They came from the SEA?!
 

I need some strats/tactics to fight nations from the sea. As a new player, I've found some good land nations to play, ones not too overpowered, not overly encumbered by age.

In a recent game as EA--Sauromatia, two ocean nations essentially ground my nation down until the stronger land nations began attacking. So what strategy do I use to keep from running around in circles from amphibian attacks.

My last attempt using mercs and water trinkets got me stomped. They have huge stacks of units in SEA with no where to go except attack a lone sea province.

Re: They came from the SEA?!
 

I haven't tried this, but are undead able to enter the sea ?

If this is the case undead summons + mages with water breathing might be a solution.

CharonJr

Re: They came from the SEA?!
 

Most undeads can indeed enter the sea (but they are usually poor amph.)

Mid-game, summon sea trolls is a very good spells, that gets you a W3 troll king and its troops. And if your have enought gems, he can summons others himself. Moreover, the sea troll king gain 1 water gem each month.

The difficult part is fighting for your first sea province and holding it long enought : then you can create a lab, and start summoning sea monsters (if you have access to watr magic of course), and do mass recruiting of tritons/shamblers, ... or whatever local troops you gt in that province

Other solution : several construction 4 & 6 items allow commanders (and often up to a certain number of their troops) to enter the sea. Those are mainly water items, but there are also several that you can forge with Air magic

So the 3 scholls for conquering the sea :

- water (the better way : go conjuration, and /or construction)
- death (zombies from the sea ! Go for enchantment)
- air (go for construction)

Re: They came from the SEA?!
 

The primary way for a land nation to go underwater is via summoning. You could also hunt around for a shambler or ichythid land province and then build an amphibious army from there.

Another good way is to build a fairly tough underwater-capable SC. Then use it to punch in to a weaker underwater province and establish a "beachead" (maybe I should say seahead?). Then pour all your resources into building aquatic troops from there and constantly reinforce it with summons and amphibious troops until you are ready to expand outward from there.

Re: They came from the SEA?!
 

or you could hope that you find an icthyid province and mass them to go under.

Re: They came from the SEA?!
 

I thought that only the exceedingly rare magic site Crater allows you to get them? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

Re: They came from the SEA?!
 

Usually the fastest way to enter water provinces early in the game is buying mercenaries which can enter the water. Once you've conquered one water province it's easier to expand into the others.

If the Mercs are not available for purchase then it depends on your gem income.

Re: They came from the SEA?!
 

The fastest and easiest way is to take an amphibious pretender like the Wyrm. It can start taking water provinces as soon as it can reach one, no items or magic needed.

Re: They came from the SEA?!
 

One solution to consider as a partial fix is to recruit as many archers as possible in your shoreline provinces, since the water nations don't have much in the way of ranged attacks, and I don't think any missle troops-atleast in EA. It won't solve the problem, but it will give you an advantage, esp. if you can afford a commander casting fire arrows. Combining them with calvalry scripted to hold-attack should also help, particularly against EA Atlantians. Illithids are tougher, try mass-producing amulets of anti-magic and bows of botulf, and handing them out to cheap commanding officers. Shamblers on coasts seem to be common. I usually know where atleast one province with shamblers or ickthys are by mid-game. It takes a big investment of time and money though to really mass them, so if you find a province like that early in the game, grab it and hold on, and don't shirk on buying the troops each round, if you can help it. A hundred+ shamblers just sitting around collecting upkeep seems like a waste, but they're worth their weight in gold by the late-game. And ofcourse, who says you have to let them sit? There's no wrong time to invade the ocean, except when it's too late.

Re: They came from the SEA?!
 

Regarding undead --

Skeletal types (longdead) and spectral types (ghosts) can.

Flesh/meat types (ghouls, wights, censors...) can't.

Constructs can also be amphibious -- ex. Mechanical Men are, if memory serves. Both constructs and undead generally have the benefit of poison immunity, which is quite useful there given the number of aquatic units with coral weapons or armor.

Re: They came from the SEA?!
 

The easiest way to beat water nations is dominion them to death. There is usually not that many water provinces so it is easy to do.