The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

I just took out an enemy pretender.

F9 W9 E9 S9 D9 N4! No wonder I have been fighting through some pretty bad terrain!

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

That must be on impossible. All those extra design points put to use.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

I hate the way AI difficulty settings work...

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

What's really bad is the AI doesn't know how to use blessed units... so all those blessings were pretty much wasted by the AI.

Another bad side effect is the AI suffers more from bad scales... especially death scales and unluck scales. For better balanced multiplayer games with AI opponents I have to provide the AIs with their scales and sometimes even provide them their pretenders and dominion strength by editing the map file.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

I always hear about people putting in custom gods for the AI, but nobody ever posts that section of their map file. Come on, it can't be that long. I'm curious what people think would be a good AI opponent.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

Besides, it could be added to SemiRandom. Which can be used to randomly create an AI. Or at least choose from a list of suitable choices.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

It might be, I've forgotten what I started this with.

I don't have a good picture of what his scales are like because my dominion is pressing in but the lands I have been fighting through have had some pretty low population numbers. Something sure devastated the landscape and I strongly suspect it's bad scales despite all the points he put into his sage.

When it's got gobs of points to spend it should put more into scales!

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

Agreed.

I have an AI as EA Argatha, which is a cold blooded nation, that took Cold2 instead of Heat0to3. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/Sick.gif I might expect such silliness from Easy AI, but not Very Difficult or Impossible.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

I wish we could design the AI Pretends that we will face!

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

But you can. Just set him as human and switch to AI on turn 1.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

You can also put designed pretenders in at the start using map editing. I don't know much about this, but other people know lots.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

For the AI you'll want to arrange a pretender of size 2 or less... otherwise you risk the AI sending its pretender into the arena death match. AI's should be programmed to NEVER send its pretender, but until then size 2 or less. I recommend some type of immortal so it stays stronger longer. When choosing its magic paths and blessings be aware of what spells will be made available... you don't want to provide the AI with a global which will do it severe harm such as Utterdark or Astral Corruption. Also I advise against a nature_9 or higher as the beserk usually does more harm to the AI.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

Very true... the best help an AI can recieve are strong positive scales which can be done by editing the .map file. Inside the Dominions doc folder is a PDF which explains how to edit the .map file.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

Personnally when I buff AIs I use a mod to give them researchbonus on an immobile pretender or recuperation+immortality on a combat chassis + I set the god with max dominion and crazy scales.

And I only give them high earth magic (eventually other paths but with low levels only), so the AIs will only cast global without drawbacks for them (riches from beneath, mechanical militia, earth blood deep well...). Giving high water, air or death may be ultra detrimental to an AI (ex : Man casting eternal storm and wasting the archers, or a sea nation trapping its troops with "Sea of Ice" + all high death AIs tend to cast "Burden of Time" and "Utterdark").

Ie :

Mod

#newmonster 2800
#copystats 158
#name "AI Oracle"
#researchbonus 30
#end

#newmonster 2801
#copystats 156
#name "AI Cyclops"
#immortal
#regeneration 10
#heal
#end

Map
#god x "AI Oracle" (or "AI Cyclops")
#dominionstr 10
#mag_earth 10
#scale_chaos -3
#scale_lazy -3
#scale_unmagic -3
#end

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

I understand with water, air, blood and death, but why only earth?

Fire - Second Sun might be bad for some, but should be fine for heat2-3 nations and cold blooded nations. I don't think Kindly Ones attack the caster's commanders. My armies often consist of a lot of undead/demons so a surprise Purgatory could hurt bad. Although this path is not quite as potent as Astral or Nature for the AI.

Astral - An immobile high level astral mage (doesn't need to be the pretender) may go feeble to Strands of Arcane Power, but give it the chalice & it will heal itself. In addition, SoAP helps the AI find magic sites which is a big weakness for the AI. If the AI has a lot of territory & casts SoAP watch the gem income graph spike, especially from a mage with other minor multiple paths. That means not only more gems, but it can start recruiting special units (like trogs, etc) from those sites. Arcane Nexus & Wrath of God are also quite good.

Nature - I don't see any downside globals. Imagine Lanka or a giant nation with Gift of Health. Since the AI's power is heavily influenced by gold income that also makes Gift of Nature's Bounty quite valuable for the AI. Haunted Forest is also quite good for an AI to better defend itself.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

How do you switch all the players to AI once the game has started?

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

Options -> Become computer controlled

Though I don't know what level it sets at and if you can change it.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

It sets it to default AI. That is, neither aggressive nor defensive, and with no bonuses.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

Yes I tried setting up the AI myself one game and then switching it to computer. While the self-destructive scales were absent so were any bonuses it seems, and the AI was really inadequate. I aborted the game and effort.

I am really intrigued by adjusting the map itself by placing the Pretenders and Scales manually. I read the modding guide but I guess I really am too old! It seems woefully incomplete to me and I don't even know where to begin. Hasn't anybody modded the map files as suggested here by NTJedi and Twan among others? Where can I download them? Or can anyone post a complete example as a guide to copy and adjust?

Confused.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

Earth just look better for most nations, and has some synergy with AI strength (huge armies of chaff needing some buffs or some solid summons to complete).

Fire has no good summons out of uniques and may cause the AI pretender to chain cast fire from afar when gems are available (an annoying spell but not really cost efficient). May be good for nations with good sacred anyway (as well water is good for land AI nations with good sacred).

Nature >8 would make sacred berserks, so it's bad for nations with holy mages. Nature 8 may be good (except when the AI poison its troops with bog beasts).

I don't trust the AI for using astral well, I fear to see AI pretenders feebleminded by some spells they may cast, or an immobile pretender teleporting somewhere and then never building a lab to return home (never seen this happen anyway, but with the AI I always imagine the worst case).

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

In a recent battle, AI Argatha had 3 earth mages chain-cast curse of stones without considering the magic resistance of everyone involved. The pretender cannot be everywhere to buff every army either. Nevertheless, Earth is hard for the AI to mess up.

The AI isn't efficient with any gems in general. I was more impressed with the astral and nature paths under the AI.

A water9 AI land nation could cast Tethis' Blessing send it's troops into the water & then override Tethis' Blessing with another global killing their troops. I've seen it happen. The AI hurting itself with Wrath of the Sea could be possible too since the AI has no problem casting Utterdark & Burden of Time to kill itself. But if the map has no/little water then it's not so bad.

Bogbeasts require a water path so as long as you don't mix water & nature on the same unit you're fine. Nature8 allows for all nature globals and the regeneration is nice on sacreds with higher life. Mass Protection, Relief and Mass Regeneration can be nice army buffs too. The benefits from the nature globals I mentioned earlier alone would far outweigh the rare tarrasque IF the AI ever even it makes one which I've yet to see. I have seen Niefelheim with Gift of Health.

I've never seen the AI use teleport or astral gateway ever. Anti-Magic and Will of Fates are nice mass army buffs too. Unfortunately, I don't think the AI does Master Enslave or Arcane Domination. SoAP is a big help for the AI finding magic sites. The biggest danger is it going feebleminded, which is why I suggested an immobile with a chalice. It doesn't need to be the pretender.

If you don't experiment you'll never know for sure.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

In fact I haven't experimented a lot boosting only pretenders as there is a better way to boost AIs : giving them some provinces with
-recruitable powerful units (troglodytes, trolls, knights on a province with high ressources)
-immobiles mages and a lab or appropriate site (ie enter to summon bane + immobile d1 mage)
-known gems prod sites (in provinces owned or nearby provinces)

Then you may let AI design the pretender, even if the choice is strange it will be hard.

(but I've tried one time to duel an AI just boosted by an immortal E10 cyclops, and I think it's one of the best boost if you just change pretender -but you may add nature and fire of course; give it relics etc-)

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

Guys, lighten up.

Just programming a system not to lose at tic-tac-toe is hard, and that is a closed, super-simple, well-defined system.

Here we're talking about a super-complex system. The mere fact that it [AI] can do anything even remotely intelligent is incredible.

Don't criticize it.
Point out difficulties, surely, and any gaping holes, and if that isn't enough, join an MP game.
That'll teach you.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

Not really, since Tic Tac Toe has a known undefeatable strategy.
But yes, even slightly more complex games are very hard to write good AIs for.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

Even Checkers and Connect Four have been "solved". That means there is no way for an AI programmed correctly to lose. These are much simpler games, though.

Re: The AI Pretender design is insane!
 

I consider the pretender I ran into to be an example of a gaping hole.