alike just different names. And Energy and Machine Dudes bit more fleshed out? |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
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Itd be nice if pirates could colonize planets but not move any population there or build anything, just use the cargo space, and prevent other races from colonizing.. If the engine allowed it, being able to use any planets cargo space regardless of the owner would be nice... Also its a little hard to capture ships with the swashbucklers since the AI tends to use Bridges (3 defense) and Luxury Crew (5 defense) and the Swashbucklers are only an attack 5.. And boarding ships with no weapons flee...kind of frustrating, since I build boarding ships so I dont have to build ships with guns... The first mining sats could do with 500 output a turn instead of 450...since the swashbucklers cant capture anything but neutrals ships, and it takes quite a while to get better boarding crews with the painfully slow research point growth, you need the extra minerals to build actual combat ships, since stealing them is nigh impossible... Maybe the ability to convert resources on a higher ratio that default? Since pirates would be naturally better at trading and getting the best price.. Maybe a little easier to get along with diplomatically, since pirates are a bit more charismatic than the average bloke... |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
If all enemy ships have shield points, boarding ships will flee. They only approach once all shields are down on at least one target. If the enemy has no shields, you might want to check that the strategy is set to board/capture ships for your boarding ship designs.
Note that civilian cruisers, though small and not too strong individually, get an 80% maintenance reduction. It's a lot easier to make an initial raiding force with them than normal ships. Theonlystd said: haha lots of things. But with Se5 out and this being rather old mod i was just curius if we could expect many more updates. SE5 has a lot of issues that need working out... The Weapons bewteen the Races do seem to be a bit alike just different names. There is, I think, a fair bit of variety in weapon styles between the original 3 paradigms (physical, magic, organic). Part of what held up 0.16 so long was complete lack of inspiration for machine and energy weapons. I copped out on the machines, just giving them copies of the physical race weapons. Energy has the main bases covered, but not too much variety. Alas... And Energy and Machine Dudes bit more fleshed out? Other than in the area of weapons, what else needs more fleshing out? |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
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Most 3000point - AIs cannot build Colony Ships with 0.16.0.1 !!
I wondered why the scores in my games looked that odd - so I started a test game (large classic midlife, everything visible, medium tech, added 19 AIs by hand and set them to 'computer controlled, use AI from design'). Of all those races from 8472 to Pandoran Alliance, only Abbidon, Eee, Ghizerea and Manai managed to colonize 1-2 planets on turn 20. To my surprise, when I switched over all the AI players to human control, I found that those 15 races simply didn't have a Colony Ship design. With their current tech, I was oc. able to design some without problem. And the AIs build and used the ships quite eagerly... Savegame attached ... ps: Looks like I'm in beta-tester mode again ... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif PPS: Working races are - Abbidon, Crysilonite, Eee, Ghizerea, Manai, Sonne Clan, Swarm Brood, Ticon Consortium, Tylmai, Vidrine. Other than the Ghizrea (Ice, O2) all are gas giant inhabitants. PPPS: .. things get even stranger: The Ghizerea has both Gas Giant and Ice Colony Tech, but uses only the Gas Giant tech to build colony ships. Effectivly, only GAS GIANT COLONY ships are working in this mod !! [/b] I figured out whats gone wrong - just tested successfully: The AI uses Name := Atmospheric Probes Description := Component designed to compel the AI to not design colony ships prematurely. Strangly, all the "gas planet colonization" probes are marked with Ability 1 Type := AI Tag 12 Ability 1 Descr := Can colonize a gas giant planet. while the others use Ability 1 Type := Ship Life Support <=replace: AI Tag 10 Ability 1 Descr := Can colonize a rock based planet. and Ability 1 Type := Ship Crew Quarters <=replace: AI Tag 11 Ability 1 Descr := Can colonize an ice based planet. Default_AI_DesignCreation.txt uses: Design Type := Colony (Gas) Vehicle Type := Ship Default Strategy := Don't Get Hurt Size Minimum Tonnage := 330 Size Maximum Tonnage := 330 Num Must Have At Least 1 Ability := 1 Must Have Ability 1 := AI Tag 12 Design Type := Colony (Ice) Vehicle Type := Ship Default Strategy := Don't Get Hurt Size Minimum Tonnage := 330 Size Maximum Tonnage := 330 Num Must Have At Least 1 Ability := 1 Must Have Ability 1 := AI Tag 11 Design Type := Colony (Rock) Vehicle Type := Ship Default Strategy := Don't Get Hurt Size Minimum Tonnage := 330 Size Maximum Tonnage := 330 Num Must Have At Least 1 Ability := 1 Must Have Ability 1 := AI Tag 10 Abilities.txt and AI_Tags.txt do not accord with each other either. I guess there's some update needed for AI Tag 01-09 and some addition : AI Tag 10 Colonize Rock AI Tag 11 Colonize Ice AI Tag 12 Colonize Gas |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
Hahaha! In my efforts to fix troop design, I was toying with AI tag reqs for the "cockpits," to try to get just one per troop. I copy/replaced the abilities back to the CQ and LS ones after I learned what the actual problem was. I seem to have forgotten to record the AI tags used to make the AI design colony ships, and reused them in the troop testing. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif
As an interim solution, here is a file that will restore the AI's ability to make all colony ship designs: Components.zip. Note that this will break muliplayer savegame compatibility. |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
An in-depth discussion of Leaky Defenses can be found in the Carrier Battles mod tutorial pages:
DEF 200 : Damage Theory and DEF 340 : Armor Mechanics These pages are coming from CBmod, but the underlying game mechanics are universal. Just use your local mod's statistics and follow along. DEF 340 in particular goes into detail of the tradeoffs between thick (large, low hp/kt) and thin (small, high hp/kt) leaky armors, plus the effects of tech level on damage absorption rates. |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
I had a question about Atmospheric Probes and what the purpose behind them was. It states to keep the AI from prematurely designing colony ships. How so? And why don't you want the AI designing colonyships?
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Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
SJ those links in your post don't seem to be working at the moment.
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Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
When the AI designed ships by colony module ability, it would make designs for all 3 types when it only had one actual colony tech. It would then proceed to build a bunch of useless ships sans any ability to colonize. The atmospheric probes are there to prevent that from happening.
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Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
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AI research scripts are especially poor:
After starting with low tech and medium cost, in 2410.1 the AIs have (nearly) finished Laser and Projetile Weapons or their special version of it (level 5 or 6) Yet, they only have ship building at 2 and therefore are restricted to <200kt hulls. Some even (e.g. Puntherrain) build mines, but do not even have a mine layer design!? Nearly all have satellite(s) and layers designed, but do not build any, but troops and bunkers. Some troops do not have weapons, but 2 pieces of armor .. They don't have any chemistry or physics researched, therefore no shields and only the basic armor available. The AIs use leaky armor as if it was 'magic' armor, filling biggest part of the ship with max level weapons (at least, of what is left after dropping enough engines in to get somewhere at all) - this results in "who shoots first wins"-situation especially between AIs even more then necessary because of the design of the combat engine. .. see screenshot ... http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/thr...53-armor_X.png |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
Are you offering to help beef up the AI?
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Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
I'gladly report everything troublesome I find.
But I'll have a job interview tomorrow. If everything goes well, I doubt I'll have much time in the future to spend on game mods, or games at all, as I'll have to do training-on-the-job. For a year or two http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif If not, well, I think I'll have some time to spare then .. |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
I started a singleplayer game with the new components.txt posted here, but it looks like it's still broken for the two AI's living on ice worlds.
The others have pretty much fully colonized the part of the galaxy I can see, and they're both stuck with a single planet. |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
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You'll have to start a new game, though, to be sure the AI designs the colonizers correctly. |
Re: Adamant Mod 0.16.00 Released
Thank you, that does work better!
In spite of your advice, I couldn't help but try it in my current game... It took them a year or so, but they seem to have caught on nicely. Besides the exact component versions, their designs look identical to what the other races use. I designed a colonizer manually for one of them, which it seems to have built and then marked obsolete in favour of its own new design. Ofcourse, they do have about a hundred planets worth of catching up to do now... |
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