Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

EA Abysia is all about fire. Fair enough, I have set up the damage spells and enemies armies tend to turn into giant bonfires. I summoned the two Fire Kings and they do their thing, thought fire based construction items are not that exciting. Second Sun is too subtle for me to figure out the big advantage for 80 gems. Late game, I don’t see the “kick butt” strategy. What am I missing?

Every other nation I have played has a range of different strategies and in late game can do many interesting things. All Abysia seems to do is get more and more fire damage spells. There has been no sudden “look what I just got, my nation rocks” moment that you get when you GOR an Otherness or finally cast Astral Corruption. Just more and more fire mages tossing more and more forms of fire over the heads

Also, the national summons spells, Spectral Infantry and Scorpion Man, both rely on empowerment and gems that you have to get independents or mercenaries to create. Maybe I am missing something (I usually am) but these units can not make up the heart of a strategy for this nation.

So, yes, a strong but slow nation, but it seems unusually shallow. You have to diversify your magic. Am I missing something? Have I not explored blood and astral enough?

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

I got absolutely destroyed by a guy playing Abysia who used astral magic to setup a giant communion army. They had one leader who would communion master and then cast firestorm. Or whatever the name of the AoE battlefield wide nuke was.

Jazzepi

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

Doesn't have to be communion either - you have the blood there for sabbaths too.

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

Flame storm is F5, any Anointed can cast it with a simple Phoenix Power casting, I don't see all the fuss with communions.

They can also summon Scorpion Men with base paths, contrary to what the OP seems to imply.

The demon lords have all of the paths except water and astral between them, but they're expensive and pretty late game. It is a last-resort option for diversification though. Astral magic is really good also, but the EA Warlocks are fairly weak in both.

Nature is always an option via indies, at worst, and then you can start site searching for enchantresses, which open up much better nature and all the elements and seem to be fairly common.

Playing the mid-era version of Aby in MP I found that establishing a good trade partner early on will greatly aid your attempts at diversifying. Hellbind heart mage-trades are especially good for you if you can get a trade arranged. Negotiating for an air mage is especially fun because you can trade with anyone on the map with cloud trapeze, so you can afford to shop around a bit in a large game. Try some of those ideas, see if it helps.

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

Fire storm, the spell I was talking about, is a battlefield wide AoE enchantment spell. It's absolutely nuts. Unfortunately you can not simply empower yourself to F5 to cast it. It costs 500 fatigue, so you need some form of communicants to distribute the fatigue.

I don't know, maybe the game lets you expend commanders to single cast it and let them die to the fatigue?

Jazzepi

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

In retrospect, it doesn't matter. The spell ends if the mage dies, so it would be useless to do a suicidal casting of it if it is even possible.

Jazzepi

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

You can cast Fire Storm with a fire 5 mage, no communion needed, and the mage does not die. I have done so several times. The effect can be nice.

http://img329.imageshack.us/img329/8162/fireap1.jpg

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

I confess that I don't understand. Shouldn't your mage be killed by fatigue when it goes over 200 isn't it converted into damage?

Jazzepi

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

Being the Abysia player in question, I didn't use a communion for that particular casting, I just gave the Annointed of Rhaux a load of booster items and fire gems.

Pure fire magic lacks versatility, to say the least. It's got the worst summons in the game, and not that much in the way of buffs either. And I always seem to have terrible luck finding fire sites.

For the Middle Way game, I took a 4-earth, 4-astral, 4-blood great enchantress. Being able to forge all the blood, astral and earth boosters was a real boost to my magical versatility, making the feeble skills that EA Abysia has in these paths useful. The free astral gem every turn helped as well.

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

I'm not sure what the mechanics are exactly, but the impression I have is that fatigue from a spell is capped at 200. A mage can't die from casting a spell, but communion slaves can.

Fire magic isn't versatile, but it can destroy anything that isn't immune to fire, and SCs are vulnerable to Blindness.

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

hey bro, take the extra-gems-for-the-fatigue-purpose factor into consider. read p89 of your manual.

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

I like that idea of the middle path pretender, designed to lift those paths (ESB) that are weakly available in the national mages. I had been playing with a water blessing to speed up and boost defense on the sacreds, but it was not helping my magic situation much. I will use this set up to ensure I have a better game next time.

In the short term, I will experiment with Fire Storm. Thank you for pointing it out, I had overlooked it. I expect C’tis is about to evaporate! With Phoenix Power it is easy to reach and Flaming Skulls are useful, so I have a few around.

Point taken Micah, the 440 gold mage does have E and can cast Scorpion Men. However, he can not forge items to boost his E skill, so he can not cast Gnome Lore. Getting enough gems to summon any significant number of Scorpion Men is tough and I don’t generally like having such expensive units doing site searching with their time. Good thing most of the mages are sacred for upkeep. You have to take E on the pretender if you plan to summon any real number of these guys, I don’t think you can argue that Abysia is ready to use them much otherwise.

The same with the D magic needed for Spectral Infantry. Now, Death summons are good, but any nation can build a pretender to take advantage of it. It seems odd that the low level national summons needs D, but for this nation it is not much of an option.

Anyway, thank you for pointing out the “on switch!”

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

Um, yeah. Scorpion Men rock hard. They're late-game only, and quite a bit expensive, but they're very nice.

Burning Ones are great units, but cap-only and very resource-heavy. And the strategic move of 1 will limit your options until you can get the Gateway thing going. Therefore, I wouldn't really play EA Abysia as a bless nation. Not that you said you were going to do so, but anyway....

Here's a fun thing to do with Fire magic: Race up the Evocation tree to Fires from Afar. Start toasting enemy armies before they can engage with you. Continue researching to Flames from the Sky. Now your toaster is extra-toasty. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Fire construction items aren't great, true, but they aren't useless. A Warlord with two Fire Bolas (one in each hand!) can be fun. Demonbred assassins with Rods of the Phoenix are a hoot. And ... um ... I'll think of something else really soon. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

And did I mention Scorpion Men? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

Im pretty sure that dosnt matter. Aslong as he has the correct paths and the minimum amount of gems any mage could cast that spell and the fatigue wouldnt kill him. Your cant kill yourself through spell fatigue but you can kill communicants. Fire storm is pretty nice and is particularly useful for taking out non fire-resistant enemy mages. Late game with abysia you can get a blood economy going to help diversity.

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

They're quite affordable if you take production, especially with the boost in the last patch. Considering their equipment, they're actually quite a bargain, resource-wise.

A superstrong bless isn't necessary; a 9/4 is enough. A Solar Disc with fire-9, nature-4 for example.

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

I had some success with Earth 9 Nature 4 bless. Useful for the mages too. This was with CB mod though.

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

I had some limited success with it in a non-CB game although it was mainly for newbies(and me, im just crap) but i was fighting multiple nations(one being EA Tien Chi played by frank trollman) and doing quite well. I had a good number of annoited in the hall of fame with 400+ kills each(who eventually got targetted by vengance of the dead... not pretty) and armies composed mostly of burning ones, flail infantry and axe/shield infantry supported by annointed blasting with falling fires and pillars of fire worked well.
I also had some indy/non fire aura armies with large groups of archers with the flaming arrows buff(pretty viable even later on in the game if you can support it).
For raiding/support i had demonbred slayers(moderately equipped incase an assasination target showed up) with rods of the leper king leading around groups of fiends of darkness which worked great, a group of stealthy flyers with good combot power lead by a powerful assasin makes for a very versatile tool(support armies, raid back provinces, harrass enemy armies, assasinate researchers ect).
I also did a few suicidal charges with the F2 holy mages(generally with one of them blessing the others for reinvigoration) casting phoenix pyre and shielded by a few infantry(to reach the target) which nicely softened up some enemies.

as a final note: Decently equipped fire kings with phoenix pyre and very high reinvigoration(i used vine kings summoned by the pretender to forge nature items) are VERY useful and difficult to remove as you have to kill them several times in quick succession to completely kill them.

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

Heat From Hell also turns out to be nicer than expected in large battles. It is not fast, nor is it a killer, but it adds up over time. Tied in with the heat effect of your units and a possible Inner Furnace, enemy troops start to evaporate pretty quickly as fatigue spikes up. It also seems to slows the enemy spell casting down, making them rest one turn earlier than normal. It is a bit subtle, but something worth looking at if you are playing with this nation.

Fire Storm is as powerful as advertised. However, it does take some time, so make sure you have troops to slow down the enemy and build up the damage.

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

Yes, and it has always been that way. A mage stops at 200 fatigue when he casts a spell (unless he is a communion slave, yadda yadda). Should he receive further fatigue (stun effects etc.) then those points over 200 are converted to damage.

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

Demonbred assassins are great, versatile units.

Prophetised, they can reanimate undead and secretly push your dominion deep into enemy territory.

Their mobility makes them great platforms for Lifelong Protection. They can be easily concentrated for large battles, whilst also being able to raid and assassinate at will.

Give them a scepter of authority and they can lead misbreds on stealthy raiding missions. The misbreds are demons, but only require regular leadership.

Re: Late game EA Abyisa. Where is the on button?
 

They can lead misbreds early on but later i suggest swapping to the more effective fiends of darkness(or both).