What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

I have fleets sitting for several turns not getting all their supplies, I have retrofits going turn, after turn, after turn, not getting supplies. Sitting on planets with spaceyards and resupply depots! This is not what page 29 of the manual indicates should be happening. Any ideas?

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Odd… I am not seeing this same problem. All of my ships are getting the correct supplies. Dumb question here but you did remember to put in the Supply Storage component and not something else like a Cargo Bay right? You’re engines will store supplies too so this shouldn’t be causing the source of your observed problem. Still stranger things have happened…

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

I had actually double checked and noticed I did not have extra supply on a couple of the designs, but lots of ordinance. Nonetheless, other ships of the same type DO get their supply, albeit slower than heck in some situations.

I have a fleet of 20 ships in one system that hasn't received full supply in 10+ turns, and their sitting on a planet with resupply and spaceyard! Ordinance seems to be filling up as it should.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

It is worth noting that resupply depots only spread a certain amount of supplies.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Thanks Mr. Toxin that was going to be my next question. Are the ships not filling up at all or are they filling up slowly? How slowly? Like a number that when multiplied by all the other ships equals 500 or 1000? Of course your current tech level in StarShip Support will affect this number. Anyway what I am trying to drive at is this. If the number comes out to 1000 (give a little depending a level) than all is good. If it is 500 and those same ships are parked in orbit it could mean there is a bug causing the “Remote Supply Distribution” ability to override the “Supply Generation” ability shorting ships in orbit and by extension all other ships in the system. Check it out and let us know what number your math produces.

And what version of SE5 are you using and are you using nay Mods?

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Hmmm, is that covered in the manual? Page 29 says resupply is instant? I'm not sure what I'm supposed to add up, the remaining supply to be filled? The ships are filling up slowly, except for the refits, they just keep sittin there. I have about 25 ships in the system, 20 in a task force, the refits are by themselves. No mods, but I'm wondering if this is something that can be fixed with a mod. I haven't downloaded any because the game has had so many issues and my time is limited and I'm still trying to learn the interface.

It almost seems like someone forgot this game was supposed to be fun, not tedious. I don't want to have to use a calculator to determine how much supply I'm going to get.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Take a look at a ship, preferably one orbiting a planet with a resupply depot. Record the current supply amount then process a turn. Go to the same ship and look at the new supply amount. Subtract to find the difference. Post (a) the difference you got here and post (b) the number of ships in orbit around the same planet with the ship you picked and (c) the number of ships in the system at the end of the turn before you processed the turn.

Manual? I haven’t read a manual for this game yet! And I have been playing it since the late days of SE2! Was there a manual back then, there was a tutor/helper but I don’t recall a manual. Anyway it may not be in the manual, I am a modder and work under the hood, not off the books! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Hi StarJack.
Resupply is instant, but it does not give you instant full supplies. The Resupply Facility only gives you a certain amount of supplies. Check the Resupply Facility for details.
You said you were retro-fitting your ships? If your new ships have newer engines, then most (all?) of your supplies vanish with the old engines.
I learned this the hard way. If you retro-fit your engines, move the supplies to the planet first...

PS. Cheat code for resupply = ~restoresupplies~

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Resupply is instant; in what way? Do you mean automatic?

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Well I got all but about 12 ships out of the system. The 3 I retrofitted are still sitting there with 0 supplies. Surely your not saying only 500-1000 supplies are available per system? Please tell me your not saying that. I'm at starship support level 5 and resupply level 6.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Check your planet's cargo, and see how much supply they have available.

If you sucked them dry when you arrived, you could either move the ships, or order them to load (under cargo) supplies from the planet.

The resupply depot will distribute a small number of supplies as noted before, each turn to ships anywhere in the system. It will also push an unlimited number of supplies to ships entering and/or leaving the hex. (Limited only by the planetary storage amount)

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

OK, I just looked at the facility, says it generates 1100 supplies per turn is that for ALL ships in orbit, or per ship in orbit? I have that sick, disgusting feeling that it's total, since my refits have been sitting there for over 10 turns without getting any supply.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

OK I checked the planet and it's out of supplies. The ships can only move one hex a turn so moving them will take ages. I'm probably misunderstanding your load cargo comment since the planet has no supplies? And yes the retrofit involved new engines, should I receive a supply penalty for upgrading engines? I need to dump supplies planet side before retrofitting! I hope that's a bug. Jeeze, I guess I need to build a resupply base on every planet now. This seems bloody tedious.

Thanks for all your help guys, I'll say it again, this forum saves this game. You guys should be sharing in whatever profits there are.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

I meant in the case of draining the supplies when you arrived, but then rebuilding more in the meantime without giving them to the ships...

If you have another planet around somewhere, you could transfer all the supplies onto one or a few ships. Just enough to get them to the nearest other planet with supply. then they could fill up there, and carry the extra supplies back to the fleet.

You could also build a dedicates supply tanker, to shuttle supplies up from the core systems of your empire.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Technically speaking, you always lost your engine's supplies when retrofitting in SE:IV as well - the difference was that the resupply was unlimited though. But yes it does make sense now to dump supplies on the planet that retrofitting. The transfer order can make this fast.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

I see SJ already took that on. When you process a turn 1100 supplies should be generated and divided among the ships in orbit. Remember my comment of 1000 plus some depending on your current level? Anyway have you processed a turn yet? I build ammo and supply ships for my fleets; one ship that does both that is. So far I don’t see how your ships are not getting supplied. If you’ve sucked the planet dry you need to process the next turn. I don’t like the lost supplies thingy either. As CPT Kwok said in SE4 it didn’t matter, now though it sucks. Supplies should be automatically unloaded when a ship is given the refit command.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

I processed 2-3 turns, I set everything to easy in this game just to learn the ropes, and boy there's a bunch of ropes! Those ships still haven't received supply, but other ships in the system are. SJ's point on transferring cargo from other systems may be of use in the future, as well as your thoughts on supply ships. I had just redesigned some ships to carry extra supply/ordinance, and I may ammend that to just have some large supply ships and set up runs from other systems I do not have fleets stationed in.

This is however just another tedious aspect of the design of SEV. Having to sweat details of logistical supply is tedious, not fun. Maybe it's just me but I'm puzzled by the concept of a science fiction game where you can build huge star faring warships that can destroy entire solar systems, but you have to struggle to supply them. While it's semantics arguing common sense in this type of game, this just makes no sense to me.

Now I'm off to contact tech support about the crash bug in strategic combat. (rolls eyes)

Thanks again for your assistance, death to your enemies!

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Can you attach your save game so we can look at it? I think the saves in SE5 are too large to do that anymore though. I kept hearing about the crash in Strategic but till last night I had never seen it. Then it finally happened to me! Funny how I have run so many combats but it has only crashed once. Supply may seem kind of odd but it keeps one maniac from building a mega fleet and sending it out to destroy all opponents. You can still do it but not till later in the game where time playing has made up some for early bonuses. I never kill my enemies. Someone needs to clean the toilet, especially after chili night!

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

To be fair though, there are reasons why other supply options exist. It doesn't help so much with the low rate from the Resupply Depots in stock, but it does make overall supply management a lot less tedious.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

StarJack I think your going to do fine here! Welcome to our forum, now yours too! So take your funky behind off and get an avatar already; sheesh… Oh and don’t forget to start learning how to mod!

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Sounds like Galciv2 is more for your taste.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Save with the supply issue attached (hopefully). A save with the crash bug from me is in this thread http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/thr...&fpart=all

and has been shipped to tech support. The strategic combat crash happened to me in 1.00, went away in 1.08, and now is back in 1.17. I didn't get to run 1.13. This save is a continuation of the other, and it's not meant to be serious, I'm just goofing off, learning the UI (grrrr), and trying out some ideas. And I resemble the maniac comment!

My main constraint learning to mod etc. is time, I usually put in 50-60 hours a week in a data center. I just happen to have some vacation time this month and before xmas.

Ahh, ship capture is your style then to get those free maid services. (Is boarding fixed yet?) Good use of resources.

I'm not much good with graphics, but I'll see what I can find later on that won't get me banned! (rofl)

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

I have it but I haven't played in a while. The concept of 3-5 facilities a planet rubbed me wrong after SEIV, and building one too many farms and having the population riot just turned me off. I wound up going back to SEIV when I had time to kill, and will probably trade in Galciv for something else over xmas holidays. If things proceed with SEV like I expect, it'll be a better game next spring once the bugs are stomped and the modders have had at it.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Here try The Avatar Emporium by our local graphics guru David E. Gervais. You can see more of his work by playing SE5 too. The thread for the Emporium is located here if you want to make a request. You can also find the rank if you want to get spiffy and add some.

I didn’t care for GalCiv either, maybe because I was already very spoiled to the SE series. Modding does take a lot of time, but if you learn it in chunks starting with the Components.txt file you will be able to fix and tweak some things that irritate you now. Some not all! Boarding isn’t really my thing, there’s just not enough room in space for other ships. I prefer to stand in orbit and carry out a demonstrative strike then demand surrender. If that doesn’t work I can always order in new shipments of ammo; if you catch my meaning. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

As for the Strategic problem there is nothing I can say to help you with there. What you are reporting is what I have heard since the game was released. I would strongly advise that you send your bug reports and your save game to support_at_malfador_dot_com. Aaron is the greatest about taking the time to reply. In fact after I post this message I am going off to answer a question he sent me regarding a recent email. He really cares about how we feel about the game and I have never heard anyone say he hasn’t gotten back to them when needed.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

GalCiv 1 seemed to me to be a "civ in space" clone, though I didn't play it all that much. If I want that I'd play Alpha Centauri, which seems to do it better.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Well, actually I like Civ and didn’t want to say GalCiv seemed like a clone; but, since you said it first I agree. Now that I think of it an old friend gave me my copy of GalCiv. Said he had played it and didn’t want anything in return. It didn’t take too long before I was thankful I hadn’t traded.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

GalCiv2 was head and shoulders above GalCiv 1. Yet it isn't SEIV, or SEV for that matter. As for being a Civ clone, it was intended that way. The developers loved Civ, and wanted a space version of it. AC has a flavor all its own...The AI for GC2 is supposed to be very good. The lego like ship constructor is an interesting addition, but not really needed...yet it does eliminate the pesky need to be able to make models.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

StarJack my apologies for taking so long getting back to you! I took a look at the save game and your ships are supplying just fine. Here is a breakdown of what is taking place:

In the Lapzooli System planet Lapzooli 1 had the only resupply depot which generated 1,100 units per turn. After processing the turn the depot was upgraded so it now generates 1,400 units per turn. Also orbiting the planet is DD-M2-3 0003 which had 6,600 units of supply before processing the turn and had 8,000 units afterwards. This is a gain of 1,400 units of supply (8,000-6,600=1,400) which accounts for all the supplies being generated (the 1,400 units). This is also why no other ship in orbit is getting any supplies; all units are being poured into refilling the DD-M2-3 0003. I took a look at the resupply order you have set and that is the order specified. As for remote resupply before processing the turn I ordered the H1 0001 to cancel all orders. After processing the turn it had been topped off so that is also working correctly.

If you want to change the order go to “Empire Options” and click “Resupply” from the left hand selection. You will see the current resupply order on the right and if you click on that list you will see the button to change it appear.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Thanks for that information Shang. I can't say I agree with the supply concept but it is what it is. Now that I know I'll take actions to avoid the issue, more resupply facilities, more emphasis on supply in research, and the supply barge runs from inner systems before major combat actions. Most helpful!

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Dedicating more facility space in the front line systems to resupply depots will help too.

Once the front line moves on, you could scrap the excess depots to build miners... just leave enough depots to keep your transports topped up while shuttling units to the front.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Thanks for the info, a request has been placed for an avatar, and I'm copying malfador on my e-mails to strategy first tech support!

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

I wouldn’t even bother with Strategy First. There is a difference of opinions here about Aaron’s move to use Strategy First in publishing SE5. I don’t want to say anything that would start the fire fight over so suffice it to say I don’t think Strategy First was the best choice. If you really need help ask us (like this question) or contact Aaron. As you get familiarized with the forum and the members you will start to see we sometimes act like a bunch of old hags. We feel a certain way about certain topics (purposely vague) and will argue amongst ourselves. We always come back together in the end and the past is forgotten and forgiven. Well, except in Fyron’s case, we never really forgive him and there is no forgetting him! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/eek.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Is it possible to "modify" the amount of supply given by the resupply facility or is that hard coded? If so where do I look?

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Oh your first modding lesson and I have the privilege of giving it to you! I feel honored. Go to your SE5 directory and look in the folder marked Data. Open the file named Facilities.txt and search out the Resupply Depot; it’s the third one listed. There are four abilities and each are well marked so that part should be easy. Now before you begin I suggest that you make a copy of that file so you can restore a backup if something gets accidentally screwed up. If nothing else you can always ask for a clean copy from here; but make the backup anyway that would be better.

If you are using a mod you will need to go to Game Types >> the folder named after the mod (i.e. Balance) >> Data

Anything else just ask away.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Thanks for the info. I made a clean copy of everything first. I shouldn't be looking at these files! <snicker> I had moved about 30 additional ships into the Lapzooli system you looked at in my prior save. It took 12 turns, and running two supply frieghters into the system, to get 65 odd ships up to full supply, and that's with 3 resupply depots in system. That's just over the top to me. So I'm going to double the resupply rate for now. I might put it back when I start a real game, but I doubt it http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif . Thanks Shang!

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

If you can resupply 65 ships with 3 resupply depots in anything less than 3 turns... Now thats over the top. Supply has to take effort and time or it's meaningless. A large fleet like that should take a significant amount of effort to keep in supply.

Javaslinger

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Sorry, I don't buy that philosphy. (and actually it was 12 turns, 3 I could live with, I'm trying to get it down to 6) A race that can build a star faring dreadnought in 4-5 months, that can crack planets open and put out suns, is not going to take 3 times that long to load it with fuel and food. These ships had not even fought a prior engagement. Leaving their homeworlds full, and simply flying to another system, and taking over a year to resupply makes no sense. None.

It would make more sense to have a proportions mod that made it take 12 turns (or more) to actually BUILD the dreadnought, and 4-5 months to supply it, than the other way around.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Ha-ha-ha-ha; something like a total conversion being made by yours truly! How does this grab you:

Largest Hull Name: Juggernaught
Displacement: 5,000kt
Available at: High Tech Level 16 (of 18)
Time to build hull only using most modern yards: 11.9 turns (1 year 2 months)

Now that is what I call a true build rate, over a year to make the hull and add a few more months for the internals. Say about two years to make a ship that has no rivals! If I can get the patches to put this TC out players will need to come to grips with a ship being a valuable item! In stock they are just throw away units.

Geeeeeeeeeee…………

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

I've always thought stock building times are way too fast. Increase in ship size barely even increase building time, as well. I'd far prefer if it took 'ages' to build ships so that you actually wanted to take care of every single one of them, instead of the current situation where building new ships takes even less time than resupplying and repairing your current ships.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Well, to increase building times you could simply increase the min/org/rad cost of the respective hulls and add in the reduce maintinance ability to keep maint costs normal. However, that doesn't address the ability to quickly build large ships/bases by using retro-series.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

That's what I'm talking about PES! <doing that football chest to chest thump move> http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Just don't make it take 3 years to resupply! <ducking>

That's one of the beauty things about this game, for at least some of the game play issues, if you don't like it, mod it!

When I was thinking about resupply the USS Yorktown, came to mind. I think she was 18 months from keel to sea trials but I'm not sure. I DO know she was heavily damaged in the battle of the Coral Sea. She was turned around for the battle of Midway by a still reeling from damage port repair facility at Pearl in THREE DAYS and fought effectively, if not at 100% at Midway.

A proportions mod, some improved (and yeah, instantly resupplying a fleet is not right either) resupply, and the kicker, an AI greatly improved from it's present ability, stuff to drool over.

I look forward to enjoying some of your work!

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

Some of the strategies one used in SEIV will not work very well in SEV. Supply is one of them. For instance in SEIV you would build one or two resupply depots at strategic planets in a system. In SEV you might want to build a resupply depot on each planet or dedicate one planet just to supply. The more resupply depots you have in a system the more supplies that will be transported out to your fleet. Remember one of the default colony types is a resupply base.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

GGmod has some of those features.

The main problem with supply/ordnance in the game I played with SE5a was the fact that the storage facilities don't work yet... A fleet would drain the storage capacity of a planet because the facilities weren't storing anything; the production rate was nice, but there was no opportunity to build a stockpile.
I've increased the planet's base storage to huge levels to compensate for now.

Scouts can be built 30 at a time from the homeworld, while dreadnoughts take about 2 turns, depending on the loadout. (Cost/build time is proportional to size squared. Maintenance is somewhere between flat-rate and the square root of size)
This makes those big ships very valuable, but also hard to acquire.

Maintenance on the dreads is insignificant compared to their build cost, so it is always worth it to repair them...
The small ships, on the other hand, are quite disposable. I design some of my smaller cannon fodder to kamikaze charge with a small short range plasma cannon after they run out of ordnance for their long range bombardment weapons.

As far as repairs go, you can fix 90% of the hitpoints in very little time (armor), while the internals take significantly longer. Proper use of repair priorities will ensure you get the armor bolted back on and basic engine power restored quickly so you can bring whatever surviving guns you have to bear.

The CBmod style combat system encourages the survival of heavily damaged ships, too... if I decide to convert to QNP instead of anti-QNP it should end up encouraging basic mobility in otherwise disabled ships too.

Re: What\'s going on with SUPPLY?
 

How do you keep the fodder from charging in before they've fired off their main ammo? Max-range strategy?

anti QNP?