Setting up an Ettin?
 

Anyone has some interesting builds for an Ettin (3 hand slots, 2 head slots, one body, one feet, one misc slot). I think it could become a nice thug but i can't find an idea how to use this unusual item slot setup well.

Assume all school of magics are available, with items up to const 6.

Re: Setting up an Ettin?
 

Shiels and twohanded weapon, like wraith sword perhaps. A couple of helmets is always nice. Starshine and spirit, unless you go for artifacts. Or horror helmet.

Re: Setting up an Ettin?
 

I think a cool setup would be 4 Lantern Shields, 2 spirit helmets, chi shoes, Skull Talisman, and Jade Armor. Make him a summoning platform http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Setting up an Ettin?
 

Here's a few brainfarts.
Scroll to <font color="red">IDEA</font> to skip my though process and go straight to my suggestion.

High strength, right?

Hands:
Three Main Gauche of Parrying = +12 defense. A length of zero means no attack penalty.

Three Duskdaggers. Again zero length, but now with armor negating. Leaves the ettin vulnerable, though.

three snake bladders- poison stacks. If a character can dodge attack, just one snake bladder stacks very quickly. Three? Just get yourself some PR.

Gloves of the Gladiator + Sword of Quickness + Boots of Quickness: 12 attacks a round.

Heads:
2 Horned Helmets (adjacency?) two more attacks, 4 with quickness.

If you don't depend on boots of quickness, but have a mage cast it, then you can equip Chi Shoes, or Boots of Stone.

Obviously, regeneration is a big plus, but continuing along atheme..

Stone Bird.

Exact stats of Ettin can be found in Edi's database "Base U" worksheet, no 488.

So, lets refine this a little.
3 Snake Bladder Sticks - gains no benefit from Ettin's strength. It's out.
Armor - it's just going to be hard to protect from counters, so Elemental Armor, while tempting, is out.
I'd go with either the Shroud of the Battle Saint (flaming weapons and attack bonus), Marble Armor, Stymphalian Wings. Monolith armor would be nice, as would Robe of Shadows, but they are out. Hydraskin Armor has some potential, with regen.

<font color="red">IDEA</font>

So, the following build will have some obvious weaknesses, but is an extreme idea you could tamper with some practicality.

Supporting Spellcasters will cast the following, at minimum:
Luck, Iron Warriors, Regeneration, Berserkers, Quickness, Flight, Mist, Fog Warriors.

1 Gloves of the Gladiators for 4 attacks (8 w/quick)
1 Duskdagger, to handle unusually well protected units.
1 Shroud of the Battle Saint with a fire or nature bless, or Hydra Skin Armor
2 Horned Helmets
1 Chi Shoes
1 Stone Bird

So, with this setup, before quickness you get
4+1+2+1+4= 12 attacks. Facing a defense 40 unit? the last attack comes in with the defender penalized 20 points for successive attacks. If flaming weapons is included, you also get a couple of fire damage, though I don't think that counts as another attack.

After quickness has been cast, you're generating 24 attacks a turn.

Obviously, there are some changes you can make to increase survivability, but this is the extreme version. It will the Ettin to survive if you have some other large units around.
Switch to three Main Gauches of Parrying, and you get +12 defense, and instead of 5 attacks from arm slot weapons, 3. So, 20 attacks after quickness is cast? Not a huge loss.

Re: Setting up an Ettin?
 

Sort of OT, but I did once outfit a Machaka Bane Spider w/ two Lantern Shields and a Skullface. He was a very effective assassin. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Setting up an Ettin?
 

If I recall the Ettin has a major weakness with magic resistance.

Re: Setting up an Ettin?
 

Base magic resistance is 15. That's not so bad.
He has ambidexterity 6. It means longer weapons will work at full attack skill too.
I want him to be thug (eg. he will support a chaff army, along with smaller thugs), so he's task would be to take out tough enemy units not fight whole armies by himself.

Re: Setting up an Ettin?
 

For killing big stuff I'd give him FireBrand, Faithful, Jade Armor, Flying Shoes, Eye Shield, wraith crown &amp; Horned helmet, and a ring of regeneration. That's the expensive, full luxury model. For economy thugging all you really need is quickness, the flying shoes, a survivability misc item (luck or regen) and a couple good weapons.

The Eye shield is good for both thugs and SCs because there is no resisting the eyeless. You attack him and *shhlck* one of your eyes plops out http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif. This means that if your target fights back he will be weakened or become useless. FrostBrand and FireBrand exploit elemental weaknesses and let you damage targets with super-high def (with the aoe effect). Faithful gives luck, and everyone needs quickness.

Survivability is a concern, but he'll kill stuff real good.

Re: Setting up an Ettin?
 

Any interesting blessings?

Might be amusing to use both Vision's Foe and Faithful, and task him with shooting enemies' eyes out (17 AN + eyeloss is pretty nasty -- perhaps comparable to a m00se bite). Give him an eye of aiming, and rename him 'Irony'. But then, I've a really twisted sense of humor... and Firbolgs (the Sleeper version) make better snipers with their base PREC of 15, anyway.

With three arms, you can use a frost blade, a luck sword, and a charcoal shield all at once -- luck, 50% FR/CR, which goes to 100% if you stack with elemental armor (but watch the enc). If you don't need both FR and CR, but you have blood, consider Blood Thorn for the one-handed lifedraining. Or Hell Sword + Lucky Coin -- lifedrain, 50% FR, luck, berserk.

Re: Setting up an Ettin?
 

My perfect memory must be failing... I thought it was 12.

Re: Setting up an Ettin?
 

With the new eye of the void (is that the correct name? The new penetration item) in Dom3 15 is the new 12. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Tartarian killer.
 

Sword of Quickness, Sword of Quickness, Flambeau, Goring Helmet, Goring helmet, Jade armour, Boots of Flight,
bird of Stone.

22 attacks, and flambeau is 100+ AP against dead.

SSSSSSSSSSSSSSssmoking! (Got all Mask animes, sue me)

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

World's Fourth Stupidest Idea:
Dwarven Hammer, something, Dwarven Hammer. Empower, and enjoy the fifty percent forge bonus. Blood, perhaps? People often seem to discuss 'bootstrap'ing into that path.

World's Third Stupidest Idea:
Rune Smasher, Shadow Brand, Rune Smasher, Eye of the Void, Bone Armor, two Spirit Helmets, Boots of Quickness.
As much penetration as you can apply to Soul Vortex and Leeching Darkness (shadow brand), with a couple lightning helmets for good measure.

World's Second Stupidest Idea:
Rune Smasher, path booster, rune smasher, eye of the void, empowerment. Ettin, the mage! Singleplayer insanity only, please. For more fun, aim at Ettin eventually casting wish.

If you were willing to open up uniques, you could go with the Monty Python build.

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

Ok guys, i appreciate the ideas so far, but:
1. Ranged build is out, i have enough Sleepers (Firbolgs) who are much better at that.
2. I can't forge any artifacts.
3. I'm not going to empower him either.
4. With 150+ HP (i have gift of health up), he might be nice, but i don't think he can go against well equipped Tartarians anyway. Nikolai's idea is interesting, but it's 3 hand slots not 4.

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

Wait.. you want practical? Can you get more than one, by the way?

If you're trying to take down tough enemies, the monty python build is more than worth it, though outside your restrictions, unfortunately.

You may find these a few interesting ideas - or not - again, brainstorming

With Serpent Kryss, the poison itself is AN... three death poisons will take out non-undeads. Nah... to easily countered.

Star of Heroes (armor destruction), Gloves of the Gladiator, Boots of Quickness, Horned Helmet (x2). A variation on the massive attack aimed at removing the protection on one unit, and slaying him shortly afterword. May not work on magic armor.

If you're facing undead Tartarians, you can work something out with three Herald Lances, Holy Scourge (attacks twice, two handed), or the above mentioned Flambeau.

Perhaps the Holy Scourge, Eye Shield, Boots of Giant Strength, Burning Pearl. Relatively cheap, and expendable. Might to do something with triple damage vs undead and demons.

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

&gt; i don't think he can go against well equipped Tartarians anyway. Nikolai's idea is interesting, but it's 3 hand slots not 4.

One less sword of quickness. So ONLY 18 attacks. Self buffing Tartarians are dead.

SoQ - 34 damage against defense
SoQ - 34 damage against (defense - 2)
Flambeau - 114 AP damage against (defense - 4)
Horded helmed - 25 damage attack against (defense - 6)
Horned helmet - 25 damage attack against (defense - 8)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 10)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 12)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 14)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 16)
SoQ - 34 damage against (defense - 18)
SoQ - 34 damage against (defense - 20)
Flambeau - 114 AP damage against (defense - 22) &lt;- THIS WHAT SETUP'S FOR!
Horded helmed - 25 damage attack against (defense - 24)
Horned helmet - 25 damage attack against (defense - 26)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 28)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 30)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 32)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 34)

I think many Tartarians can't survive.

Maybe is worth to use Herald Lance, not Sword of Quickness -more damage, fewer defense loss.

Maybe is even more worth using Holy Scourge - 87 damage, not AP, but more defense loss.

Herald lance - 93 damage against defense
Holy scourge - 87 damage against (defense - 2)
Holy scourge - 87 damage against (defense - 4)
Horded helmed - 25 damage attack against (defense - 6)
Horned helmet - 25 damage attack against (defense - 8)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 10)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 12)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 14)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 16)
Herald lance - 93 damage against (defense - 18)
Holy scourge - 87 damage against (defense - 20)
Holy scourge - 87 damage against (defense - 22)
Horded helmed - 25 damage attack against (defense - 24)
Horned helmet - 25 damage attack against (defense - 26)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 28)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 30)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 32)
Bird of stone - 9 damage against enemy (defense - 34)

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

Something I think you all missed is giving him an air shield, just about anything can be taken down with enough ranged weapons, preferably for that you want a Shield of Valor, that makes him immune to all ranged attacks, almost nothing can hit him, and if they do, they have to go through the shield and the armour.

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

If you want to thug him out to go against Tartarians you should start with:

Jade Armor
Flambeau
Boots of flying.

Then add equipment based upon what your opponent is using.

For instance, if your opponent is using a stone sword you may want to load up on magic resistance. 2 starshine helmets,lucky coin,ring of regeneration.

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

If you want to equip an ettin(I prefer Nataraja's for the extra hand though) to take down tough enemies then a simple:
3xDusk Dagger
2xHorned Helmet
Jade Armour
Flying Boots
Ring of the warrior
Stone Bird

Should suffice. Not quite as many attacks as some other builds but the 6 high strength dusk dagger attacks per round is deadly.

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

So, how do you get Ettins? I've only seen them as mercenaries. And Natarajas? Isn't that a pretender? I mean sure, if you wish... I'm not missing another way of getting them, am I?

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

Improved cross breeding has a chance I believe

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

You can get Ettins by cross breeding (you dont need the improved variant), and it is possible to wish for whatever unit you want.

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

I got mine from improved crossbreeding.

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

I got one from the normal crossbreeding, and i think the only change between the crossbreedings is the better slave/unit ratio.

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

Easiest nation to do it with is pangera (sp?)

And the Lord Of The Wild can take some pretty awesome builds himself.

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

Mictlan is probably easier - Priest Kings can cast it, and Mictlan will put more emphasis on blood research. If you are willing to try repeatedly, you don't need improved crossbreeding, but it helps alot. Of course, Mictlan has other units to equip first, and has a harder time with the requisite Gift of Reason, so it's probably about the same. Any blood nation can manage it in the end.

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

Pangaea can get an ettin mandragora hero, who adds six sleep vine attacks into the mix. Gloves, Flambeau, horned helmet, horned helmet, jade armor, chi shoes, stone bird,

would give, following Nikolai:

Gloves
Gloves -2
Gloves -4
Gloves-6
Flambeau-8
Horned-10
Horned-12
Chi-14
Bird-16
Bird-18
Bird-20
Sleep VInes -22
Sleepvines -24
Sleepvines -26
Sleepvines -28
Sleepvines -30
Sleepvines -32
Gloves -34
Gloves-36
Gloves-38
Gloves-40
Flambeau-42
Horned-44
Horned-46
Chi-48
Bird-50
Bird-52
Bird-54
Sleep VInes-56
Sleepvines-58
Sleepvines-60
Sleepvines-62
Sleepvines-64
Sleepvines-66
.
now THAT is alot of attacks.

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

Looks interesting, let me design an Ettin:

Fire Brand
Faithful
Shield of gleaming gold
Bone Armor
Wraith Crown
Dragon Helmet
Birch Boots
Ring of tamed Lightning

Strengths:
With Lucky + Etheral + awe + good defence, he will not be overrun by small troops. With the bone armor, he will hopefully leech himself good. Elemental spells don't harm him.
Weaknesses: Stay the hell away from astral nations, the Magic resistence is not good enough. Massed undead spam (the typical Mandragoras) might get him. Costs lot's of death gems.

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

Why does no one mention the heart finder sword??? That is instant death. Against Tartarians as well, no???

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

Only if they fail a magic resistance test. Tartarians have a base resistance of 18.

Re: Tartarian killer.
 

you guys have too much time on your hands!