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-   -   Mod: Ogre Kingdoms - MA Warhammer Nation - 0.9 minor update (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=35298)

Sombre July 4th, 2007 08:45 AM

Ogre Kingdoms - MA Warhammer Nation - 0.9 minor update
 
1 Attachment(s)
PREVIEW IMAGE

http://i32.tinypic.com/34xs4rp.png

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-- Version 0.9

-- FIX - Shorter facet of the maw (spell) description

-- TWEAK - Hunter harpoon now dt_large for bringing down the heffalumps

-- FIX - Skrag Gorger summon no longer messes with lantern shield

-- FIX - Gnoblar scouts get mountainsurvival

-- FIX - Berserkers was showing up twice in spell library



------------------------------------------------------------


OGRE KINGDOMS version 0.8

-- TWEAK - Gorger Pitfeast B3 -> B4

-- TWEAK - Scrapapult goldcost 170 -> 150

-- CONTENT - Mawfiend summon added

-- CONTENT - Mawpit summon added for B3E1, H3 blood saccer, no slots, no upkeep

-- CONTENT - Mawgut summon/transformation added

-- TWEAK - Braugh's weapon now raises those it slays

-- CONTENT - Yhetee shaman summon added

-- CONTENT - Skrag the Slaughterer hero added

-- TWEAK - Tyrants reduced to 80 leadership

-- TWEAK - Slaughtermasters get FE 100% pick

-- TWEAK - Gnoblar single recruits added as option, new 'flung scrap' missile weapons

-- TWEAK - New costs for commanders in line with new philosophy

-- TWEAK - Reduced costs of most recruits

-- CONTENT - Henchfiend summon added as researcher with access into death/fire

-- TWEAK - Ogre Temples, being pits in the ground, now only 100 gold

-- TWEAK - Butcher and Slaughtermaster mr boosts

-- TWEAK - Gnoblar got some patrolbonus to reflect their multiunit status



OGRE KINGDOMS 0.7

-- FIX - Reordered ID numbers to avoid future conflicts with basegame

-- TWEAK - Altered Eastern Maneater graphic slightly

-- TWEAK - Slightly decreased scraplauncher cost and increased range

-- TWEAK - Increased price of yhetee and gorger summons

-- TWEAK - Giants get one misc slot

-- TWEAK - Improved PD

-- CONTENT - Added first prophet national hero

-- TWEAK - Ogres with two weapons now don't get Ogre Smash and have had their cost tweaked accordingly

-- FIX - Changed name and epithet to better fit dominions

-- FIX - Changed name of dm and mod folder to fit my conventions

-- FIX - Starting scout is now a butcher, since they have dying dom



OGRE KINGDOMS 0.6

-- CONTENT - Added Hero 'Slavelord Braugh' and his slaves, plus his two weapons

-- FIX - Fort types checked and changed

-- TWEAK - Sacred pitfighter +10 goldcost

-- TWEAK - Bruiser and Tyrant commanders -10 goldcost each

-- TWEAK - Slavegiant gets siegebonus 5

-- FIX - added the missing mountainsurvival to gnoblar units

-- TWEAK - deathbelcher weapon better, unit +4 goldcost

-- TWEAK - gave yhetee coldpower 2



OGRE KINGDOMS 0.55

-- fixed a bunch of id conflicts with MA Skaven, should all work fine together now



OGRE KINGDOMS 0.5


-- added ogre nametype 147

-- darkvision handed out, use of copystats removed

-- checked IDs against Skaven 0.9, CBM 1.21, Avernum 1.45 + others

-- made slave giants into commander units with no slots, improved their graphics


-- Version 0.4

-- Slavegiant, scrapapult, rhinox, pit fighter added

-- Gnoblar scout added

-- Anoint Mawtribe sacred summon

-- Many tweaks


----------------------------------


STRENGTHS

1. Unequalled offensive force from Ogres
2. Mobile nation with good survivals and mapmove
3. Powerful Gut Magic buffs/summons require little/no research
4. Gnoblars, giants and scraplaunchers fill specific roles
5. Very thuggable commanders


WEAKNESSES

1. Horrible research
2. Very poor magic diversity
3. Constant supply issues
4. Dying dominion requires sacrifice
5. Predictable

Sombre July 4th, 2007 09:08 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
1 Attachment(s)
This is just a post to attach the basic ogre pic - the one I will work from as a template. Feel free to suggest changes to it, because I am not really that familiar with the Ogre models in warhammer (though I have the army book).

Obviously I don't want to copy the warhammer style exactly, I want it to fit in with dom3 and the skaven nation I've already done.

I based it on the O-Bakemono, which you can probably spot if you're familiar with them.

llamabeast July 4th, 2007 01:35 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Looks good. Ogres are since my time with Warhammer. I'm glad you haven't gone with the weird grey look Games Workshop have gone with though, I find that really offputting.

I'm really looking forward to having a play with your Skaven when I get a chance - have been very busy lately, plus have been obsessively doing Tomb Kings every spare minute. Sorry I haven't been able to comment properly on them yet, they look really exciting.

Ballbarian July 4th, 2007 02:21 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Looks like there will be yet another great mod for me to dive into playing when the shine has started to wear down for me on the vanilla game. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

I am not very familiar with the Warhammer games, but I have always been intrigued by the series. Thanks for all of your hard work on these mods.

Theonlystd July 4th, 2007 03:18 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
After how well the Skaven mod turned out.. Im really excited about this and well any others u try.



Btw what do you consider Giant Str? 14 str to me seems low but i have no idea what you considering a Giants for comparison .

Sombre July 4th, 2007 10:11 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Well basic Ogres actually only have Str 4 Tgh 4 in warhammer, which really isn't that strong - only as strong as a big orc for instance. So I can't really justify giving them Str 20 or something like the Jotuns in dom3. Bandar apes have str 15 I believe, which is roughly the same as the ogres, though the ogres are significantly tougher and get more attacks. The Slave Giant though, will have considerably higher str - giants in warhammer are larger than Jotuns, more like Niefel size.

Theonlystd July 5th, 2007 12:42 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Quote:

Sombre said:
Well basic Ogres actually only have Str 4 Tgh 4 in warhammer, which really isn't that strong - only as strong as a big orc for instance. So I can't really justify giving them Str 20 or something like the Jotuns in dom3. Bandar apes have str 15 I believe, which is roughly the same as the ogres, though the ogres are significantly tougher and get more attacks. The Slave Giant though, will have considerably higher str - giants in warhammer are larger than Jotuns, more like Niefel size.

Ahhh


Never played the actual warhammer board game the curse of living in the middle of nowhere .

And none of the Warhammer books i've read dealt with em.. So i just assumed they would be 1 handed boulder smashing strong..

Saulot July 5th, 2007 02:23 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Looks good so far (both outline and the ogre sprite).
Looking forward to it.

Sleet July 6th, 2007 07:32 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Looks cool. My son inherited a boxful of Warhammer minis all painted, he is looking forward to playing Dom3 - this will work out well.
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Sombre July 10th, 2007 10:02 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
1 Attachment(s)
Ok I have another little preview. I made some changes to the basic ogre and added in one equipped with 'gutplate n bits', an 'ogre choppa' and an ironfist. I've also done a flag, although I'm not happy with the bit mounted at the top yet - that cattle skull is just a placeholder. The flag depicts the Great Maw, devouring god of the ogres.

It's attached.

I'm going with quite straightforward graphics for the ogres, even more so than with the skaven, as they look fairly alike. I'll make sure to throw in enough variety to keep them from being boring though.

I gave them a little playtest just using a handful of their units and they tore [censored] up nicely. I toned them down a touch but I reckon they're about the same power as giants - better against groups of smaller foes (due to more attacks) but worse against bigger ones (due to lower strength).

llamabeast July 10th, 2007 12:41 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Looking very nice. They're really brutish! Very ogry.

Baneslave July 11th, 2007 04:02 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
How about giving them different kinds of war paints? It would make some differences between those basic models.

Juzza July 11th, 2007 06:31 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
I really don't think fear is quite appropriate, it seems like it will be too devastating, they'll smash front lines with the bull rush and their weapon attack, the fear will then shred moral, um, whatever happened to lesser fear??

Sombre July 11th, 2007 06:54 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
1 Attachment(s)
I agree, which is why I never planned on giving them fear. Fear is reserved for special cases, such as Warhammer creatures that cause terror.

The bull charge isn't very strong the way I have it set up right now - a charge bonus on the primary weapon is just too good, so they only get it on the ogre smash, which is a dmg 0 str based attack.

As for warpaint and variety - I think they're relatively varied without it, but I can throw some in on certain units. Butchers for example will get some nice tattoos and bloodpaint and they'll have no gutplate. I'm 80% finished with the irongut graphic, I'll attach it and you can tell me which version you prefer, or suggest changes. They do wicked damage with those two handed choppas - really good for taking down giants and heffalumps and the like. Their overall prot value is very attractive too.

llamabeast July 11th, 2007 07:18 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
How about giving them a one-use-only weapon for the bull charge?

Sombre July 11th, 2007 07:38 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
I could do. I'll see how they go in testing and maybe they can have a one shot bull charge weapon. I did have another idea, which was to have a first form which tramples, then a second form, after taking very minimal damage, which does not. I gave it a try but it wasn't doing it for me, so I scrapped it.

Currently they wreck stuff nicely and the charge bonus is minimal, unlike with say, units with lances, where the charge is the scariest thing.

Sombre July 11th, 2007 11:41 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
1 Attachment(s)
I did a couple of warpaint jobs on the Bulls.

I think I'll have warpainted Ogres be a low level blood summon - after all their warpaint is mostly blood. They can have an extra bit of morale and magic res, maybe even berserk as well.

Image is attached.

Kristoffer O July 11th, 2007 07:21 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Looks great!

I have no clue as to what Ogres do, but I wouldn't mind beating them with my darkelves (hint, hint). http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Sombre July 12th, 2007 08:43 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Ogres stomp things. That's about as complicated as they get.

As for Dark Elves, they're on the list. I do like them and think they'd be very interesting in Dom3, but Dwarfs, Ogres and possibly some others will come first.

Then there's other modding to be considered. I'm not bothered about any /new/ mods apart from warhammer ones at the moment, but I do want to get all the stuff I've released to a nice finished version. That means Arga Dis, Jomon Broken and Tharoon in particular need some serious work done on them. Vaetti, Ulm Reborn and Avernum are pretty solid already, but might need a few little tweaks.

So after those, Skaven, Ogres and Dwarfs, you might get Dark Elves.

Kristoffer O July 12th, 2007 11:28 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Nice http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Alderanas July 14th, 2007 04:59 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
you could try an ogre mage with like some sort of bloodlust thing inhancing strength or attack

Sombre July 14th, 2007 10:26 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
They'll get Ogre Butchers who have a few different Gut Magic spells in the blood school. Gut Magic probably won't require blood slaves. At least one will be a troop buff of some sort.

Zelgadis July 14th, 2007 08:54 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Hello, Maybe some of this info would help you. Also whoever said orge don't cause fear never played warhammer much at all.

Characters

When someone says the word 'ogre', a little twinge of fear sparks in your gut (calling of the Maw?). When someone says the words 'ogre lord' together, it's enough to give weak bowled thinlings indigestion. Truly, ogres characters are amongst the most dauntying of opponents in the Warhammer world. Great abilities, good items and fear causing; let's take a closer look at these rotund beasts among beasts...

Tyrants

Aptly named, these guys are a great choice for a leader when the option becomes available at 2,000 pts. They have great abilities, lacking only ever so slightly on I and WS, but this is more than made up for through phenomenal strength, toughness and wounds attributes.

Some ideas for magical kits:

- Elf Killer - Give him a Cathayan Longsword, Ironfist, heavy armour, Gut Maw, Deathcheater Big Name, Wyrdstone Necklace. The boost to WS and extra attacks means you will be hitting pretty easily, wounding even easier and most rank and file elves will not get any saves against you. Good vs low toughness enemies.
Statline: WS7, S5, T5, A6, I5, AS 4+, Ward 5+, re-roll all successful hits vs tyrant once per game, -3 enemy AS.
- Chariotbreaker - Give him a Great Weapon, Greatskull, Gut Maw, Heavy Armour, Greedy Fist, Mawseeker Big Name. Result, large strength hits causing lots of hurt, great armour save and boosted toughness to deal with impact hits that come your way. Good vs high toughness enemies.
Statline: S7, T6, AS 3+, stupidity.
- Superstrong - Give him Siegebreaker, Giantbreaker, heavy armour, Bullgut, Thiefstone. Cast bull gorger fon his units and you will have...
Statline: WS6, S10, T5, A5, 4+ AS.

Slaughtermaster

The choice cut when it comes to Gastromancy, this beast is great for giving you units the boost that they need to win you the battle. While his spells aren't the most lethal (more on that in the magic sections), they aren't the only thing to look out for, he's a decent combatant to boot, with toughness and wounds that match the tyrant's!

Some options for Slaughtermasters:

- Magic Breaker- Bloodcleaver, Dispel Scroll, 3 Gnoblar Thiefstones. Stick him in a unit and laugh at them while they try and get spell off against the unit at Magic Resistance 3!
- Boom Hur Hur Hur- Bloodcleaver, Bangstick, Power Stone x 2; and no, not offensive as in gesticulating rudely at your opponent with your model!

Special mention must be made here for the 2 special characters, Greasus Goldtooth and Skrag the Slaughterer.

Greasus Goldtooth

The much maligned Overtyrant of the Ogre Kingdoms can only be fielded in 3,000 point list, which is a bit of a nuisance, but he's not too bad for a Lord choice. While he had fewer attacks than a regular Tyrant, a wholloping stength 10 and d3 wounds per unsaved hit is a nasty prospect for any opponent to face up to. Also, don't forget his 5 sword gnoblars that are bearing his throne when you're rolling your attacks! On his own, he also has sufficient unit strength to negate enemy ranks with a flank charge too, and impact hits just like a chariot to boot! He is great at boosting friendly combat results with his Hoardmaster ability. Target isolated low LD troops with his "Everyone Has Their Price..." ability for maximum effect.

In summary, a great hero, but a tad overpriced in terms of choice selection (one Lord and hero choice would have been better IMO).

Skrag the Slaughterer

Fielding Skrag as a hero was sheer pleasure. Between the terror, frenzy and gorgers, I couldn't decide which to prasie the most. And the more that he kills, the better he gets! Gorgers also become special choices (these guys are among my favourite ogre kingdom units) so I strongly recommend filling out all spare specials with these nasties, and don't forget that 2 must accompany Skrag at the start of battle (do not arrive as per normal gorger rules). So there, you have a small unit that causes terror and has killing blow. Can it get any better I ask you?

Bruisers

Bruisers are an absolute must if your army is below 2,000 points. The boost that their leadership provides and sheer combat power is usually enough to swing combat in the favour of any unit that he accompanies.

Some tried and tested options for them are:

- Dwarf-Squisher - Giantbreaker, Great Weapon, Heavy Armour, Greedy Fist. Good vs high toughness, heavily armoured foes. Must take a slave giant in your list.
Statline: S8, T5, AS 4+.
- Fancy Sword- Cathayan Longsword, Ironfist, Heavy Armour, Bullgut, Wyrdstone Necklace. Good AS, higher WS, great against low toughness, lightly armoured foes.
Statline: WS6, S5, T5, A5, 4+AS, 5+ Ward.
- Mawseeker- Big Name: Mawseeker, Great Weapon, Heavy Armour, Gut Maw. Very tough, strong hero, fairly low AS though. Follows stupid rules though.
Statline: S7, T6, 4+ AS, stupidity.

Hunter

A very versatile unit, hunters should always be equipped with their two pet cats at the very least. The Longstrider Big Name is a great buy for them as well, this allows the whole unit to pursue 3d6 rather than 2d6 for an unmodified hunter. These guys should be used for negating ranks with flank charges and for using his harpoon to get some flank shots in (as bolt thrower).A sample I've liked using is:

- Big Steps - Longstrider, 2 kitties, Greedy Fist.
- Baby Steps - Mastodon Armour, 2 kitties.
- Ghost Steps - Big Name: Beastkiller, Greyback Pelt, 2 kitties.

Butcher

As per description for Slaughtermasters above.

Some options:

- Offensive - Boom Stick, Dispel Scroll.
- Defensive - Halfling Cookbook, Dispel Scroll.
- Vs Low Ld Enemies - Skullmantle.

A note on Gnoblar options for heroes...Always take them! Sword gnoblars add cheap attacks, granted at low strength, but they are at your ogre's WS! Tooth gnoblars are great for adding to see if you cast a spell (especially when you use one dice), and luck gnoblars no hero should not leave his yart without!

Core Units

For most armies, core units are rather ho-hum. Not for this one though, with choices like bull ogres and ironguts, even meagre core units have the potential to dish out whopping amounts of damage. Let's also not forget their little greenish side-kicks, gnoblars, who also have their uses.

Bull Ogres

You must take al least one unit of bulls for the army to be legal. And why wouldn't you, they are fantastic. Great strength and toughness, combined with enough wounds and attacks to weather a storm of blows and dish out punishment of their own. Bulls are a very versatile core choice, which can be tailored to specific roles rather well.

Naked with a club... - despite how this sounds, this is not too bad (ok, well maybe bad visually) . It's your basic cost ogre and they can be really handy against toughly armoured opponents. Try bumping up their strength just before close combat with bullgorger, and while they're out of close combat have them run around with trollguts on them.
Statline: 3 x S4 attacks, armour piercing (unmodified with spells).

Found me another club! - additional hand weapons are probably not the best option for ogre troops for the simple reason that for a point extra / model, you can have ironfists.

Rags and a spiky fist! - These things are fantastic! With ironfists you can choose whether you want to use it as a shield or additional handweapon at the start of close combat every turn! Combined with light armour, these guys are great in pretty much any situation, and they excel against lightly armoured foes and low toughness enemies. Spells to consider boosting them with in close combat are bullgorger / toothcracker, and trollguts out of close combat.
Statline: 3 or 4 attacks at S4, 6+ or 4+ AS depending on how ironfist is used.

Ironguts

When I grow up, I wanna be an Irongut! These guys are great if you can afford the points cost. While not as versatile as bulls, who needs versatility when you have heavy armour and great weapons as standard? Obvious uses for these guys are as flankers and to take out high toughness enemies (dwarfs, orcs, chhaos warriors, etc) and ogre sized enemy units (kroxi's, ushabti, minotaurs come to mind here).
Statline: 3 x S6 attacks for your basic ogre. 5+ AS for all.

Command or no command, that is the question...

With the relatively high cost for core ogre units, one has to be savvy when using command models to maximise the points available to you for troop selection. As a rule, I add a full command in my larger units (6+ models) that will be used for frontal assaults. For flanking units, I tend not to take any upgrades, or if I have a few points spare, I add a musician only.

Gnoblars

Before anyone begins to say anything about how useless they are, keep in mind that they are only 2 points per model... surely you can't expect much from that! With low movement, strength and WS, these guys are good for their outnumber and rank bonuses only (if they can keep up with your ogres that is). Possible uses for them are scraplauncha guarding duties, they would be able to provide adequate cover for any scouts or flyers in the vicinity and could be used to block LOS to prevent charges into unwanted enemies.

A second use may be to provide a unit to engage an enemy with to the front while ogres charge in for flank charges. While hard to achieve on offense, they could fulfill this role pretty easily if you're played defensively.

Also, their ability to throw sharp stuff is pretty handy, especially if they're up on a hill despite their average ballistic skills.

For two points, always take the Groinbiter. Not only is it an extra attack, but quite often you'll find your front rank will be wiped out when charged, so he'll be the only one able to fight back! And the name's too cool as well, always gets a laugh when you tell them that you have a groinbiter in the unit!

Gnoblar Trappers

These gnoblars are actually pretty useful. Being scouts and skirmishers as well, they can be used to get behind enemy lines and pepper the enemy with sharp stuff, blocking marches and taking our war machines though numbers and combining with gorgers when they arrive.

Lookout gnoblars...

These guys are very useful against artillery heavy armies (dwarves and empire especially come to mind here) so take them if you're facing off against them for any unit you plan on putting a character in. Also a good idea if the composition of your force is purely small units of ogres. Look Out Sir rolls are crucial for any army with the potential to take out your characters from afar.

Special Units

Whether it's cannon wielding maniacs, savage white beasts or an odd weapons launching war machine, the special choices are indeed great for Ogre Kingdom players and add some much needed variety to your army's mix.

Leadbelchers

While erractic in terms of the number of shots, these ogres have the potential to dish out a lethal amounts of damage. My favourite tactic with these guys is what I like to call the "Auto charge". Line then up for a shot at a given enemy unit, measure to see if you are in firing range. Remember, that you do not suffer from penalties from movement or long range either. Then, if the unit is still there, the following turn you can charge into combat most of the time, as your charge range is also 12"!

Also, while it is possible for them to reload, I have yet to reload them before charging into combat with their cannon (which count as ogre clubs). Also, I generally do not take any command upgrades, other than a Bellower if I have the points spare.

Spells to consider putting on them are bullgorger in close combat, or toothcracker / trollguts when out of combat.

Yhetees

Shaggy white death, my absolute favourite special choice without a doubt. These guys can march with ease to any location you need them to be withuot hindrance from difficult / impassable terrain. They pursue 3d6, and while they have no armour, they do have weapons that count as magical attacks and all attacks against them are at -1 to hit. Yhetees are the ultimate flankers and complement larger blocks of ironguts and bulls perfectly in most situations.
Statline: 3 x S5 attacks, -1 to Hit, magic frost weapons.

Gnoblar Scraplauncher

This contraption is one of the weirdest war machines out there. A stone thrower that uses the large template and has killing blow, but armour saves are allowed as normal against non-killing blow wounds. This would be useful against well armoured foes, such as dwarves or chaos, especially if you have filled out a few slots with these contraptions.

To make things little more interesting, they also follow the rules for chariots, so a strength 7 hit will turn them into matchwood and the rhinox pulling the contraption is champing at the bit to get into combat and usually charges if it can sight an enemy (testing on Ld5 unless your Tyrant is around to restrain).

One thing to note is that this contraption counts as unit strength 5, so it does negate rank if you flank / rear charge someone with it. A fear causing flanker is always a good thing to have on your own side!

Rare Units

Ogre rare units are the creme de la creme of ogres, each one has the edge to swing the battle in your favour. The choices are varied in terms of abilities, so let's look at the options; Maneaters, Gorgers and Slave Giants.

Maneaters

These ogres are essentially mini-bruisers that you can rank up into a unit. They are very versatile and you can even mix your weapons if you like in the unit as well! One important difference between maneaters and bruiser though, is that maneaters are immune to psychology (goodbye banshee screams) and stubborn too! Therefore, this makes them ideal for halting large fear causing units and cavalry, while the remainder of your force moves into counter charging positions!

Some options for weapons mixes are:

Boomsticks - brace of handguns, heavy armour, cathayan longswords. These maneaters can be used for fighting high WS troops, lightly armoured troops and have the ability to stand and shoot at any counter chargers - usually with no save allowed!
Statline: Multiple shots (x2) armour piercing S4, 5 x WS5, armour piercing, S5 attacks.

Wheeled Thingy Hunters - Great weapons, heavy armour. Units of 2-3 used as bait for chariot charges. One strike back at the chariot is an auto kill for you! The same combination is great for supporting Irongut charges against highly armoured opponents.
Statline: 5+ AS, Strikes Last, 4 x WS4, S7 attacks.

Slave Giants

Two Words: Cheap Giants! These guys have similar random attacks to O&G or Chaos Beastmen Giants and the same drawback (falling down too often), but unlike their other cousins, they are not subborn. Therefore, they should not be employed to hold yup or take out units on their own, rather they should be used as flanking chargers to support ogre blocks.

Another thing to be mindful of is that the giant is a large target (no duh), and enemy shooters get +1 to hit him, which tend to make him a bit of a walking pin-cushion. Use forest terrain wisely if you're fielding him!

Gorger

I love saving the best until last! Arriving from a table edge of your choice from turn 2 onwards, these guys are great for so many roles. An individual model with the statline of a Tyrant (except WS) that has killing blow and is unbreakable to boot!

First of all, they are great at taking out war machines. Secondly, they can march block well when they arive early on for you. And lastly, being unbreakable, they can charge into big blocks of infantry (heck, even cavalry) and hold then up long enough for your bigger units to take them apart.

Dogs of War

If you're considering taking them, I'd recommend taking a unit of scouts or fast cavalry (Mengil's Manflayers come to mind here). For fluffy reasons, consider also adding Golfag's Ogres, just because they're more ogres to be had!

Magical Items

Here, I'll quickly go through the prime choices for the array of unique magical items that ogres have at their disposal.

Magic Weapons

Thundermace - Fairly cheap and stone thrower template hits on everything underneath it, worked out as a stone thrower. Remember that multiple wound models recieve d6 wounds from stone throwers too! Not bad at all.
Note: you only get one attack with this weapon, and it does 1 S8 hit doing d6 wounds.

The Tenderiser - A favourite of mine to combine with the Giantbreaker Big Name. And it's a great weapon to boot. Another fantastic weapon.

Siegebreaker - take this against low initiative enemies (O&G's Dwarves, Tomb Kings, Vampire Counts come to mind), great strength boost for your bruiser / tyrant. Good against the above armies.

Skullplucker - I love the fluff for this weapon! Good to take against tin can boys (dwarves, chaos warriors, elf cav, brettonians). Killing blow is always great!

Bloodcleaver - Not too bad for - butchers only - as it will allow you to regain a wound you have lost for every wound you cause in CC. I'd rather spend points on spell boosters / dispels scrolls though if you're taking a butcher though.

Magic Armour

Mastodon Armour - Ok I guess to gurantee that your bruiser / tyrant gets to close combat, but a little pricey. If you have non-magical weapons, might be an option.

Greatskull - While the ability is mediocre, adding +1 to any other armour saves is an attractive option. Again, a little pricey for what it does.

Bullgut - Another item that adds to any other armour save, and adds another impact hit to your character. Not a bad buy, and not bad value either.

Gut Maw - If you're keen on challenging everything in sight (as I am) with your bruiser / tyrant, a great one to take. Another item that adds to any other armour save (apart from the bull gut). Same value as the above item.

Greedy Fist - Another item that adds to any other armour save, this is a cheap and personal favourite of mine to add to the bruiser / tyrant as it eats any opposing magical weapons, and is great for those rare occasions you get into close combat with an ememy mage! An absolute must.

Talismans

Cathayan Jet - Handy to take to protect a lone character (hunters come to mind) vs shooty armies / magicky armies. Still an option for taking vs DE & HE shooty lists.

Spangleshard - A very handy item to take, one of my favourites in the list.

Wyrdstone Necklace - Another handy item, a cheap ward save for the possibility of one wound on the character at the start of the battle. A must have.

Gnoblar Thiefstone - A great cheap way to add dispel dice to your army. Put a character with these in a highly targeted unit (big unit of bulls for example) and watch the spells just roll off them. You can also take from 1-3 of them as one choice (still have to pay for each stone) and have up to a whopping MR 3 on the unit! Highly recommended against magicky armies.

Arcane Items

Hellheart - For the points cost, not worth it really.

Grut's Sickle - Good to power those one dice casts with (almost) free power dice. A good item to have.

Halfling Cookbook - Good for anyone casting Toothcracker / Trollguts often (pretty much all ogre players, right?). Cheap and effective.

Bangstick - The only bound item in the list, and you get to shoot through gnoblars that are in the way! Take it! Normally priced bound item.

Skullmantle - Pretty handy for helping to break units, particularly nasty when combined with a war banner.

Enchanted Items

Brahmir Statue - Take this in addition to the skullmantle vs Chaos / Skaven and watch the fun when they make leadership tests against you at -4!

Daemon-Killer Scars - Terror is good!

Greyback Pelt - Very useful for hunters, and also prevents you from using yhetees. A very good item.

Jade Lion - Useful until your unit flees, not worthwhile for the price.

Rock Eye - Handy against Night Gobbo's, Skaven and Dark Elves especially, but also useful for revealing enemy magical items in the unit. Not bad, well priced.

Fistful of Laurels - Not very useful, despite it's low cost.

Magic Standards

Dragonhide - If the dice gods are against you, this would be a handy banner to take. Immunity to Ice magic is almost irrelevant though. A bit pricey, mediocre value.

Ragbanner - Roll 3d6 for panic checks for the unit. Well priced and a great pick as most ogre units tend to get shot up pretty badly on their way into close combat.

Cannibal Totem - Only useful against other ogre sized models. Useful against all ogre / all minotaur beasts of chaos armies.

Bull Standard - Handy for any gut plate bearing unit, nice and cheap choice as well.

Rune Maw - Use this banner on a big unit without a character with thiefstones in it. then, when the unit is targeted, deflect it onto a unit with the character with theifstones and have fun dispelling! A favourite tactic of mine.

Big Names

What's in a name? A lot if you're an ogre. It tells of your achievements and the more glorious and impressive your name sounds, the more respect and influence you will have. Not only this, but in game terms, adding a big name to an ogre adds an edge to your tyrant / bruiser as well.

Some key reminders; only tyrants can take big names worth more than 25 pts, only tyrants, bruisers and some hunters may take them at all, they count towards your magical item limit and you can only take one per character. So with that out of the way, let's look at them a little closer:

Kineater - Very good for adding to a central unit, great with the ragbanner too.

Mountaineater - Very handy actually, good to use with the spangleshard too.

Longstrider - A great one to take for hunters and their kitties.

Giantbreaker - Fielding a giant? You have to take this name! Too cheap and absolutely awesome.

Deathcheater - One of my personal favourites, now you hit me, now you don't! Nice and cheap too.

Beastkiller - Handy to take against terror causing foes and VC armies that are banshee heavy. Also great against any large monsters. I'd probably be more inclined to give this to a hunter rather than a tyrant.

Wallcrusher - An obvious combination with the Bull Gut. Even bruisers can make this combo work well.

Mawseeker - Despite the stupidity, an awesome grab and too cheap to pass up if you have a name spare and a few points to kill. I'd lean towards giving this to a tyrant due to his higher leadership.

Gut Magic

Magic that depends on eating various types of foods for their effects is going to be volatile, ogre magic is just that. While the array of spells are pretty varied, any miscasts are deadly, and just through simply casting some spells on the list, your butcher / slaughtermaster can sustain a wound.

Also remember that you can have only one 'Remains in Play' spell per unit only, and that you can have more than one remains in play spell per butcher. Also, keep in mind that RiP spells are dispelled on 7+ always regardless of what casting value they were cast on. As a rule also, try to use only one dice per spell to avoid the terrible miscast effects, there are no items that can help you avoid the effects in the ogre items!With that said, let's look at the spells available to ogre generals...

Bloodgruel - The spell that had to be included! Uses are obvious.

Braingobbler - Ideal for scattering low leadership scouts or flyers (skinks and harpies come to mind here) off the table edge. Also handy for targeting at low LD enemies to cause a panic ripple through the ranks.

Bullgorger - Cast on ogres just before entering close combat.

Bonecruncher - quite a good spell to soften up ranks before close combat. Excels against highly armoured, low toughness foes (high elf cavalry comes to mind here).

Toothcracker - One of the two spells you should consider casting on a unit while marching to combat. Also handy for when you're in combat for the stubbornness. Handy to have the halfling cookbook on anyone casting this spell.

Trollguts - Second of the two spells you should cast on a unit while getting to close combat range, this one also afford your unit some more magical protection too in addition to the ever-handy regeneration. Handy to have the halfling cookbook on anyone casting this spell as well.

Deployment & Tactics

Now that you know what the units are capable of and have some ideas on what item combinations to use for your characters, let's take a look at how to best utilise your army's initial deployment and a further look at some strategies you can employ against various styles of armies.

Ranged

Armies such as dwarves, empire, dark elves, wood elves and high elves can field lists that are able to decimate entire units before they even get to close combat. Use terrain to your advantage and block enemy unit line of sight to you. Spells such as trollguts and toothcracker will be great to help you weather the incoming torrent of enemy fire.

Units to consider: Gnoblar trappers (scouting skirmishers to get behind the line of fire), maneaters(higher toughness - harder to wound), gorgers (as maneaters & get behind enemy lines), leadbelchers (shoot when in range), yhetees (quick movement to get into CC, ignore terrain).

Magic Heavy

Armies in mind: High Elves, Lizardmen with Slanns, Tzeentch Chaos.

When deploying, again block line of sight from any opposing magicians if possible with terrain. Ensure that your butchers have dispel scrolls handy and have them cast trollguts on as many units as possible. The Thiefstone and Rune Maw combination is particularly effective vs magic heavy armies. If your opponent is fond of leaving magicians out of a unit, send your gnoblar trapper to throw sharp stuff at them or send your gorgers against them.

Units to consider: Gnoblar trappers & gorgers.
Items to consider: Rune Maw, 3 Gnoblar Thiefstones, Greatskull (in unit with theifstones), dispel scrolls, trollguts on as many units as possible.

Cavalry Based

Example cav armies: Brettonians, High Elves, Chaos.

Have maneaters and large bull units that are able to bear the brunt of an enemy charge supported by smaller flanking units to their left or right, ready to counter charge. Position scouts and any early arriving gorgers somewhere they can march block the enemy to deny their faster movement. Also, when receiving a charge, have your ogres challenge any other unit champions / heroes to get their champions out of the picture, and hopefully some overkill in your favour.If your opponent has clumped their units around one central unit, try and get any trappers behind the central unit to march block as many units as possible. If done properly, you should be able to march block most of the army, and even get charges of your own in without resorting to baiting (below)!

An alternative tactic I've worked out against cavalry forces is the bait and charge. Put a small unit of bulls slightly forward to a larger unit of bulls. Make sure that they are all a little forward from their starting positions though so that they don't flee off the table when you flee. On turn 2-3, cav units should charge, now make sure that you're over half of their move distance away before hand and declare a flee recation. Provided your rolling isn't too bad (no snake-eyes here) then your bait unit should be away from the chargers and you should also be able to counter charge with the bigger unit of bulls on th next turn, thus negating any of the cavalry unit's charge bonuses! Yhetees are also good as bait due to their 3d6 flee, as are hunters with the longstrider big name (also flee 3d6).

Units to consider: Gnoblar Trappers, Gorgers to march block; maneaters to take a charge, lots of bulls to bait and countercharge cavalry units; yhetees ad hunters (as bait).

Close Combat Specialists

Example close combat armies: Orcs only, Chaos, Lizardmen saurus armies.

This is the most simple of all really, just line up which unit is to fight against which enemy units and once again have smaller flanking units on hand to break the larger enemy units. The simplest way to do this is to march flankers (eg small bull units, yhetees, leadbelchers, etc) slightly forward of larger bull units and have them charge in simultaneously with the large unit, thereby negating enemy rank bonus and causing panic checks due to the charge in the flank as well.

Units to consider: Lots of bull ogres, ironguts, maneaters, yhetees.
Items to consider: War Banner, Bull Standard, Bull Gut.

Horde Armies

Example armies: Skaven, Goblins only, Empire infantry based.Very similar to close combat armies tactics outlined above, but use their lower leadership to your advantage as well. Target them with as many bound items, braingobbler / bonecruncher spells as possible. Also, concentrate this fire on one unit that's close to other units to force 'panic check waves' among their ranks.

Units to consider: Scraplauncher, gnoblar trappers, gorgers.
Items to consider: Grut's hook, Bangstick, Halfling Cookbook.Spells of choice: Toothcracker & Braingobbler.

Mix of Units

Example armies: Dark Elves, Orc & Goblin combined lists, Lizardmen, Chaos.

Well balanced armies can be countered by unbalanced armies. Seeing that you're an ogre general (or tyrant), you have one real option, and that is to go close combat heavy. So bring as many units of bulls as possible to bear, and don't forget your smaller flankers which can be used in this scenario to take out small opposing units as well.

Units to consider: Lots of bulls ogres & ironguts. Balance of Butchers and Bruisers.

Skinning Guide

Now that you know how to use these brutes, and make your opponents cry, I suppose making them look good should be something that we need to consider.

Ogres

The bulk of any real ogre army will be (no surprises here) ogres. First, let's look at skin tones.

Basic - Undercoat them in white, codex grey their skin and apply a quick brush in bleached bone.

Clothing - earthy colours likes browns or dark reds would do well, even black or dark greys work well.

Warpaint / tattoos - Using red, blue, white or black, this is a great opportunity to make your clan stand out. Some examples on what to do:

Basic - full face paint in one color or even half face paint schemes are easy and quick to do if you're painting in a hurry. For the body, consider 'slashes' as quick options to decorate your ogre.

Intermediate - Spirals, jagged ogre clan motifs and other weird shape motifs (especially if you have made them up yourself) would take a little more time to do, but would also make your ogres more unique too.

Advanced - Take a look at some Maori designs and paint / paint-pen them on shoulders, backs or down the arms. While intricate, they can really make your models stand out.

Gnoblars

Get your batch painting technique ready, these guys come in lots of 24! Let's look at their skin first.

Basic - Spray them black, slap on some commando khaki.

Intermediate - Spray them black, then paint over with dark angels green, dry brush commando khaki (twice) and highlights with codex Grey.

Clothing - If you're in a hurry, bestial brown with a chestnut ink wask. If you have time, make the clothes as varied and colourful as you can, these guys forage / steal anything that's not nailed down, they wouldn't know what uniform means!

Yhetees

These guys are pretty straight forward really. How I am doing them is, spray them white and then ink the whole thing in blue ink. Then, brush bleached bone and highlight with skull white. For the greyback, I also apple a light brush of chain mail to the fur on his back to give the illusion of silvery-grey hairs on the leader's back.


maybe this will give you a few ideas. There also a new maneater unit that's a ninja. but it's not listed above.

Theonlystd July 15th, 2007 02:36 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
wow thats a big first post

Sombre July 15th, 2007 03:24 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Not terribly useful either, since I have the army book.

But thanks anyway : ]

I won't be including the Ogre Ninja. Too jokey.

Shovah32 July 15th, 2007 03:42 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Quote:

Sombre said:
Not terribly useful either, since I have the army book.

But thanks anyway : ]



He wont like that http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/redface.gif

Saulot July 16th, 2007 02:24 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Heh, I don't have any warhammer books, so it was useful to me (in a 'I'm curious and that was a somewhat interesting read' manner).

Sombre July 16th, 2007 01:04 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
1 Attachment(s)
Attached is a pic of two leader units I've been working on. I'm not totally happy with them,.. anyway, see what you think.

Ogre Butcher and Bruiser.

Ballbarian July 16th, 2007 03:15 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Lookin' good Sombre! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

Alderanas July 16th, 2007 09:38 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Ya i liike

Zelgadis July 16th, 2007 11:24 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Doesn't bother me really I just posted it cause he never played warhammer.

Sombre July 17th, 2007 12:24 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Who never played warhammer? Me?

Zelgadis July 17th, 2007 02:06 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Theonlystd and few others who posted on the thread not you. I would hope you have played the tabletop games if you are making mods for them and figured you had. I just posted for few ideas from my gaming experiences and to give others ideas what Ogres really are.

I hope project turns out great. and didn't mean anything bad by anything I said, sorry if you took that way.

As for everything I also take my experiences from my job working on a similar title. that they will be in. but on a different scope then dom 3 and a much bigger game.

Morkilus July 17th, 2007 03:12 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Well, they certainly look Gluttonous. If this mod ends up anything like the Skaven, I'll like it quite a bit.

Sombre July 17th, 2007 03:57 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Zelgadis: Of course I don't take what you said as bad; I appreciate you posting. I actually haven't played the tabletop game much, although I had a group of friends who were very into it, so I'm quite familiar with it. I also played some of the Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay back in the day and have always liked the Warhammer World. Oh and I painted miniatures - that part of it I always liked.

My ogre graphics are quite different from the GW models, but that's because I've domified them. GW models tend to have a sort of stylish deformed look to them and are limited by what makes a good and relatively inexpensive plastic or metal model. I want to stay true to the spirit of the ogres, while not exactly copying the models (I prefer to copy the illustrations if anything).

Morkilus - they will hopefully be of the same quality, but they will get less stuff overall. Still, they will have plenty of variety and fun units.

llamabeast July 25th, 2007 09:19 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Hey Sombre, how's this coming along?

Sombre July 25th, 2007 12:26 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
It's not, unfortunately, at the moment. I'm bogged down with a (somewhat) unexpected load of teaching work for the next couple of weeks.

I'll try to get a bit done every day (just one graphic or a unit entry or something), but basically I think it's on hold until 2 weeks time, when I should hammer it out quicksmart.

The same goes for changes to other mods of mine - in a couple of weeks it'll be all go.

Do you need a hand with any graphics for the tomb kings llama? If you have anything you're struggling with send it over to me or post it up and I'll see if I can't give you a fresh pair of eyes :]

I like your anbuite, but he seems a bit thin. I'd need to check the army book to see if that's just what they're supposed to look like, though.

llamabeast July 25th, 2007 12:50 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Cool, I'll look forward to it (although make sure not to treat it as a job - I caught myself beginning to do that and had to make myself stop for a bit).

Thanks for the graphics offer. A fresh pair of eyes can definitely be useful at times. I'm about to start on the Ushabti, which I expect to be the most difficult of all, but I'm going to give it a good stab and maybe iterate a bit, then I'll post it and see what people think.

Thanks for the comments on the anubite. I also thought he maybe looked a bit gangly, so perhaps I'll try fattening him up a bit. I gave him a skeletal torso deliberately, inspired by the Warhammer Ushabtis (which are also black and a bit animalish), but maybe that's not quite consistent since they're not actually undead or anything. I'll have a think about it. They're not actually in the Warhammer army you see, just straight from my head, so there's no source material to compare to unfortunately.

Sombre August 10th, 2007 10:31 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Right, I'm getting back to work on this one starting now.

Tonight I will code them a bunch of low research low cost blood school battle spells. Ogres aren't going to do a whole lot of researching, see? They'll need indies for that.

I need to get some kind of gnoblar graphic ready as well.

Sombre August 14th, 2007 02:06 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
1 Attachment(s)
Here's a rough gnoblar preview. I can't decide which head shape I prefer - one really emphasises the size of their head, nose and ears and is a bit cartoony, like the GW miniatures themselves,.... the other is more in line with dom3 graphical style/scale.

My plan is to allow you to buy a size 3 unit of 4 gnoblars which has 3 attacks. When this takes a hit it's down to size 3- 3 gnoblars, 3 attacks, then size 2- 2 gnoblars, 2 attacks and finally a size 1 single gnoblar with his one crappy attack. Like the Skaven Slave recruits, this is so you can use the gnoblars as chaff and not worry too much about your total number of casualties causing all your big hard Ogre Bulls to run away.

I was messing around with the Ogre Hunter today and he has one scary ranged attack! He was picking off enemy cavalry quite nicely.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/thr...lar%20work.png

Theonlystd August 14th, 2007 03:38 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
*cant wait*

llamabeast August 15th, 2007 01:08 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
I like the right hand gnoblars better, but they seem to have a hole in their heads. Maybe fill in one of the two black pixels under their ears.

Sombre August 21st, 2007 08:41 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
1 Attachment(s)
I left the gnoblar graphics at that beta stage and got them working in the game - I'll come back to them later, but they're so small and numerous and quickly killed that improved graphics won't make a huge difference with them. They are fun to use though.

Just uploading a png of the deathbelcher, which is a pretty scary close range missile unit.

Sombre August 21st, 2007 02:50 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
1 Attachment(s)
I'm working on the Ogre Slaughtermaster. Attached is a preview pic of the slaughtermaster next to the butcher.

I hope he is different enough for people to recognise. He is larger, has a different weapon and of course the leatherface style mask.

Kristoffer O August 22nd, 2007 12:13 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
> I'm working on the Ogre Slaughtermaster

Looks cool!

Sombre August 22nd, 2007 12:18 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
1 Attachment(s)
He's all done for now.

Next is the gorger or the yhetee, hopefully will finish either one tonight.

Sombre August 24th, 2007 07:38 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
1 Attachment(s)
Here's a sort of preview of the gorger. This unit has given me stupid amounts of trouble - this is the third time I've restarted from scratch and I think I'm finally close. It's not finished yet of course.

Sombre August 28th, 2007 08:58 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
1 Attachment(s)
This is the finished Gorger.

I tested the unit today - very powerful indeed. He's a great national blood summon which will really encourage blood hunting for the ogres.

Kristoffer O August 28th, 2007 12:03 PM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
Nice!

Noble713 September 1st, 2007 02:57 AM

Re: Ogre Kingdoms - Warhammer Nation
 
This is shaping up pretty well so far, can't wait to try it out...

Also eagerly awaiting the eventual release of the Dark Elves.


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