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Krsqk

July 17th, 2001 05:43 AM

Basic tech mod?

Is anyone interested in a mod similar to the "grit-tech" thread below, or is everyone content just to change the appropriate settings within the game? I think someone expressed a desire for a little more variety than just that. I don't have a lot of time to devote to modding (I'm getting married in a little under 3 weeks), but I'd be glad to pass on to someone else whatever I can get done before then. So far, I've made the restrictions given for the grit-tech PBW game, but I haven't modified any of the AI to adapt to those changes (especially no racial techs). Maybe those in the PBW game can make some suggestions for modifications/balancing of techs and comps.

[ August 10, 2002, 20:17: Message edited by: Krsqk ]

Suicide Junkie

July 17th, 2001 04:46 PM

Re: Basic tech mod?

I would enjoy contributing to a Basic Tech mod.

Just say when

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geoschmo

July 17th, 2001 05:52 PM

Re: Basic tech mod?

If I had it to do over again I would probably do the grit tech using the devnull mod. It has a lot of variety in weapons, even some that fit the "grit tech" format.

If you are doing a mod for this, I suggest incorporating some of his ideas. Different kinds of missles would be nice. Some faster speed/lower damage. His pod missles are cool. Take up little space in the ship, and the expense of only being able to fire once per combat round.

Some different particle weapons. They don't even have to have diffeent abilities or damage, just something to give you a different feel, and some variety.

I would even support some low power laser weapons. It is conceivable that those would be possible in the not too distant future. I would like to see them take a lot of room and use lots of supplies. Maybe even limit them to long reload times. Anything to keep it balanced.

Geoschmo

Puke	July 17th, 2001 09:47 PM

Re: Basic tech mod?

yeah, devnull would be a good base for grit. lots of armor types, lots of missiles, more point defense types.

I will have to restart my devnull test game again so I can see if it is working on the server yet, I think it may have been fixed, but i am seeing some odd problems that might be just with that game.

Krsqk

July 17th, 2001 11:49 PM

Re: Basic tech mod?

All right, due to overwhelming demand, I'll start. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/images/icons/icon7.gif Okay, I've started. How about a little input before I make too many arbitrary opinions?

<UL TYPE=SQUARE>
<LI> AI--What would be the best approach to this, especially since all racial techs are gone? Should there be separate design/construction/research files for each ship, or should all races use the same set?
<LI> Intel--Should this be disabled? It is buggy, and I'm not sure if all of the ops fit into the low-tech theme. (Taking over a computer-run ship 15 systems away?)
<LI> Cloaking/Stealth armor--Someone had mentioned different levels of cloaking for stealth armor, along with different levels for mines, making some mines detectable. Opinions?
<LI> System-wide facilities--Are facs that boost production/research/happiness/etc across an entire system feasible?
<LI> Scale/Balance--Would you like to see an all out slug-fest with massive ships, or should components/weapons/supplies be expensive, allowing for fewer ships/smaller fleets/shorter range. Along with this, should base maintenance be lower/higher/unchanged?
<LI> Ship size/ship yards--Is it possible to build ships of the sizes currently in SEIV? Should ships even be able to be built in space? I plan on increasing the size of ship SYs anyway to make them only available on the larger ships and bases, or maybe just on bases. Would more in-between sizes be good (i.e., courier/corvette, more fighters, etc, with different max engines/requirements)?[/list]
I'm sure I'll come up with more, but this will do for now. Looking forward to what comes out!

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"The Unpronounceable" Krsqk

[This message has been edited by Krsqk (edited 17 July 2001).]

Suicide Junkie

July 18th, 2001 12:59 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

Arrgh. stupid browser ate my post.

1) I think that having all the AIs act the same would be very boring...
IMO, it would be best to have each one specialize in something different, such as missiles vs torpedoes vs slug throwers, etc.

2) Disabling all offensive intel would be good. Informational ops only, such as the census reports should be allowed.
Leave technology theft out of the list, though, since it will doubtlessly be abused.

3) Put in many levels of stealth. 10 levels would be good, for then you have to start wondering when to quit the cold-war escalation and actually research weapons & armor http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/images/icons/icon7.gif
Anybody who researches all 10 techs in stealth and sensors would be whooped by the unstealthy army of mass destruction some other player has equipped with WMGs and Armor 15s.

4) Yes. I could see the system-wide bonus coming from a dedicated lab, full of hardworking planners. They would design the most efficient mining tunnels for the specific terrain of each world, breed different farm plants and animals for each world, etc.
The System-wide Lab would be dedicated to that one system, and concentrate on the sun & orbital effects.
Single-planet Labs would work on the gravity, surface structure/terrain, ambient temperature effects.

5&6) I really like the propulsion system I designed for P&N v2.0 (and the AIs do decently in it too!)
By making the propulsion requirements based on mass, it pushes the optimum shp size down to LC & smaller.
Big ships can still be useful, and effective, but they are slow and expensive, so it is advisable to have many fast, expendable LCs and FGs to defend it.

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geoschmo

July 18th, 2001 01:50 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

I wouldn't mess with intel. I think governments in the future will definetly deal in espionage and sabotage.

If your concern is the bug, it will be fixed at some point, and can be disabled in the mean time. There is no nedd to remove it in a mod.

Geo

Krsqk

July 18th, 2001 03:20 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

Well, how 'bout some compromise? http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/ima...ons/icon12.gif

1) I agree about the boring AI comment. I have little enough successful experience at modding the AI to qualify me as unqualified. Any help? I can slice out stuff like techs that aren't included, but I haven't gotten the hang of the design/construction files yet.

2) Errg, intel. I strongly feel that PPP (and maybe? CI?) should be removed. Maybe just made a whole lot more expensive. I mean, it would take an awful lot of effort to get part of a country/empire to just up and switch sides. However, I see anarchy Groups as a very viable alternative; you just won't directly reap the benefits of a riot/rebellion. Tech theft will probably go, too, or at least go up in cost. Having looked through the IntelProjects file just now, those are the only things I feel strongly about. I'll probably try to include Lucas' AI Intel mod to keep them from running Ship Blueprints twelve times a turn. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/images/icons/icon7.gif

3) Oh, so you want the infinite tech tree with finite tech areas? What a pity the game limits us to Super Extended Reinforced Ablative Stealth PLasteel Reactive Armor XX. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/images/icons/icon7.gif I think I'd put different levels on mines, then, too, not just increased sizes as they go up. The question to be answered, then, is,--well, it's at the end of this lengthy post.

4) System-wide production is in, then. Research and Intel, too, then--some sort of coordination center. Hey, let's throw in happiness, too, and just say the media is in some sort of mass conspiracy or something. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/images/icons/icon7.gif

5&6) Yes, I'd planned on implementing the propulsion system from P&N v2. I do want to keep larger sizes an integral part (keeps maintenance nice and high up there), and I'll probably go ahead and add in some new sizes for good measure.

Two questions, then. First, propulsion. Should I rework the current sets of engines? I mean, ion propulsion isn't quite around the corner. I was thinking of having two routes to go: A) a solid-/liquid-fuel based system which uses medium or high supplies with higher speed, less supply storage, cheaper; and B) a nuclear system with low supply usage, high cost, high storage, and low/medium speed. (A) would give better interception/combat abilities, but ship-sized afterburner type components would keep (B) a viable alternative for combat, especially with the supply storage-to-use ratio.

Second question: should this mod lean toward a massive tech tree, with 10 or 15 options for each area (e.g., Armor XV, Stealth Armor X, High Yield Chemical Warhead XVIII, etc.)? Or, alternatively, should it be more of a Cold War scenario, in which defense > offense because of a greater number of techs? Not to an unbalancing extent, but I think it should be especially difficult to destroy massive ships, and especially planets. They're, well, big.

That's enough rambling for one post. I'll get crackin' on it.

------------------
--------------
"The Unpronounceable" Krsqk

Phoenix-D

July 18th, 2001 03:29 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

"I mean, ion propulsion isn't quite around the corner."

One of our space probes is powered by an ion drive. It's not what some things make it out to be, though.. from what I understand it's slow to accelerate but good for long hauls.

Phoenix-D

Gimboid

July 18th, 2001 03:34 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Krsqk:

Second question: should this mod lean toward a massive tech tree, with 10 or 15 options for each area (e.g., Armor XV, Stealth Armor X, High Yield Chemical Warhead XVIII, etc.)? Or, alternatively, should it be more of a Cold War scenario, in which defense > offense because of a greater number of techs?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

With such a massive tech tree, basically you are going to have to pick what tech areas you want to be good at.
So whilst your enemy may have gone the "Super Extended Reinforced Ablative Stealth PLasteel Reactive Armor XX" route, you could have gone down the 'Enhanced Coherent Tectonic Meson Induced Ion Collider Beam VII' route. So your offense is somewhat offset (or defeated) by his defense.

Makes research as much a strategy as ship design is, which tech areas do u want? or do u want to be a jack of all trades and relatively weak compared to the specialists???

So in answer to your question, i say go for the large tech tree, making defensive and offensive techs roughtly equal in the extent they can be researched (not neccisarily in relative strengths) such as capping all research levels at level XXV or something.

Phoenix-D

July 18th, 2001 03:43 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

As far as the mod goes:

-I'd say use P&Ns propulsion system. Add in liquid-fueled drives, various types of nuclear drives, generators (like solar panels but doesn't need a star, if possible) etc. Ion and antimatter drives should be about the top-end drive units (note that we can create antimatter now, one molecule at a time). Also, I'd reduce the supplies storage given by engines. Right now they store as much as a supply storage but are half the size. Not right.

-Various types of armor. Big, cheap but less effective (by weight) but easy to fix, normal, small ablative that is tough but a PAIN to repair, etc.

-speaking of repair, need to put some careful thought into repair bays and such. I'm assuming no shields, so there's going to be a fair amount of hull damage going on.

-deflector shields. Make an armor-piercing gun- like the current Shard Cannons- but say it's made of a very magnetic material. Then make non-phased shields that are made to deflect these projectiles, by making everything ELSE do phased damage, and having the shields regen and have the same amount of shielding as the AP gun does damage.. so a lot of guns will penetrate, but each shield will stop one gun..but be useless against everything else. Measure, counter-measure..though this one is a bit high-tech.

-damage reducing components. A shield that has, say, 10 HP, and regens 10 per turn. The effect is a reduction of damage. Needn't call it a shield, though, maybe "damage control" (though the shield graphics would need removing)

-be careful with the component damaging an AP stuff..

-different types of minewarheads. Engine killers, small but cheap chemical explosives, etc.

-I'd say no tractor or repulsor beams, nor smart bombs that kill facilities. Plague bombs.. maybe. No MCs obviously.

-to add a little variety to the research tree, how about researching warheads seperately from missile types? You could have multiple types of missile, each with an option for a specific warhead (which would be a different component)

Lots of ideas, eh? http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/images/icons/icon7.gif I'd probably be able to help a bit, if you like. I've been working on modifying the SE tech tree anyway.

Phoenix-D

geoschmo

July 18th, 2001 04:52 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> I agree about the boring AI comment. I have little enough successful experience at modding the AI to qualify me as unqualified. Any help? I can slice out stuff like techs that aren't included, but I haven't gotten the hang of the design/construction files yet.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Don't get hung up on this part of it. Make the mod, do the components, tech tree stuff. Get it to where we can use it for multi player first. We can go back later and tweak the ai to work within the framework.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>(like solar panels but doesn't need a star, if possible)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Not possible without a code change.
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>I'd reduce the supplies storage given by engines. Right now they store as much as a supply storage but are half the size. Not right.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>True, but this is going to severly limit the range of ships, especially in the early going. Not that this is a bad thing, if we are going for ultra-realism. Ships would have to stay very close to home unless they are in large fleets with support vessels. I might even go as far as saying reduce the amount a supply component stores, and make solar cells more expensive to research and build. Eliminate emergency resupply and quantum reactors entirely maybe?

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Various types of armor. Big, cheap but less effective (by weight) but easy to fix, normal, small ablative that is tough but a PAIN to repair, etc.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>No way currently to make components harder or easier to repair. But decreasing their size does make them take longer to repair, because repair rate is by number of components.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>speaking of repair, need to put some careful thought into repair bays and such. I'm assuming no shields, so there's going to be a fair amount of hull damage going on.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Kind of like the engineering section in Hadrians mod and bandyed about for a Trek based mod. Not a bad idea. I think repair bays should be smaller and cheaper, but repair fewer components.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>deflector shields. Make an armor-piercing gun- like the current Shard Cannons- but say it's made of a very magnetic .........though this one is a bit high-tech. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I'll say. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/ima...ons/icon12.gif This whole paragraph got away from me. Doesn't fit with the whole idea of the mod IMHO. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/ima...ons/icon12.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>damage reducing components. A shield that has.....<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Uh...see above.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>different types of minewarheads. Engine killers<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>sorry, component specific mines are another good idea that can't be done currently <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>, small but cheap chemical explosives, etc.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>This is a nice idea, for variety if nothing else.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>I'd say no tractor or repulsor beams, nor smart bombs that kill facilities. Plague bombs.. maybe. No MCs obviously.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Beams, I agree. But Smart Bombs? Uh, anybody remember the Gulf War? I know Sadam does. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/ima...ons/icon12.gif Plauge Bombs, definetly doable. No MC's? You mean Master Computers? I'd say most definetly not obvious to me. I can see automated systems controlling ship functions. Remember, what we are going for here is not to limit ourselves to what we can do right now. (We can't even sustain a permanent occupation of the moon right now.) We are just looking to eliminate the techs that aren't feasible with today's science. Smart Bombs and Master Computers are certainly feasible. The principle is understandable, even though we don't have the technology to do it on that scale yet.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>to add a little variety to the research tree, how about researching warheads seperately from missile types? You could have multiple types of missile, each with an option for a specific warhead (which would be a different component)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I like this. Advances in missle tech would give increases in range and speed, but not change damage. Advances in warheads would increase damage, but not speed or range. Great idea. Each new mssle component wouild simply have two research requirements. Very easy to implement.

Geoschmo

[This message has been edited by geoschmo (edited 18 July 2001).]

Phoenix-D

July 18th, 2001 05:40 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Don't get hung up on this part of it. Make the mod, do the components, tech tree stuff. Get it to where we can use it for multi player first. We can go back later and tweak the ai to work within the framework.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Agreed.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>(like solar panels but doesn't need a star, if possible)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Not possible without a code change.

-You can fudge it. Make emergancy resupply components..that don't destroy themselves on use. It'd give the AI fits though.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>True, but this is going to severly limit the range of ships, especially in the early going. Not that this is a bad thing, if we are going for ultra-realism. Ships would have to stay very close to home unless they are in large fleets with support vessels. I might even go as far as saying reduce the amount a supply component stores, and make solar cells more expensive to research and build. Eliminate emergency resupply and quantum reactors entirely maybe?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've always thought of quantum reactors as chessy myself, and as for emergancy resupply.. why not just make it part of the normal resupply pool? Didn't make sense to me.

Various types of armor. Big, cheap but less effective (by weight) but easy to fix, normal, small ablative that is tough but a PAIN to repair, etc. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>No way currently to make components harder or easier to repair. But decreasing their size does make them take longer to repair, because repair rate is by number of components.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Which is what I meant http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/images/icons/icon7.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Kind of like the engineering section in Hadrians mod and bandyed about for a Trek based mod. Not a bad idea. I think repair bays should be smaller and cheaper, but repair fewer components.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Or put in specilized repair bays, but also smaller components that do less damage. For "mobile drydocks" and the like.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>I'll say. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/ima...ons/icon12.gif This whole paragraph got away from me. Doesn't fit with the whole idea of the mod IMHO. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/ima...ons/icon12.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Quite. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/images/icons/icon7.gif

QUOTE] Uh...see above.[/quote] That it's too high, or it got away from you? It isn't really a shield, just uses (abuses?) the shield mechanics. (the other thing is just a magnetic field that directs rounds away from the ship, but it seems kinda cheap for this mod)

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>sorry, component specific mines are another good idea that can't be done currently <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> This would be because of :Weapon Type := Warhead: right? This wouldn't prevent, say, a cloaking device for mines, would it.. instead of building that into the mine chassis as currently. well, them using it might be an issue..since you can't attack while cloaked. Might just make "stealth mine" chassis then.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Beams, I agree. But Smart Bombs? Uh, anybody remember the Gulf War? I know Sadam does. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/ima...ons/icon12.gif Plauge Bombs, definetly doable. No MC's? You mean Master Computers? I'd say most definetly not obvious to me. I can see automated systems controlling ship functions. Remember, what we are going for here is not to limit ourselves to what we can do right now. (We can't even sustain a permanent occupation of the moon right now.) We are just looking to eliminate the techs that aren't feasible with today's science. Smart Bombs and Master Computers are certainly feasible. The principle is understandable, even though we don't have the technology to do it on that scale yet.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

What I'd objecting to about the smart bombs is that you instantly know where the facility is, and can kill it in one shot, as I understand it. Same idea as the quantum (chesse) but less impossible.

[quote]I like this. Advances in missle tech would give increases in range and speed, but not change damage. Advances in warheads would increase damage, but not speed or range. Great idea. Each new mssle component wouild simply have two research requirements. Very easy to implement.[quote]

Yah, very simple. Requires a bit of playing with the techs, but entirely possible http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/images/icons/icon7.gif

If we're going to have things like fusion reactors, I'd add a short-ranged cannon that "fires" a contained fusion reaction.. which of course shortly becomes UN-contained. Give it short range and drasticly decreasing damage, along with 1 damage near the ship (firing interlock to prevent self-destruction) and high on the tech tree.

I'd say powerful lasers are in, but should loose damage at range. Possibly another split tech tree option there- you can either get more powerful, but badly focused, lasers, or opt to refine your technology for pinpoint damage.. then research the other side later to get the nasty stuff.

Also more slug throwers of course.. and I'd say slow down the speed of the "basic" weapons to 2 or three, enabling you to simulate rapid-fire, higher tech weapons easier.

I'd say planet, sun, black hole and the like devices are out, of course.. how about monilith facilites? Different name/picture for them?

Phoenix-D

Phoenix-D

July 18th, 2001 05:44 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

ZeroAdunn

July 18th, 2001 06:15 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

Some suggestions:

How to do propulsion:
Tech area one: Thrusters: Standard rocket engines, only one standard movement point, as you get up there the engines use less fuel and maybe give bonus combat movement.
Tech are two: Drive system: Uses almost know fuell, use the extra movement gen. ala the solar sail. Different levels would provide you with different drive systems. (say maybe ion 1-3 (one bonus movement) Nuclear 1-3 (uses more fuel offers two bonus) etc...

Take fuel storage down to 10k, much more realistic.

As suggested, more armor.

As for weapons:
1: Lasers, very long range low supply cost never get weaker, but very weak.
2: Standard cannon, shorter range, higher supply cost, high damage
3: Missiles, Make missiles a lot tougher, make them only take 20 spaces and can only fire once per combat.
4: Torpedoes, like missiles, can fire more than once in combat do a lot less damage.
5: Flak cannons, to replace point defense guns

Various other components:
Lidar or radar (combat to hit bonus)
RAM armor(radar absorbing armor, cloak and defense bonus)
Repair crew: 1 comp repair per turn.

Mod troops:
Infantry, 1k requires nothing, then create a new comp, rifles.
Tanks, standard troops as they are now.

I've got a lot more ideas two, but these are my best... I think

Krsqk

July 18th, 2001 07:06 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

Thanks for all the ideas! Keep them coming! Not that I'm not swamped, but things could be worse. I didn't expect this much response. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/images/icons/icon7.gif

Rather than post lengthy accounts of my changes, I've uploaded a list of them here. I will update it every time I accomplish anything fairly significant and will post a notification of it. I am also keeping a list of ideas gleaned from this thread here. As I implement ideas from this list, they will be removed; so if your idea suddenly disappears, it's good, not bad. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/images/icons/icon7.gif Please note that these are by no means set in stone; they are only a list for me to work from. Some very good ideas may not be compatible with the means I used to implement something else, so this list could go back and forth as techs alternate between the "drawing board" and "implemented" stages while I work out the kinks.

These files are also meant to be a means for you to keep up with the mod without having to read all of the previous Posts (i.e., P&N--not that I expect to get that many replies). http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/ima...ons/icon12.gif

That's it for this post; more to come later.

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"The Unpronounceable" Krsqk

Krsqk

July 18th, 2001 10:35 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

Please post in the new Basic Tech Mod Info thread. I seem to have enabled the "Notify by e-mail" option when I started this thread, and I had about a dozen Messages in my mailbox when I checked it. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/images/icons/blush.gif Whee. Anyway, go to the new thread so you can razz me there. http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/images/icons/icon7.gif

Out for now.

------------------
"The Unpronounceable" Krsqk
Basic Tech Mod
--Current changes list
--Future ideas list

Fyron

August 9th, 2002 11:57 PM

Re: Basic tech mod?

bump for myself...

jimbob

August 10th, 2002 12:42 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

Hey, is there stuff going on with this thread? Last post is Last year, but I've got ideas for some 'basic' tech tree stuff, esp the biosciences... any takers?

Fyron

August 10th, 2002 01:24 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

Kinda... I've been working on a primitive mod. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

jimbob

August 10th, 2002 01:30 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

Oh, Okay,
I've been thinking that there are a lot of cool ideas out there, but that they're too low tech to be realistically used in the SEIV game as it currently stands. For example, there was a board game that I remember playing once. There were fighters, giant carriers, etc. but no real shields to speak of. Instead ships would spray tons of water out of large baLasts to create walls of tiny ice crystals - they acted as sheilds because they would defract laser figher, but also act as (not)Electric Counter Measures because the defraction would make it harder to see where the ship really was...

Should I throw more ideas at ya?

Fyron

August 10th, 2002 01:33 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

Sure, throw all the ideas you can lift. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

jimbob

August 10th, 2002 02:55 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

Alright.
And some of these I've made the components already, just haven't had a captive audience http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Supply/Liquid Vents - pushes out a (literal) ton of water, uses considerable supplies (50 supplies) as you've just flushed your drinking water for the month. Reasonable sheilding, some regeneration, low ECM.

Decoy Missile - small PD device that mimicks the electronic signature of ships in the fleet (I wish it could be only the host ship, but that's not moddable). If successful the seeker/fighter chases after the decoy instead of the target ship. Uses direct fire PD weapon, either short range repulsor or short range warp hole to make it appear that the seeker/fighter has gone chasing after the decoy.

Biotechnology - a facility at which scientists do basic genetic manipulations to improve organic/farm output. I'd say by 25%, but with a negative side due to environmental degredation by rogue plants, animals, etc. (-1% to planetary organic rating/turn)

Cryogenics - an offshoot of biology too. I'd suggest decreasing the normal cargo space of a colony component by about 4 fold, then these would bring the cargo capacity of the colony component back up to 'normal' levels. I personaly like this one a lot, because it makes the early components very low tech. Should use supplies each turn, as you've got to keep people in the hybernetic state. I've made equivalent crew components too.

Miniaturization - a pre-requisite for small weapons, nanotechnology, robotics, etc. etc.
- I'd also suggest that robots be a pre-requisite for the advanced resource factories

Cybernetics - I was surprised that this was never in the SEIV universe! Ever since the Cloud City Bald-headed computer guy, I've thought that this would be a most excellent (and probably low tech vs. space travel) technology. I see this as a 0kT (one per ship) "Cybernet Crew" component that just represents that extra money was spent on outfitting the crew with cybernetic hardware. All sorts of minor bonuses could be accessable (esp combat bonuses).

Cloning - We can almost do this now! Okay, not like in SW episode II, but maybe that could be the next tech, Accelerated Cloning. Again, I'd suggest a a 0kT (one per ship) "clone crew" and/or "clone troop" component(s).

Blister Pack - very light external explosive charge that is supposed to blend in with the hull of the ship. When seekers/fighters zip by, it explodes into them, hopefully taking a few to an early grave. Because it's on the outside of the ship, I suggest that this would have the 'armor' ability, that it would be small (to blend in) and that it would only fire once during combat. Probably a range of 1, maybe 2 at the higher levels.

Well those are the ideas that I can remember, think I've got more written up at home. I also think it would feel more 'low tech' if the probability to hit of all weapons took a step or two down, maybe -10 or 20%. Just the idea that these low tech ships would be traveling through vast space, firing broadsides at eachother, just hoping for a hit (versus ST:NG, where they call the shot..."Hit 'em in the mess hall, Jordi, fifth table, second chair") makes it all a little more 'real' to me.

Cheers, and hope that some of this would be useful. Some of these I've already made into components if that would help

[ August 10, 2002, 01:57: Message edited by: jimbob ]

Krsqk

August 10th, 2002 03:52 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

Did you check the Basic Tech Mod Info thread referred to a few Posts down? I think it had the most up-to-date info.

Fyron

August 10th, 2002 03:59 AM

Re: Basic tech mod?

Jimbob:
Those are some nice ideas. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Krsqk:
Yeah. I was unable to bump it, so I bumped this one instead.

Krsqk

August 10th, 2002 09:36 PM

Re: Basic tech mod?

OK. I just found how to turn off the e-mail notification feature I turned on over a year ago. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

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