Invisible Swarm 2 - in limbo
 

Hi all!

The settings:

Middle Era
Mods: Conceptual Balance: Scales and Gods, Worthy Heroes, and Quickfix
Indies 5
Site Frequency 45
Score Graphs off
Hall of Fame 15
Difficult Research
Map: Lonely Mermaid
Victory Condition: 81 of 120 provinces

Players:
me: Jotunheim
archaeolept: Ermor
Jurri: Bandar Log
WraithLord: Marignon
Cicadian: Pythium
Meglobob: Abysia
IndyPendant: R'yleh
Jeffr: Pangea

24-hour quickhost for the first 25 turns, after that there will be 48-hour quickhost.

House Rules:
1) The spell "Mists of Deception" can't be combined with any perpetual killing spell such as Wrathful Skies. If the AI casts it for you, that's okay, but please do not ever script these two things together.

2) If you ever happen to charm Bogus's men, please do not ever use the "Attack Commander" option except for the Dark Knight guy himself.

3) The previous Prokrantor has issued a decree before his demise: There will be 10 turns of enforced peace before the Wars of Ascension can begin again.

IP: 97 <dot> 81 <dot> 77 <dot> 39
Port: 2000

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

In the next week or so I plan to release a new CB version that should be fully compatible with 3.10, as well as possibly incorporating bug fix mods and worthy heroes. If you do have issues with the Nation and Item mods, any feedback on them would be appreciated for the new version.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

CB pretenders and scales, worthy heroes

sounds good, though i've played desert eye often enough http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

i'll temporarily put dibsies on ... hmmm... dunno yet http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

Heh, well we can play any map you want. I sort of wanted wrap-around and a map with some water of about 100-150 provinces. Anything that fits that bill is cool with me.

Maybe Pasha's 3-Lake map? Maybe that Mines and Farms one? Or maybe a random map.. I don't know. It doesn't seem like there are very many good 120 province maps out there.

Edit: I made a random 150 province map and I'm going to fiddle with it some and maybe we can use that. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Edit x2: I attached a map file, I called it Horizons because the map looks horizontal. I added four pathways that wrap-around (one on sea, three on land), so it is a semi-wraparound map now. I sort of like it, if other people like it we can use it, if not, we'll think of something else.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

I'm in!

Hmm, there aren't any other wraparounds in that size range, are there? Looking at the map-sticky on the mod forum, there's a 99 land, 21 sea province wraparound which could work:
http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/thr...o=&fpart=1
(Haven't tested it, so no clue if it's any fun.) Still, your call on the map.

CB Scales and pretenders and WH are fine by me. I'll decide on a nation later.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

I'm in. I would like to take Marignon, if that's not possible then Pythium. Otherwise any random nation will do.

WH is fine by me.
And why not take the full CB mod?

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

I'd like to use as many of the CB mads as possible.

Also, I'd like to play T'ien Ch'i.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

I'm up for this. I'd like to be Pythium, assuming Wraithlord gets Marignon.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

I would just like to poke my nose in, if you don't mind, to say to the newer players: be careful of joining too many games. Near the start they take very little time and it cen be tempting to join lots, but 30-40 turns in you may find yourselves overwhelmed. Personally I wouldn't recommend joining more than 2 or at most 3 games. Of course if you have lots of free time you may wish to join more, but I think not many people can cope with more than two or three.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

Thanks for the heads-up; I don't think I'll join any more games. I have around 1 - 2 hours a day to play most of the time so it should be ok to have two games on the go. Plus I'll probably be eliminated pretty early in this game anyway!

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

yah a couple games is good...

ah i was thinking the pyth... i love their new purple coloring http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

but if they're taken... arcos? ermor?

ah, dibsies on ermor

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

Can I have Arco, then?

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

So far, we've got:

me: Jotunheim
archaeolept: Ermor
Jurri: Bandar Log
WraithLord: Marignon
DryaUnda: T'ien Ch'i
Cicadian: Pythium
Sandman: Arcosephale
Meglobob: Abysia
IndyPendant: R'yleh
Jeffr: Pangea


Jurri: yeah, we could do Lonely Mermaid. I sort of like the long and thin map I made though, I think it will make for early conflict, but not so much conflict that people are crammed in and triple-teamed. And, I like the ability to travel long distances (like teleporting) as being valuable, but I don't like huge maps. So a long, skinny map seems to make sense.

Does anyone have a preference on which map they like better? It seems like the options are: Lonely Mermaid, Pasha's 3 lake map, Desert Eye, or a random map.

WraithLord: I suppose we could use the full cb mod if people want. It's just that I hate the 65 gold indy commander and Dwarven Hammers costing 25 thing. We will wait and see what the new version of the cb mod looks like before deciding.

Does anyone know how to do that "scoredump" thing? Maybe we can play with score graphs off and do the scoredump every 10 turns to give an update on how people are doing without showing -all- the info all the time.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

I'd like to jump in as well unless it's a 24 hour turnaround.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

Oh, I forgot to mention the host time.. Yes, I was thinking it would be 24h turnaround time, at least for the first 20 turns or so. After that, we can set it to 48-h. And generally, if you haven't ever staled before, I will give extra time by re-setting the clock if someone is in danger of staling. But the second time, I'll probably just let the person stale.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

I will give Abysia a go.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

I vote for Pasha's 3 lake map.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

Well if there's still room, I would like to try my hand at playing R'lyeh.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

Yes, you are welcome in, IndyPendant, but I think that is all the room we have! I will still allow Jeffr in if he wants in, but besides that we are closed.

If we decide to play a larger (140-150 province) map, we could easily open it up again for another person or two, but if we're going to do a smaller (100-110 province) map, we had best cap it here.

I count one vote for the 3-Lake map, any other votes?

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

yah i'd be happy to try that http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

Hmm...the Three Lakes map does look neat, but I see a few difficulties using it in this game:

1) There are 9, maybe 10 players. The map has 104 provinces, which means we will have only 10.4-11.5 provinces per player. That will make for a *brutally* vicious game, particularly under difficult research.

2) The mountains and border mountains are clustered together, which reduces suitable starting points even further. I suspect fair placement will be difficult to implement for this map.

3) This is a preference thing; some players may call this an *advantage*. ; ) --There are zero choke points on this map. There are also few plains.

Note that I'm not saying 'no'. Just pointing out potential issues with the 3-Lake map, in this game.

I suggest the wraparound Silent Seas map.



--No, I'm kidding. : )

If we wanted large expansion room (which could fit the difficult-research theme), we could go Cradle. Or we could use Cradle and invite one or two more players.

Otherwise, of the maps I am aware of, I would probably prefer the Desert Eye over Three Lakes. That isn't a strong preference though, and I will play in either happily.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

yah that's a bit small - especially with difficult research.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

I'm in as Pangaea! Thanks for saving a spot. I haven't been checking here regularly for a while, so I didn't see this until just now.

Actually, I'm very rusty but what the hell.

So we're using the latest CB mods and the latest Worthy Heroes mod? I'll find them and download them now. I think I played with one of the very early version of the CB mod, but that would have been a long time ago. So, I'll just wing it and hopefully get lucky.

(and a little later...)
I tried downloading from the CB post in the Mods section and couldn't. Does anybody have a link for the latest CB and Worthy Heroes mods?

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

Oh, and not that my vote should count for much since I haven't been around, but I vote for Score Graphs Off. Half the fun is not knowing what's going on.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

As a relative MP newbie, Score Graphs Off scares me. There's a boogeyman in the closet daddy, I can hear it scratching...

I'm also thoroughly confused as to which mods will be used for this game. Can CB be broken up? Is there a version that is compatible with 3.10 that I can't find? Before we start, I'd like to know clearly what mods I need to download. ; )

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

The current CB version up for download is not that current, a new version should be up this weekend. Actually the same goes for worthy heroes, Turin has taken an indefinite dominions leave, so he's allowing me to update his mod in the meantime. And yes, CB can be parted up in any version, though I hope you'll consider the new full version when it's out.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

Yes, the CB mod can be broken up into parts. We are only using the Gods and the Scales part. As far as I know, only Spells and Nations (?) are incompatible with v3.10. I'd actually like to use Spells if QM makes it compatible with v3.10 before we start.

Worthy Heroes

CB 1.1

About the map, I think we should probably use a random map.

Edit: I think we should wait until the new mods are out before starting if that's okay with everyone. It gives us time to figure out a map.

Re: Invisible Swarm 2 - recruiting
 

I think I'll go with Bandar Log. (Could you put the player list in the initial post: it's the fastest to check http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif )

I have not been very impressed by the random maps: they have all kinds of problems starting with provinces that are not connected to any other provinces and ending with weird starting position placement. (The latter is probably more a function of the general capital placement algorithm, but at least for me it has been more pronounced on random maps.) Three Lakes would be a fine map. (Although I much prefer wraparounds when possible.)

No graphs gets my vote! Flailing around in the dark has it's own allure. Since the victory condition is rather obvious, there's no problem of a 'sneak victory,' either, for those who worry about such things. I have no strong opinion on the matter, however, so if it helps Indy sleep at night scores on is good http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Indeed, to address his other issues:
1) ~10 provs per player is plenty, and has proven to provide for a nice stage for the kind of aggressive games that the Invisible Swarms have been. Quick an' dirty and fun! It's of course not everyone's cup of tea, but I would prefer we not bloat the map: there are plenty of games that can satisfy the urge for a more sparsely populated map.

2 & 3) I suspect you're mixing 3 lakes up with Pasha's other map or something. 3 lakes has plenty of plains, and while there are only two non-passable mountain ranges they create some choke-points, along with the map not being wrap-around. Especially for land nations the map has a lot of tight spots what with the lakes and all. You should take one yourself and see for yourself http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Maps
 

Howdy from Athens!

If on the off chance you use Three Lakes, you might want to make sure you use the updated map file (on the same thread) that no one starts with the province with a wraithlord, because otherwise, that player will get a free wraithlord commander, which is a bit unfair.

But, what about Jurri's map (Playground of the Dawgs)? Is it too small? It is a wraparound, and Jurri recently updated it from Eye Cancer to Eye Candy. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Pasha

Re: Maps
 

10 provinces per player is pretty small, and will hurt anyone not running a bless strat, especially due to difficult research. I can cope w/ that though http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

i'd prefer sticking w/ only worthy heroes, scales, and pretenders. I barely know vanilla DomIII, and so might have problems adapting to CB spells and nations - scales and pretenders, all the changes are up front, so easy to factor in.

Settings Finalized!
 

Okay, after reading Jurri's post I have finalized stuff! I agree with him that the Invisible Swarm games have always been fast, brutal, early game action. So it will continue to be like that.

I sort of dislike the look of the Lonely Mermaid map, but it is a wraparound, and of roughly the correct size, so we will use it. It's 120 provinces, 12 per player. That may be a little small for some people's preference, and considering that we have a couple of relative MP newbies, there will be another house rule:

No intentional hostilities for the first 10 turns of the game! The previous Prokrantor's influence is still felt for a short while, enough to give everyone a chance in the early game. At the time of the Awakening, however, you had better prepare for war!

I also hope that using the scales and gods mod will help to mute somewhat the extreme bless strategies. But, it does seem pretty clear that this type of game favors a bless strat.

As far as scoregraphs, they will be off, but I will try to figure out the scoredump thing and give a report every 10-15 turns. So, before the hostilities can begin, there will be a report on the relative strengths of everyone.

How does this all sound to everyone?
Lonely Mermaid

Edit: Oh, also we will need the Quickfix mod because we have MA Tien Chi. I hope all these mods are compatible, I'll have to do a test game before we start.
Quickfix mod

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

Hehe, that's some quirky house rule! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif You don't see rushes before turn 10 usually anyways, so I don't quite see what the point is. In fact, the rule makes the awake pretender option worse than usual, and I don't think the game needs that.

I'd maybe prefer total blindness to an intermittent scoredump, actually. There's enough fiddling around with the settings already with the numerous mods and all, in my opinion http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

I should step in with a couple clarifications: I'm not insisting on Graphs On. Graphs Off does make me nervous...; ) --But that is only cuz I'm still new to MP, and if a clear preference shows itself, I'm *cough* still game.

Also, in case it came accross that way, I didn't mean to criticize the mods or anything. I was just confused as to what we were using exactly, and where to find them. The links cleared that up wonderfully, thanks.

I'll stay out of the no-hostilities debate, since it's unlikely I will have to deal with a rush.

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

About the No-hostilities rule: I was just thinking that people might be scared they'd be 2 provinces away from someone else to start with.. It would stop a super-early rush, that's all. We could bump it up to maybe turn 12 or so, I guess. I thought people would feel a little more secure about the small map that way.

If someone else wants a no-hostilities rule in the beginning, go ahead and say so, and we'll have one. Maybe to turn 12 or 15. If no one wants one, we won't have one. I mean, I don't care, myself.

Fine, I don't know how to do the scoredump anyway, makes things easier. Total blindness it is then.

I'm trying to find compromises, that's all.

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

Ah, sorry, I may have been criticizing too much: I'm perfectly happy with any settings you deem fun, just, um, voicing opinions for your consideration http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Please don't feel like you need to compromise anything on my account!

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

So...we are waiting for 2 mods to be completed for compatability to 3.10? Worthy heros and conceptual balance, scales, gods and spells?

Is this a email or server game?

I guess I have time for a practice game then... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

i'd prefer not spells... but i'm happy to wait a week, confirm the map, get the updated worthy heroes...

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

It's a server game, I will post my IP...um... soon.

We could just go ahead and start, the old versions of CB Gods, Scales, and Worthy Heroes probably won't cause any conflict in v3.10.

But at the same time, QM said that the new versions of all of those would be out by this weekend. I assume that means sunday. So, we could wait a few days and start on monday if that is cool? If people are itching to start, we could just go ahead and start.

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

Monday's fine for me. I suspect if we tried waiting a week, we might lose some people and have to start over...

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

yah monday is fine... let's me figure out what i'm gonna do http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

I am ok with Monday.

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

me too.

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

Oh and btw, I've been playing around with the CB Scales, CB Pretenders, and Worthy Heroes mods since I discovered they would be used in this game. I can't guarantee they will work in all cases, but they haven't caused me any problems so far...

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

It has just occured to me that I'm going to be out of town from wednesday to sunday, I sort of want to wait until then to start, but I don't want people to bolt to another game. I'll try and find someone to sit for me.

I need to pay more attention to my schedule, lol. It's like my Dominions schedule is in a different universe than my real-life schedule, then I remember "Oh yes, real life does affect Dominions sometimes" hehe.

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

hey i won't bolt ... i'm fine either way http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

I'm in no hurry either!

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

me neither

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

Heh. Okay, sign me up as okay with waiting too. Looks like I was wrong. ; )

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

Thanks guys. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

I really should have waited until I got back to post this game. I wasn't thinking. But as it turns out, I guess, the new CB mod isn't out yet. I'm sure it will be out by the time I get back.

Re: Settings Finalized!
 

Yeah, sorry guys, really hoped to release it last weekend. However, if you are only using pretenders and scales I think there will be almost no difference.