Guarding thugs
 

I have a little doubt about hardly paid troops set on Guard commander order. It seems they only sit around their chief taking blows and arrows. Like a living (or maybe non-living) shield.
Is this a wrong feeling?
I have been in a situation where the intervention of guarding elite troops would have turned the tide of battle but I watched helplessly as they stood there without returning blows...

If this troop shield effect is true would it be better to have cannon fodder guard the commander? Why pay a lot for elite troops if they only sit around?

Re: Guarding thugs
 

In battles guards start to attack when their commander is wounded or if he attacks (unless they can use missiles). Guards are mostly usefull if you fear assassination attempts or to have an unit starting to attack in another round than the first or the third (ie you may give a commander bodyguards and a (holdx5) (attack closest) script if you want a squad waiting as long as possible before going to melee).

Re: Guarding thugs
 

How to use units set to "guard commander" :

- if someone try to assassinate your commander, up to 5 units set to "guard commander" will protect the commander.
Note that some spells work like assassination. Same thing for horror marked commanders attacked by a horror

- for melee units, you can use the "guard commander" order to keep the units in formation with their commander.

Exemples :

- knight commander set to "hold" x3 then "attack rearmost" + knights set to "guard commander"

=> this allow the squad to wait 3 turns (instead of 2 for the "hold and attack order"), and even if you want to just wait 2 turns, the guard commander version make it so that you're sure the commander won't attack someone alone while his units go for another target

- Hoplite commander + hoplites + elephants
=> thanks to the "guard commander" order the elephants won't charge to far, so they will still have the support from the hoplites.


Important :

- don't forget to give your commander an attack order. By default melee commanders (no magic or ranger weapon) are set to "stay behind troops", so without attack you rbodyguards will stand behind, mostly useless
- don't use this order with ranged units : bows and other ranged weapon are not used when in "guard commander" mode

Re: Guarding thugs
 

Thanks, so having troops guarding a mage is useless also...

Re: Guarding thugs
 

Not entirely useless, since they can save the mage if he is attacked. Other than that, pretty much.

Re: Guarding thugs
 

Pretty useless, if they won't attack even when enemy comes within reach of the commander they're guarding.

If they wait until the mage is wounded to attack, then he's probably dead already. They may draw some attacks, but if they don't respond that's just a short delay.

They should at least attack when the squad is attacked, or preferably when an enemy gets too close.

Re: Guarding thugs
 

If an ennemy is in melee range they will attack.

Usually bodyguards can protect your mage from a few ennemies that got through your main force (such as a flanking cavalry set to attack rearmost), but it's true that sometimes they don't do this job very well

Re: Guarding thugs
 

That's what I'd assumed they did, but the original question implied they wouldn't.

Re: Guarding thugs
 

Some mages are pretty tough on their own: I'm playing EA Atlantis and there are those nice Basalt Kings.
I have seen the guards react to assault only if the enemy is in melee range. i.e.: if there are 10 guards and only one of them has an enemy in range, it will land some timid blow (apparently they don't attack every round... but I could be wrong) while the other keep standing still, leaving their comrade to their fate.
So you have this group of guards getting killed one after another, just beacuse enemies mass on the first unit they encounter while the guards mass on their commander (but I guess that should be the task of a bodyguard troupe anyway).

Re: Guarding thugs
 

If you have a decent sized group defending, it will act as a buffer between the enemy troops and the commander. This can be a particularly good if you have a HP weak magic user and/or you are fighting flying troops. Otherwise your magic user can be killed before he casts many (or sometimes any) spells.

I have used the random event generated militia for this defense. Even if their morale breaks they still are a temporary distraction for the enemy, and can make the difference between the mage surviving or dying; this in turn can make the difference between winning or losing a battle.

Assuming you place your spell casters near the back of your troops, I think this tactic should also help against enemy archers shooting at the rear by providing some extra targets.

Re: Guarding thugs
 

While expanding with EA Agartha I'd send 1 oracle plus 15-20 Ancient Ones set on guard. Everyone was positioned way in the back, and the mage scripted divine bless, summon earthpower, 3x bladewind.

The Ancient Ones held their ground while the bad guys walked through the teeth of the blade winds. Whatever got through was handled by guards.

Re: Guarding thugs
 

Guard commander is a great order to keep your troops out of fights. Often you have few elite troops/SC who can handle the enemy, but to siege enemy you need much larger army (which you certainly don't want to lose). So most of troops can be set to guard some commanders who stay in the back. I think they will also cheer for your real troops while on guard http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Guarding thugs
 

I often set 1-6 troops guarding a melee commander, and script the commander to attack from slightly behind my other troops' positions, which I have had a lot of success with. I'm not saying it's a super strategy, or that it will keep mortal commanders from getting killed by battlefield magic or a tough combat, but one of my main goals (especially playing single-player) is to keep my mortal commanders alive and able to contribute, and to follow their progress sort of like in an RPG, because I find it fun.

PvK