Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

... by the last patch. Or is it just an impression ?

I currently play a game with luck 3 / turmoil 2 / magic 3 / growth 3 scales. I have a rather big empire (30+ provinces, about 3/4 with my luck scale).

The ten turns before the patch I never had less than 3 events a turn, with a large majority of gems events and occasionnal gold (including a 3000gp) and only two time militias in 35 turns.

Compared to that, the turns played since the last patch seem exceptionally crappy : I had 2 turns with only 2 events and even a turn with only one, and got in total only one gem event and only one (200) gold event, 2 times the new "lowborn warriors" event, 2 times a flagellant event, a merchants prosperity decreasing faith in a province, and all other events were bandits (3 times in 5 turns, really strange with luck 3).

May the events table or luck mechanics have been altered by the addition of the new ones or is it just exceptionnal real bad luck ? Has someone else find luck behavior strange in 3.14 ?

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

Are you sure your luck is still up in all of your provinces? Scales reportedly disappear strangely...

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

I have to concur with the OP. It may be my imagination, but since the last patch luck doesn't seem what it used to be. I sometimes like to play Pangaea with 3 turmoil 3 luck, where I depend on the income from good events to fill in my armies of freespawn and summoned troops (gotten with all the gems).

Since the patch, I RARELY get income events, and have NEVER gotten the 3k+magic item event. I still get a fair amount of gems, and it seems like the 'zealous followers' event happens more often. And yes, it seems like I get fewer events. Not only since 3.14 but even since 3.10.

Then again, we are talking about something that happens by chance, so it is hard to say for sure. But I can't help but indulge a feeling that luck has been nerfed.

but then again, when you can go 3 turmoil 3 luck and come out ahead of 3 order 3 misfortune; I suppose it maybe needed to be nerfed. It does, however, make turmoil-luck scales something I just can't see taking anymore though.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

I had the impression that under 3.14 the misfortune events are more mean then before.

It's probably just impressions.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

My scales look normal.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

I agree with Twain luck does seem nerfed.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

My impression of 3.14:

Misfortune does seem much worse than last patch. I the one MP game where I am taking misfortune, I have had a horrible event every turn, including one province being repeatably attacked by indie knights. I'm posting a defensive force there for when it happens again.

As far as Luck, I don't know. I have several luck games going, and have been getting very good events, including the 3000 gold + magic item event in one.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

Or has it been modified, so you need order to get the money making events?

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

Yup yup, unluck is much worse now.
I NEVER take unluck 3 anymore - at least one indie attack per turn is guaranteed, when 20+ provinces it becomes 2-3.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

Luck/misfortune has not been changed. I something has happened it is probably a secondary result from a fixed bug and WAD.

Edit: unless there is now too many positive events that are restricted to a specific nation.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

I haven't noticed anything like that. But I still get way too many bad events with Luck 3...

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

May the way restrictions work makes events in general rarer for some nations (ie : when a restricted event is rolled it counts in the max number of event per turn even if not hapening for this nation ?) ? I find really strange to regularly have less than 3 events a turn with more than 20 provinces in my luck 3 / turmoil 2 dominion.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

> when a restricted event is rolled it counts in the max number of event per turn even if not hapening for this nation ?

No, more like: check event - impossible - check event - impossible - ... - give up after 1000 rolls.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

Do you mean when a good event is rolled, if it is nation specific, it's discarded and not replaced? If it still counts against the limit of events per nation per turn, it could explain things.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

Test 1, more to come:
EDIT: This was done in Silent Seas, and by giving both nations some starting provinces.

<font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre>
dom 6 order 3 prod 1 magic 1
MA Man turn 1 turn 10 turn 20 turn 30
treasury 400 7400 16000 24000
income 820 813 900 900
upkeep 18 18 18 18
gems 0 1 1 1

notes
got 1 free temple before turn 10


dom 6 luck 3 prod 1 magic 1
MA Ulm turn 1 turn 10 turn 20 turn 30
treasury 400 6900 15000 25000
income 700 700 780 444
upkeep 14 36 62 80
gems 0 20 41 89

notes
Sometime between turns 20 and 30, Bogus attacked Ulm's capital. </pre><hr />

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

Test 2, more to come:
EDIT: This was done in Orania, by giving all nations 9 starting provinces.

<font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre>
dom 6 Luck 3
MA Arcos turn 1 turn 10 turn 20 turn 30
treasury 400 9800 21000 30000
income 1080 1040 950 780
upkeep 58 58 120 137
gems 0 12 22 42

notes
Had just 6 provinces in the end. One rebellion, one vampire
attack, not sure what the last one did. No plagues in the
capital, income lost was due to province loss.
Had received Whip of Command (constr 4) by turn 20.


dom 6 Order 3
MA Mari turn 1 turn 10 turn 20 turn 30
treasury 400 9600 20000 31000
income 1000 1065 1088 1144
upkeep 14 14 14 14
gems 0 0 0 5

dom 6 Order 3 Luck 1
MA Agartha turn 1 turn 10 turn 20 turn 30
treasury 400 12000 24000 36000
income 1230 1190 1280 1322
upkeep 18 18 18 18
gems 0 0 0 5

Notes:
Started with more farmlands, and an arena site (+25 gp).
If the terrain gave +200 gp/turn, it would've netted 6000 gp by turn 30.

dom 6 Luck 3 Misfortune 1
MA Pangaea turn 1 turn 10 turn 20 turn 30
treasury 400 9700 20000 33000
income 1050 926 1037 996
upkeep 24 35 72 116
gems 0 15 37 82

Notes:
Had just 8 provinces in the end. I spied troglodytes and
militia in one province; if that was the province lost it
would've been The Deepest Cave event and +1 earth/turn
sometime between turns 20 and 30.
Had received Fire Brand (constr 4) by turn 20, and Moon Blade (Constr 6)
by turn 30.
</pre><hr />

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

Endoperez:

I guess you should make a custom map with equal provinces... and you forgot about Order 3 Luck 3. Also dominion spread is important...

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

What were Pan's scales? Luck 3 Turmoil 1?

I dunno about the trogs, you can get them without the deepest cave, especially with turmoil scales.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

Final test, I won't bother writing everything out.

Late Age
Arcos, Order 3 Misf 2 Magic 3:
turn 1: 400, +961/turn
turn 30: 27k, +920/turn, 7 gems

Man, Order 3 Luck 3 Drain 3
turn 1: 400, +959/turn
turn 30: 30k, +1064/turn, 55 gems
got Ice Sword (constr 0), Blood Stone (constr 4)

Tien Chi, Order 3 Growth 2 Misfortune 2 Magic 1
turn 1: 400, +1200/turn
turn 30: 38k, +1400/turn, 19 gems
note how much initial placement matters

Agartha, Or 1 Death 1 Luck 3 Magic 1
turn 1: 400, +900/turn
turn 30: 26k, +890/turn, 96 gems
got Owl Quill, Ring of Fire (both constr 2), again note how much initial placement matters



I did notice that during the first ten or so turns, the scales didn't seem to matter as much. I think if there's something wrong, it's just due to the scale spread bug screwing with the result.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

I think you would need to test thousands of turns to make it useful. In one game with Order 3 Luck 3 I got treelord's staff, 2 clams, few more items, also vampire count, barbarians. All in less than 30 turns.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

I don't want to test thousands of turns, but I did test (10 nations x 30 turns ==) 300. If you'd like to do more complete tests, go on!

I only tested the amount of gold and gems, and later items, you get with different scales. It seems that luck gives about as much gold and much more gems in the long run, if you manage to conquer as much as your Order neighbours.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

No. The event is replaced 1000 times. If it still hasn't found an event after 1000 tries it is discarded.

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

I've made some SP tests games and find nothing special, I'm probably just unlucky in this game (sad : events rarefaction happens to me just in a MP http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif ).

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

Are you sure about that? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

Re: Has luck been accidentally nerfed...
 

Oh, good catch. I think that was Luck 3/Turmoil 1, as opposed to the Order 3/Misfortune 1.