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Worthy Heroes Mod(Version 1.7b! Hydra bug fixed)
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Version 1_7b
-fixed a bug that caused sentient hydras to spawn knights instead of hydra hatchlings Changes from Version 1_6 to 1_7 -fixed 3.08 itemslots and old age issues -added summon allies command for all commander type heroes, which lets them summon ~50 gp worth of the units they command(Niklatu/ramshead/caelos etc) -added domspread for several high priest type heroes -removed tuatha as second multihero from man due to Eriu appearing -several other minor changes Installation instructions: Simply unrar the file into your dominions3 folder with winrar, available from www.winrar.com. A short summary of the content of the mod: The mod improves most heros, similar to the dom2 Version and enables a couple of additional heros, which are in the game, but seem to be disabled(bug?). In addition it also adds new multiheroes(heroes that can show up more than once) for a lot of nations. Most of them are fairly generic high mage type heroes, but all of them should be useful and thematic. Almost all nations have a Multihero with the mod and every nation has at least 2. Version 1.6 adds a couple more heroes and makes some others more worthwile. It should also work with macintoshs now. Those newly created heroes are in a separate part of the .dm file, so you can easily remove those if you donīt like my creations. There is also an updated blackheroview map, so you can check out the heroes easily, although you canīt easily see what nation/age they appear in. in addition I made pretty heavy usage of the custommagic command to have different multiheroes, so if you encounter any hero in the heroviewmap or ingame that seems to be overpowered, it may be a statistical outlier. Here is a hopefully complete list of Heros in the game. Heroes, which I added/enabled in the mod are marked as new, heroes where Iīm not sure are marked with (not sure). Enjoy and please point out any errors: List of heroes: early arcoscephale: -daidalos maker of the maze -pathos son of titans -asterios monster in the maze -orokestes hierophant middle arcoscephale: -pathos son of titans -asterios monster in the maze -orokestes hierophant -daidalos maker of the maze -anthromachus Multihero: -Oreiad (new) late arcoscephale: -daidalos maker of the maze -pathos son of titans -asterios monster in the maze -orokestes hierophant -anthromachus early ermor: -cornelius pontifex maximus -innocentius primate multihero: -sauromancer(new) -master of the games(new) middle ermor: -Zirru grand Thaumaturg -Mortius Scythe wielder multihero: -master of the games(new) late ermor: -Etimmu Wraith Lord -Alcastos Forgotten KIng -Caractor Arch Censor -Tenebrus Shade King Early Ulm: -Athalwolf Maker of Heroes -WarenHeris Son of Steel -Eburhart Guardian of the Tree multihero: -Warrior/smith/shaman hero(new) Middle Ulm: -Raterik the Hero -Hildegard the Heroine -Barthulf the Hero Late Ulm: -Burkhard Blood Marshal -Patrifagus Ghoul baron -Carsten, Member of the third tier Multihero: - generic member of the third tier(new) Maverni: -The one in the woods, Wanderer Multihero: -Bloodhenge Druid (new) Sauromatia: -Skögu man eater -Kirke Pharmakeia Multihero: -Sentient Hydra (new) TienīChi(all ages): -Lu tung Pin, immortal -Ho Hsien-KU, immortal -Li Tėeh-Kua, immortal early Mictlan: -Mictlipoctli, King of legends -Tepeyocatl, Eagle priest Multihero: -Couatl(new) -Onaqui (new) middle Mictlan: -Mictlipoctli, King of legends -Lawgiver (new) late mictlan: -Mictlipoctli, King of legends -Tepeyocatl, Eagle priest -Quetzalcouatl, Feathered Serpent (new) early Abysia: -Malphas Corruptor Multihero: -First Abysian (new) -Child of Anthrax (new) middle Abysia: -Chuzrael Slayer -Rago Rage Lord(not sure) -Baal Chozron, Anathemant Warlock(not sure) Multihero: -Child of Anthrax (new) late Abysia: -Chuzrael Slayer -Rago Rage Lord(not sure) -Baal Chozron, Anathemant Warlock Multihero: -Child of Anthrax (new) early Caelum: -Iszvat, Unwinged Multihero: -High Seraphine(new) middle Caelum: -Zaelinys, harab Seraphine -Caelos, Sacred One Multihero: -Eagle King(new) -High Seraphine(new) late Caelum: -Zaelinys, harab Seraphine -Caelos, Sacred One Multihero: -High Seraphine Mummy(new) early C`tis -Zilammu, Consort of the Dead -Udum'ukinna, reassembled Prince -Kabti'ili, Ancient Shaman -Niklatu, Lizard Hero Middle C`tis -Niklatu, Lizard Hero -Urugallu, Lizard Hero -Murmur, Guild Master Multihero: -Sentient Hydra(new) late C`tis -Udum'ukinna, reassembled Prince -Kabti'ili, Ancient Shaman -Niklatu, Lizard Hero -Urugallu, Lizard Hero -Ekishnugal, First King Pangaea(early and middle age) -Taurotyrannos, Black Bull -Rams Head, White Satyr -Arcopythera, Harpy Queen -Menopathos, White Minotaur Pangaea(late age) -Taurotyrannos, Black Bull -Rams Head, White Satyr -Arcopythera, Harpy Queen -Menopathos, White Minotaur -Panicratos, Apostatic warrior(new) Multihero: -Ettin Mandragora (new) early Agartha -Ogon, Earth Blooded -Deepthought, Great Olm (new) Multihero -Great Olm (new) middle Agartha Multihero -Great Olm (new) late Agartha Multihero -Great Olm (new) -Possessed flame spirit (new) early Vanheim -Vanlade, Hero( seems to be enabled for both vanheim and helheim) -Sölvis, Vanadis Multihero -Dwarf Elder(new) middle Vanheim -Vanlade, Hero -Sölvis, Vanadis(new) -Farbaute, Hero (not sure) Multihero -Dwarf Elder(new) late Vanheim(midgard) -Vanlade, Hero -Farbaute, Hero (not sure, enabled in mod) Multihero -Vanadrott(new) Helheim -Vanlade, Hero Multihero -Svartalf Elder(new) early Jotunheim (Niefelheim) -Tjatse, Abductor -Angerboda, Great Hag Multihero: -Jotun Jarl Hero(new) middle Jotunheim -Tjatse, Abductor -Angerboda, Great Hag -Sporsnjall, Wolf Lord Multihero: -Jotun Jarl Hero(new) late Jotunheim (Utgard) -Tjatse, Abductor -Angerboda, Great Hag -Sporsnjall, Wolf Lord Multihero: -Jotun Jarl Hero(new) early Kailasa -Devasura, Fallen Multihero -Rishi(new) middle Kailasa (Bandar Log) Multihero -Yakshini(new) -Yaksha(new) late Kailasa(Patala) Multihero -Golden Naga(new) early Yomi -Masatora, Ghost General -Tsunekage, Devourer of Demons -Kurofomi, Master of the Shadow Blossom Multihero: -Dai Tengu (new) middle Yomi(Shinuyama) -Hearthider(lacks description Multihero -Kitsune(new) late yomi (Jomon) -Ryutaro, Son of the Dragon KIng -hashi Saburo, Red Devil Multihero -Member of Shadow League (new) early Atlantis -Commander of the Living Pillars(new) Multihero -Elder BasalthKing(new) middle Atlantis -Chuddar Kadul, Seer King(new) -Shudul Cthuda, Coral Prince(new) Multihero -Escaped Slave Prince (new) late Atlantis -Azatoth, Kivigtok Multihero -Escaped Slave Prince (new) early Rīlyeh -Auluudh, Mindlord Multihero -elder Polypal Mother(new) middle R'lyeh -Auluudh, Aboleth -Cthugul, Stargazer -Shadhul Ummush, Traitor King(new) -Visitor(new) late R'lyeh -Auluudh, Aboleth -Cthugul, Stargazer -Shadhul Ummush, Traitor King(new) -Visitor(new) early Oceania Multihero -Capricorn (new) middle Oceania Multihero -Triton King (new) Pythium -Marius Lorca, Hero -Hierogallus, Serpent Lord -Bartholomäus, Patriarch (not sure) Multihero -Master of the games -Sentient Hydra(new) Middle Man -Bernlad, Green Knight -Rhianne, Heroine -Brangwen, Blind one( not sure) Multihero -Knight of the Stone Late Man -Bernlad, Green knight -Rhianne, heroine (new) Multihero -Arch Magister(new) Middle Marignon -Grand Master (new) -Angelique d'Armant(not sure) -Carmont, High Inquisitor(not sure) -Tomaso del Monferrada, Witch Hunter General(not sure) Late Marignon -Angelique d'Armant(not sure) -Carmont, High Inquisitor(not sure) -Tomaso del Monferrada, Witch Hunter General Machaka -Mchumba, Ape Oracle -Ainra, Lady of Spiders -Abasi, Hero -Yasini, King Triumphant -Mwaka, Crowned Ape Lanka: -Devasura, fallen Multihero: -Davana(new) -Samanishada(new) As always any feedback is welcome, especially pointing out thematic flaws, or buggy behaviour. Stuff left to do: 1)New sprites for the new heroes, right now they still use the sprites from their templates. Although all of those are fitting, some distinction to normal units would be nice. Any help with drawing sprites would be greatly appreciated. I really want the artwork to be consistent with illwinters and I fear my drawing skills arenīt good enough. 2) More heroes: If you have an idea for a hero, or already created a nice thematic one, post him and I will include him in the mod. Credits for some ideas, which I used go to: 1)Nerfix for the polypal mother hero idea. 2)Taqwus for the new atlantian multihero idea. 3)Zepath for general ideas regarding king/angel heroes. 4)Endoperez for the High Seraphine Hero 5)Quantum mechani for the smoulderghost hero Extra special credits for Jurri, who gave tons of useful feedback and had the flamecorpse hero idea. Thanks to all the people who made suggestions in this thread even if I couldnīt implement them. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Major coolness! Thanks Turin. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Oh - if it's possible, seems some of the heroes have descriptions that would warrant them starting with at least two stars of experience. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Varrath and Quetzalcoatl share most of their description - if they're supposed to be the same hero in different ages, seems Varrath should still have his non-blood magic. If different, description should be changed?
Edit : Same thing with Benim / Ainra for Machaka. And Visruta / Tjatse (Neifelheim). |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
I guess you mean with Varrath the lawgiver hero for mictlan middle age. He has a random name. Right now he has n4 s4 h4 in middle(to make him different from the standard recruitable couatl) and quetzo has n3s3b2h3. I find it fitting that he loses some of his skills when he has failed and was forced to use blood magic, but something in that description to clear it up should definitely be added.
I donīt think itīs possible to mod experience in. Would be awesome if you could though. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Eh - on the black hero map, Varrath the Lawgiver is showing up with no magic. And both he and Quetzo are described as "Questzalcoatl is a legendary Couatl who has aided Mictlan in times of need. He can take the form of a man ..." Identical description, but Varrath has no magic. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Ah now I know what you mean. He is just the human shapeshift form of quetzo, which I put in there, so I donīt forget about it.
Ingame he starts in the Couatl form and the magicskills carry over to his human form if he shapechanges. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
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Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
i like the mod :-)
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Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
when I have this mod active my dom quits out when I click on "start new game"
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Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
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Awesome, as always, Turin! Would it be possible to make a list of which hero goes to which nation on which Age from your testgame? That would make it easier for possible contributors to see what each nation already has and what nations need attention. Hate to be a pain, but even the thought of repeating your test makes me whimper http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
(Many heroes are of course pretty obvious, but a lot of them appear on more than one Age. Some of them would need at the very least their description changed, and others still might need other changes. Dunno if it would be worth it to lose the unique names for just better-matching descriptions though...) |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Heh a list would be a lot of work. Right now Iīm having too much fun playing the game in singleplayer to do that kind of work http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif .
I tried to replace the Mictlan hero you mentioned, but the replacement command didnīt seem to work and the hero could appear twice. Maybe itīs just because the hero is defined as hero4 or hero5(I only changed the first 3 since mictlan gets only 3 at most), but maybe it simply is not possible to remove official heroes via modding. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Singleplayer? Singleplayer!! Dude, get into some multi action, the AI could never hope to be a match for you http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
Maybe the hero-mod should be divided into three parts, so that there's one for each era. That would allow for modifying the units directly, which could come in handy in cases like the Eagle Priest and the Couatl. (A further example of a possible inconsistency would be Late Age T'ien C'hi's heroes: Seems to me they are the same as the other Ages, which doesn't necessarily make sense given that the old nation has been subjugated by barbarians. Why would the heroes of old aid the invaders?) |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Heh I donīt have internet at home yet, so Iīm still in the SP realm. Maybe Iīll do the three part version, but apart from the Mictlan hero I didnīt find anything terribly unthematic.
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Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
I have added a full list showing what heroes appear in which age.
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Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
The list is a great reference... how about monster numbers to go with it? Thanks for continuing to work on this essential mod Turin.
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Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Whenever i try to make a new game with this mod the game locks up
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Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
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Itīs because #clear commands are apparently bugged currently and cause crashes on macs.
Try to use the dm file attached to this post. I removed the clear commands, so there will be some oddities, but those should affect only 4 heroes. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
I like very much what I see! Here are some notes on I made on the first few nations (My main criterion is internal consistency. I'm looking at them in order, will finish checking them some other time). Some of these are pretty anal, which you might be better off disregarding http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif:
Ermor --- Innocentius: I don't suppose you can flag creatures prophets or blessed via modding commands? Maybe make him spread dominion like a juggernaut, at least, if it's possible. As it stands he's pretty bland. Cornelius: the description begs for mapmove 1... As this hero is now, it doesn't really give anything special to Ermor, so a revision might be in order. Multihero: These are very useful, though. You could also reuse the Master of the Games for another multihero for EA Ermor. MA: There are gladiators here too, so Master of Games would be again a possible multihero. Another suggestion would be an immortal shadow vestal; I liked those in Dom2 CB! LA: Tenebrus references the Soul Gate, but you can get him even if you don't cast the global. (Right?) Also, the description says he can reanimate shadows and dispossessed spirits, but I doubt that is the case. Maybe make him an assassin, to make him something other than a poor man's Etimmu, and increase his MR to match the other LA Ermor heroes. Multihero suggestion: I'd suggest a Mummy or a Divine Mummy; those are very hard to get normally, and cool as anything. Of course, C'tis could use them as a multihero even better. Wailing ladies might also be amusing, since you so rarely see them. Ulm --- EA: What's so great about the Son of Steel? I'd say he needs some loving. MA: Shouldn't Barthulf have at least E1 if he has forged his own armor? He's ways behind even Raterik as it stands. Why does Hildegaard have higher base skills than the others? Her description hints to a Hochmeister of the Black Order, but LA Ulm's Hochmeister commander specifies them as 'commanders of the Black Templars', which aren't available in the Middle Era. (The Black Knights' commanders are apparently called Black Lords.) LA heroes are all nice. Maybe there could be some Iron Faith heroes as well, like a multihero High Black Priest with a forgebonus, inquisitor, more Holy than the regulars and a Master Smith's magics, or perhaps Hildegard. Maverni --- I like the multihero. The name is somewhat gamey, though; How about calling them Bloodhenge Druids, seeing how there are already indies that go by that name? Sauromatia --- An Amazon heroine would be appropriate, methinks. She could have a magical bow and high precision. The Sentient hydra could use the same leadership as a hydra tamer in my opinion, that is, 10. T'ien C'hi --- In LA having the same heroes as the other Ages doesn't necessarily make sense given that the old nation has been subjugated by barbarians. Why would the heroes of old aid the invaders? Making a whole new set of heroes might be a pain, though. Caelum --- LA: Zaelinys really doesn't belong here. One would think the raptors would put her kind to death or exile when they return. Caelos is also out of place, since the old temple guard doesn't exist anymore. To replace them, I suppose an Earthbound hero would be in line with Caelos and Isvat. They can still summon Yazatas, so an Eagle King wouldn't be out of place. C'tis --- Niklatu: sounds like he should have reinvigoration from his rainbow armor. Also, his description says that he's the captain of the Swamp Guard, something that only exits in the MA. Ekishnugal: you've probably alrady fixed the holy 5 this critter has to holy 4. Udum'ukinna: He's less than 400 years old. His pops is a thousand years old... Zilammu: she's only about 150 years old, and is consort to Udum'ukinna, who's more than 200 years older. Also, her description implies that she lived in the time of the First King, Ekishnugal, which was at least hundreds of years ago based on Ekishnugal's age. Kabti'ili: Late Age doesn't have slave lizards anymore. The nation description also claims they do, but they don't have the troops, and neither do they have the shamen. So this one doesn't belong there. For multiheroes, I propose for Late Age Mummies or Divine Mummies, with magic to taste. Middle Age, perhaps sentient swamp creatures who have as much to gain from spreading Miasma; Sentient Hydra might be a fun twist. Or a Catoplebas, those are beautiful. For the Early Age, maybe the mummies again. Pangaea --- Ram's Head: satyr hoplites only exist in the Middle and Late Ages. Taurotyrannos: Pandemoniacs are available only in the Middle Age. Would be fun if Ambicephalos was activated for LA, and Panicratos is a swell hero also. Timing issue: Now, this is the nitpick of the day, for sure! Namely, some heroes give information about the timeline of events, which when correlated with the age of said heroes allows one to time the length of the Middle Age. You see, if you know that an event happens at the Early Age, the most generous assumption is that it happens at the end of the age. And if the hero that was involved in the event exists on the Late Age, and we take the most generous assumption that it's the beginning of the Late Age, the hero's age minus how old he was at the time of the event tells us how long the Middle Age is at the most. Here are the culprits I noticed from Arcos to Pangaea in the list: Ekishnugal is the Founder of C'tissian kingdom, which has been founded already by the time of the Early Age. Yet, he's only under 1000 years old, which when gotten on the Late Age implies that MA is at the most around 1000 years long. Mictlan's King of Legends again times the Age, being one of the first kings of the empire, so obviously from the Early Age or before... This time the result is that MA is at most under 500 years long. Chuzrael is the last demonbred slayer, so he's lived on from the Early Ages. Thus, MA is at most 225 years. LA Ermor Heroes reference Ermor's fall, which is apparently something that's happened in EA. Thus, looking at f. ex. Caractor's Age we know that Middle Age is less than 200 years or so long. The easy fix would be removing any references to earlier ages from the descriptions, but I doubt that's worthwhile, and this is best ignored http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
I see that this mod downloads as a .rar file
how do i change this into a file that will work in the game? thanks |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
winrar is a pack utility like winzip and in my opinion far superior.
Get it here: http://www.zdnet.de/downloads/prg/7/...007677-wc.html |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Turin, Late Ages T'ien Ch'i could use:
1. Great Khan (either a mounted combat beast with a standard and great leadership [Ghengis] or a very strong priest with some astral and a research bonus [Kubilai]) 2. Marco Polo (an Ulmic or Manish hero with fair leadership, sailing, and at least a few low-level magic paths) 3. Zheng He (eunuch admiral with high leadership and some decent--for a hero--stats) |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Thanks for a good mod Turin. The changes you've implemented meshes very well with my own custom heroes. Heh, your alterations are a lot more "realistic" then my own. In my own mods I've based the heroes on units I very rarely use, like the corpse construct or horsebrother for example.
Writing the description is always a lot more fun then finetuning the unit though. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Heh for me itīs the opposite, finetuning the unit is more fun than writing the description, because I feel itīs pretty hard to write an interesting noncheesy hero story in just a couple of sentences.
Do you mind if I take a look at your custom heroes to get some more ideas? |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
I'll gladly post some of my not-quite-so-silly ideas. I'll just post the name and descriptions though, since my mod is balanced for singleplayer.
Legion - Corpse Construct As the strength of steel shattered against the fury of the bloodless host desperation turned into madness. On a bloodsoaked anvil black steel was melded with the flesh and bones of a hundred slain warriors. Now this last Guardian of Ulm stands in silent vigil, still awaiting the call to battle that never came. Maw of the Abyss - Shark Beneath the sunlit waters of the bounding main lies a world of unimaginable splendor, and so human envy of the atlantean. But beneath this shimmering veil, in the unending dark, you'll find the myriad ivory reasons why the atlantean envies man a hundredfold more. The Mistwrought Horror - Bogbeast Few creatures are as foul as the Bog Beasts, and even undead are loathe to dwell near their putrid lairs. But still not even madmen could have imagined one of such rancor and virulence that not even Death would dare to touch it. Son of the West/East/North/South Wind - Horsebrother This mighty warrior is one of four legendary riders from the Horse Tribes. Much as the wind spirits they claim to be descended from each of them constantly seek to prove that their particular martial style is superior to that of the others. Annoyingly enough many of my unit descriptions are way too long. Guess it's easy to get a bit carried away while modding this game. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
The Four Horsemen! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/eek.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif
Speaking of them, there are Longdead horsemen already exist... but what about longdead Horsemen? "War was once vanguished by the Pantokrator, but with the coming of the new pretender gods, peace died as well. Now he rides again, deadlier than ever." |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Here are some more observations on the heroes:
Agartha --- EA: The multihero Olm seems to get more magics than the unique one. Is this intentional? MA: I'd imagine a gargoyle or a crusher or a sentinel or some other construct would be a thematic and interesting hero. Also, how about a mage hero who had astral and earth, just to allow these fellas access to all kinds of constructs? Ogon would be in line with many other nations recycling their EA heroes, and he's supposedly extremely long-lived so it's not impossible to have him here as well. Vanheim --- I don't think Sölvis should be available in Middle and Late age... there's no war to wage with Helheim, after all. There's no reason why the Svartalf heroes of Helheim wouldn't have a forge bonus like the Dwarf heroes of Vanheim. Jotunheim --- Tjatse should perhaps have a line in his description that explains what a Niefel Jarl is; then he wouldn't be so out of place in Middle or Late Age. Yomi --- Tsunekage could use a boost. Perhaps raise his stats to the level of Masatora and add recuperation. There's something funky going on here: the Kabuto helmet seems only give 8 head protection despite the description's 16 on some of the samurai heroes. (Hashi Saburo, Ryutaro) Yukinaga, Masatora and Tsunekage seem to have the correct amount of head protection, though, which makes this pretty weird... In fact, lots of the other heroes also suffer from the halved head protection even with other headgear. The Member of the Shadow League seems to use an inappropriate namelist. Atlantis --- How's about a Monster Fish hero for EA and MA? Would be fun! Or better yet, an Asp Turtle for EA and MA; then a Leviathan in LA. EA: Commander of the Living Pillars have 150 resistances, which isn't quite in line. LA: the Kivigtok: references to Sialuk, despite seemingly random name. R'lyeh --- EA: The Elder Polyphal Mother doesn't really give the nation anything. They have recruitable mages of this caliber, and being immobile this one would need something really good to make it worth it, especially since it can't even cast teleport without an item. MA: Given Auluudh's description, a multihero Aboleth would be a possibility. (Maybe go with the smaller Aboleth from EA instead of the Mind Lord, to not go overboard.) The Visitor could also make for a multihero. As would a Void Spectre, a herald of what's to come. LA: Is Auluudh really appropriate here? Oceania --- How about an amphibious Triton King hero? He'd be called a Merking, I suppose, if he was the king of the Mermen. This would need new graphics, though, seeing how mermen have fish tails in the water. Marignon --- The Witch Hunter General has holy 4, which is what I think he had in Dom2 also... Be it as it may, holy 3 would be probably more appropriate, since the Cardinal is supposedly the most powerful priest of Marignon. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
I was just thinking of ideas for some Niefel heroes for early age:
Thrudgelmir (spelled with an accent ' above the u), which means "strength-yeller" is one of the first generation of Niefel giants. Unlike most Jotun, he was born with 6 heads and is considered by some to have been the forefather of the trollish race. Because of these attributes, I would suggest he have 3 head slots (because 6 is a little extreme), 5% regeneration, an unusually long lifespan for a Niefel but still older, and possibly added strength/fear +0 or the roar experience ability, but I don't think that can be modded at this time. He might also be unusually small for a Niefel giant (size 4). Also, for multihero, Tjatse wasn't the only giant who could shapeshift, some giants could change into giant eagles, while others could change into giant otters, which would make them amphibious. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
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New Version is uploaded in the first post of the thread. I have attached Version 1.5 here, if you need it for some reason.
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Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Funkalicious.
Say, has anybody gotten more than one hero with Lanka in stock 3.04? I haven't yet gone as far as searching the unit array or the string table to find them all, but I had a fairly long SP game with a luck scale and only saw Devasura, so this may be one nation needing more. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
I all from a mod for better heroes, and tried your mod (when it was version 1.4, tried with luck3 arco), and there's some things that annoy me :
(note that I only tried with one nation, maybe other nations , or more recent version, are different) - Seems like you gave 3 misc slots for *all* heroes ? While I'm for giving more punch to some heroes (mainly figter types), 3 misc slots is something not even humanoid pretenders get, making it, from my point of view, unthematic and out of place. (Of course non humanoid heeroes can have a special distribution of items slots, but here I'm talking about standard heroes like Daidalos, or the Hierophant, or Pathos) - Seems like you gave major boost to most heroes, even thoses that were already better mages that their national equivalent. For exemple (I tried Arco, remenber), the Hierophant is already a useful good mage whith one in each element path as well as being a priest (1 or 2), and having S2 or S3 if I remind correctly Your version (1.4) has nature magic as well, wich he should not have according to its backstory (he was supposed to have tried to learn all (arco) magic and failed only for healing (ie : nature) magic, never able to restore is 'manhood') And if i remind correctly, you also gave him a forge bonus (why thematically ? Do you want to give a forge bonus to all mage heroes ?), and maybe an increase in existing path (this, I'm not sure). Added with the 3 misc slots, I fell more like I'm cheating that using a mod. For fighter heroes (the monster in the maze, and Pathos the son of titants), exept for the 3 misc slots they seemed fine. Maybe arco heroes are not a good exemple of the general changes that you made and I should try with other nations (and more recent version) ? |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Thanks for the feedback Jack.
Regarding Orokestes: I added the nature magic in 1.4 as a means to combat his old age problem(#older mod commands werenīt working back then), but it is pretty unthematic and I will remove it in the next version. I gave him the forgebonus, so that he actually plays an improtant role in the game. Without it he is just another mystic, who got all his randoms in pretty useless lvl 1 paths and an additional air. That doesnīt really add much to the nation. With the forge bonus, you might actually think about empowering him to craft better artifact and he becomes an interesting unit. The thematic reason is that he simply learned much of magic and picked up some tricks in item forging on the way. Basegame almost all hero mages from dom2 are national mages with just one extra random and sometimes national mages are even better than them. The dom3 heroes added by Ilwinter change this and are powerhouses magicwise(examples: Tjatse, Kirke, Malphas, Zilammu), so I feel that the old dom2 mage heroes should be significantly better/different to their dom2 counterparts as well. Regarding the misc slots: They are mostly a benefit to the fighter heroes, so you can equip them better, which brings them closer to the firbolg/banelord level I am aiming for. Itīs usually not necessary/costeffective to trick out mage heroes, so the slots could be dropped for them. I feel that the two misc slot limitation is pretty arbitrary, since those are trinkets like rings/amulets, feathers etc. You should be able to carry more than two of those and it serves as an identifier for which units are heroes and which arenīt. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Thanks for the update Turin. Glad you keep up the good effort.
When I run your mod together with my own silly heores mod I now average one new hero every seven turns. Guess heroes crawl out of the woodwork when gods walk the lands. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif I've altered your heroes a bit though, to mesh better with my parade of disgruntled menhirs, teleporting militiamen and other freaks of fantasy. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
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He was already strictly superior to a standard mystic, and is a priest. Seemed like already good for me (however it's true that if he come with old age, he lose much then) Quote:
Doesn't he came with +S3 too ? And having already *all* randoms *and* one more path *and* priest levels should be enought I think. Quote:
- he's a really good recipient for a ring of wizardry - with some empowerment and/or path boosting items, he can forge an elemental staff, and gain another level in *all* elemental paths I already made him a mini-rainbow mage, useful for site-searching (akashic record is good, but 25 astral gems could be better used later in game), and yes, forging magic items. Note also that with only one empowerment to air, you can cast auspex, opening a potential source of air magic that is not natural for arco. Quote:
But i can live with it if it's something that specific to him and maybe a few other heroes, and not a discount on forge bonus for all mage heroes. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif Quote:
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I will look to what you've done to others heroes and try to give more feedback Quote:
Yes 2 misc slots for humanoids is arbitrary, I agree, but it's part of the whole vanilla game. For a hero mod, I look more to something like Zne conceptual balance for dom2 : changing thinks but trying to keep the vanilla flavor. If humanoid heroes start having 3 misc slots, then why not pretenders or some commanders or summons ? I'd like for the fighter heroes to be more useful, but I think there's better way to do it Some suggestions : - some bonus additionnal attack (i think the mod flag is #bonus no ?). Could be a special martial arts attack (such as the secondary attack of the kappas, or even a kick attack), a paralyse/stun attack (may be a net, a pstunning fist, etc ...), or something else, depending on the hero concept - Maybe more magic items as initial equipment (I know that you don't get all bonuses from magic items added like that) - better combat values (attack, defence, HP, etc ...) and or special abilities (berserk is always easy to give or increase to most fighters, stealth , and maybe spying/increase unrest, assassin). - maybe a rank of two of magic for some heroes (to cast some basic combat buffs on themeslves) - for great leaders, a "summon allies" would be thematic : if the hero was able to summon one unit per turn (think elite sacred unit usually), it wouldn't be overpowered, but it would be something that would make the hero really usefull (one more sacred unit per turn, and it would allow you to recruit ponctually some sacred capitol-only unit far from the capitol during a campain) when a hero is supposed to be the leader of an elite force, this would be ther perfect ability. A variant would be a charimatic hero that would draw to him low level units (the summon ability would summon several units, but they wouldn't be sacred or powerful ones) Exemples : - the antlered shaman hero from EA Ulm, supposed to have trained more steel warriors that any other shamans, could be able to summon one /turn (note that if you do that, you can't use him to research or forge items) - A general hero (maybe multiple) could recruit basic units (lots of cannon fodder like militia, or some (2~3) medium or heavy infantry) from its nation Of course this should not be used for all warriors type heroes, but there are several that could use this ability. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Looks very nice!
It would be great to see late Atlantis get some more love... The assassins you've made look quite nice, but the tupilak rider is pretty worthless. It wouldn't really be thematic to make him buffer, but since he rides a tupilak maybe he should get huge mapmove? That would make him waaaay better... (he'd also need flying, maybe stealth? Maybe also let the tupilak fight?) Hey, I like these ideas... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Maybe they could also get the Caelian who taught them how to iceforge? |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Since Jurri mentioned the Polypal Mother, and her lack of individual usefulness, possibly consider that she spawn a third type of Aboleth-aside from standard and gibodai. A couple of extra hero-mothers could similarly spawn the third kind, which could perhaps open up another strategy for Aboleth-kind. Maybe the ones that the Mother spawns are sacred-opening up bless-strategy for Aboleths. Maybe a hero type spawns amphibious spawn while another hero type spawns that have a small amount of poison damage (like 1 point of weak poison) and then explode like a much-reduced-in-power-Medallion-of-Vengeance-except-poison-instead-of-fire effect (say area effect weakest poison). I could see lots of hero-mother possibilities here that could really open Aboleth up, and since they're each the result of a unique hero, they can be more fun without having to totally take a bow to balancing.
Also, I'm sorry to see Sedna didn't make the cut, was she just too powerful? |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
@Jack
regarding orokestes: heīs actually a pretty bad example for the way I modded mages, because he is a relict from dom2. In dom2 mystics had astral 2 and 3 in elemental paths, with one elemental path combined and a maximum of 3 in a single path. Now they are badly nerfed with an average of only 3,5 magic paths and a maximum of 2. So right now the unmodded orokestes wouldnīt need any more buffs to be vastly superior to a mystic, but even modded he isnīt a particularly powerful mage, so Iīd rather leave him in his modded state. Compared to tjatse an a3w3d3h2 niefel jarl that can shapechange into an eagle with a4, or kirke with w2s2n4d4, heal troops and glamour, he really is a weakling. Regarding the misc slots: I still feel that they fit on heroes, after all heroes are usually the ones that deck themselves out with magic items in traditional rpgs and it gives you more freedom to design your hero, so I think the change generally adds to the enjoyment. I should remove it on a couple of the new multiheroes though, where versions exist with the standard amount of slots. Sadly a summon allies ability is currently not moddable, it would make for tons of interesting heroes. @ygorl Good point regarding the rider. I will probably make him into an assassin with mapmove 4 and all possible survivals. Flying seems to be a bit much of a stretch. Caelian hero is another good point. @Honeybadger As i said above summon allies sadly isnīt possible at the moment. Sedna didnīt make the cut, because itīs not possible to mod names at the moment and I want unique heroes to generally have a unique name, unless they are themselves fairly generic like the commander of the living pillars. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Ygorl said: "Maybe they could also get the Caelian who taught them how to iceforge?"
That would RULE. Maybe in a later patch there will be more freedom as to what's moddable. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
If I remind correctly LA atlantis backstory, they were not taught the secret of ice-crafting, they stole it by "interrogating" captured Caelians, but I might have misunderstood
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Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
I suggested flight since the tupilak can transform into a raven. If it's a normal-sized raven, of course, it would be a little ridiculous; a tupilak-sized raven, though...
It would look pretty funny in battle to see a bear with a rider fly, also. And yup, you're right, Jack. Coerced from Caelian captives it was... I still like the hero idea, though - maybe there's a way to work it in. How about something like the following (I put brackets in where I didn't know the numbers): #newmonster [whatever] #name "Angra the Broken Seraph" #copystats [caelian seraph] #copysprite [caelian seraph] #gcost 1 #mor 8 #mr 13 #magicskill [air] 3 #forgebonus 25 #[the extra misc slot that you've been giving to heroes] #descr "When his settlement party was captured and interrogated by Atlanteans, the flighty and weak-willed Angra was the first to break down. He revealed the secrets of ice forging, and now sullenly serves his new masters." #end |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
For the broken seraph, shouldn't he have some water magic (even if it mean less air magic) as Caelian ice craftnig has always been associated with water magic, not air ?
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Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Copying the stats from the Seraph should give him 1W. I was thinking that 2A2W might make more sense thematically (especially given things he might have learned from his new masters) but that wouldn't be as exciting a pickup for Atlantis. I put the "flighty" in his description to account for the increased air - game mechanics meshed with game atmosphere, glued together with a bad pun.
I was also waffling on whether or not to give him a forgebonus. I decided to put it in, figuring that if Angra made it into Turin's mod he could remove it or leave it as he wished. Seraphim don't get it normally, but I justified it to myself since after his capture he's been forced to do a lot of ice forging, and also he's clarified techniques for himself during the course of formulating his teachings for others. |
Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Caelian Ice Crafters have forge bonus. LA Caelian Ironcrafters have forge bonus. W2E2?
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Re: worthy heroes mod version 1.4
Thanks for doing this mod, I loved it in DomII and I'm very happy to see it back!
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Nations that still need heroes
Here is a list of all nations with less than 3 heroes. Some others have duplicate heroes across all ages (Arcos, Pangaea, MA/LA Abys, MA/LA Caelum), and could also use new heroes if you happen to have an idea.
EA Marverni: 1 normal +1 multihero EA Caelum: 1 +1 multi EA Helheim: 1 +1 multi MA Mictlan: 2 MA Shinuyama: 1 +1 multi MA Agartha: 0(2) +1 multi LA Agartha: 0(1) +2 multi (might get more if my Brothers of the Cave gets incorporated) GOOD MONKEYS: EA Kailasa: 1 +1 multi MA Bandar Log: 0 +2 multi LA Patala: 0 +1 multi WATER NATIONS: EA R'lyeh: 1 +1 multi EA Oceania: 0 +1 multi MA Oceania: 0 +1 multi EA Atlantis: 1 +1 multi LA Atlantis: 1 +1 multi Any ideas? Marverni: they'll get Boar summons, and sacred Boars. Including elephant-sized ones. So... Hog-knight of the Hoburg? Wereboar? A shapechanging mage? A really good Sequani Stargazer? A Sequani who left to study in the great city of Ermor? EA Caelum: A Yazada multihero? A huge bird? An anormous Sping Hawk? An Icecrafter with good magic and forge bonus? Monkey nations: A monkey born discolored, so as to be of a different caste, or outside of them: a red Vanara, a white Bandar, etc. Sun Wukong the Monkey King (http://www.internationalhero.co.uk/m/monkey.htm) who is, among other things, invulnerable, indestructible by fire, lightning or over a month of alchemical fires of Lao Tsu of the Heavens, immortal, able to fly insane distances, can take forms of various objects (glamour), has a shape-changing staff (from the same source as the Spear of the Dragon King), etc. EA R'lyeh: Some ancient monolith/statue/spirit that precedes even the Aboleths. |
Re: Nations that still need heroes
A warning:
3.08 pretty much broke the mod, because suddenly the itemslot numbers I used are incorrect and now pretty much every hero has two heads. In addition some old age issue showed up, but a fix is on the way. |
Re: Nations that still need heroes
Ugh. Quick, quick, fix, fix! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif
Thanks for this awesome mod! |
Re: Nations that still need heroes
Love the work, and thanks for keeping up on it.
One request (of course), 1 more hero for T'ien Chi for a total of 4. Possibly a thug (horseman, tai chi, martial arts) or ancestral spirit (one of their national summons made corporeal). |
Re: Nations that still need heroes
I'm totally sold on this mod and I just realised I never even said thanks Turin for making it. It's great.
I hope you update to mesh with 3.08 and it all goes smoothly. I have to update a bunch of stuff myself. |
Re: Nations that still need heroes
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Lets hope Illwinter get the message, we want cool heros! |
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