AI Helper Builds
 

It's possible, in SP games, to set all your opponents on "Human" for the first round, and then go in and set up their Pretenders/scales/etc. You can even play the first round for them, and then reset them all to "Computer" and allow the AI to carry on from there. I've noticed recently that there's been a lot of requests (even more than usual) for ways to improve SP difficulty. This seems to be one of the most common solutions, but it's also one of the least accessible, especially for people who are new to the game (or like me, aren't necessarily that strategically adept in the first place).

We've had a few threads about this before, but I was wondering-for those of you who have given this any thought-what your suggestions are for a starting Pretender build for each of the nations. Include what to do for the first round, and strategies for the various mod nations, if you'd like.

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

You should note that when you set players to AI, they will be controlled by the normal AI and there's no way to adjust the difficulty, AFAIK.

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

However, "difficulty" setting does not affect AI behavior- it instead gives the AI bonus creation points, gold, research, etc. A well-designed pretender might more than make up the difference.

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

Agreed with Ewierl.. it would even be nicer if you could give them more points though to compensate should be possible.. I guess you could make a mod to give all players more points and then just not use them ?

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

You can set AI gods _and_ put them on Impossible, via map commands. Unfortunately I pretty much channel my tech poking with dominions on to the multiplayer side, and so haven't invested any time in this, but I know it can be done, and I think it's reasonably easy too. Try the mapping manual (in dominions3/doc).

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

Fixing the scales manually will NOT even out the difference between normal and impossible AI. The bonus it gets to gold, gems, production; these are greater than the difference between order3 and turmoil3 and so on. Besides which the AI on impossible gets extra points at pretender creation and is therefore more likely to have positive scales anyway.

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

The fix to this would be of course to allow you to set the difficulty of the AI when you turn to AI control. That would go a long way toward making SP more challenging.

Could we expect to see this improvement in a patch sometime soon?

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

This is 100% accurate. I have found that the AI does better (most of the time) on impossible settings than making edited pretenders and scales, even cheating magic and scales. The time required to set a game using map editing of cheated magic and scales then Human start and switching to AI is fairly substantial, and not worth it in my opinion.

Besides, the AI on impossible presents adequate challenge for me. If I need a more substantial challenge I'll try and convince the wife that playing Dom3 is a good use of my spare time and that there is no down side to drinking beer.

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

I've never played with it, but I think what llamabeast was saying, is that you can start with Impossible AIs but use map commands to change both the scales and the actual pretender.

Thus they still get the Impossible AI bonuses and intelligent design.

I've never tried, because I agree that impossible AIs provide sufficient challenge in the early/mid game and the micromanagement makes me give up before the late game anyway.

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

I agree... this works the best for providing a more powerful AI opponent. As mentioned in a different thread it's best if the AI pretenders are immobile or a size 2 otherwise each of them will blindly send their pretenders into the arena death match.

The arena death match could actually be a very fun and interesting event if the prize was improved to provide the winner with gold and gems based on the current game turn. An improved arena prize would increase the interest of all human participants to send a good challenger.

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

Hmm I'd settle for mighty then.. impossible is hard to beat without exploiting every weakness instead of just playing

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

I help the AI opponents which are far away on my maps by providing them highly equipped SCs, highly equipped assassins, extra gems, immobile powerful spellcasters, extra forts and magic sites.
The end result provides great large battles.

The game still bumps into the commander and unit limitation even without LA Ry'leh and LA Ermor for maps of 650 provinces or more. So I suggest provinces of 600 or less at this time.

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

So...all debate over the relative merits of the AI settings aside...does anybody have any actual Pretender builds they'd like to suggest?

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

This depends on what type of enemy pretender you wish to encounter and what type of enemy globals (enemy blesses rarely play any strategy value for the AI) . Most AI nations usually have a tough time matching research with the human opponent so the sage pretender could pay off nicely. The ghost king is usually a small enough size to be ignored for the arena fights, yet tough enough to be strong in battle. The immobile pretenders are good and strong plus safe from the arena match.

I also recommend placing useful equipment on the AI pretenders as well.

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

Thanks NT Jedi. That's a good start. Avoiding or dealing with Arena challenges is definitely an important consideration.

I don't know how feasable it would be to add useful equipment, without modding, because most of the useful equipment out there takes research in construction. Maybe if people don't mind sitting on their nations for the first year while they play the AI side? That might actually be worth it, in longer SP games.

What I'm really after with this thread is how you would use the starting points to build specific Pretenders for the AI to use though. Like, how you'd deligate points/magic/scales to a Cyclops or a Scorpion King for Abyssia, for instance. In order that someone reading this thread could use it as a reference for quickly building Pretenders for an SP game, in order to add to the SP challenge. So, which Pretenders work best with which AI nations? You can divide suggestions into different categories, like which Immobile, which SC, etc. so that players can mix and match what type of Pretenders they want to see that AI fielding.

P.S. I wish there were a way to mod the game so that Pretenders couldn't participate in Arena combats.

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

Well, a powerful immobile pretender should have astral. I remember fighting a Sphinx with 9 Astral, a little nature, and high dominion. The AI scripted Body Ethereal, Luck, Personal Regeneration and then spammed Paralyze. Almost impossible for conventional troops to defeat due to 1500+ hit points and huge regeneration. Plus the added bonus of the capital always having high dominion and the inability of the pretender to get itself killed by doing stupid things.

Since Body Ethereal and Luck are spells that the AI uses a lot, Astral is a good choice for them.

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

There, that's exactly what I want. You've got the specific chassis, the areas of magic, and why. If you could just come up with min/max specifics, that'd be awesome.


I'd like to have atleast 1 separate Pretender build per nation, if possible, so that not every nation is led by a Sphinx, but we're definitely making progress. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

Can Sphinx get regeneration? He is lifeless so I think regeneration will not work on him.

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

Foodstamp is correct. Lifeless do not benefit from regeneration.

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

You broke my imaginary pretender!

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

You're not the first one to think this would be useful.

Gandalf created a set of starter build pretenders for each nation for tutorial/practice game purposes. See the history of his trial here, go to Starter Files:
http://www.dom2minions.com/index.html

I was thinking bigger in my proposal (2 years ago) that never went anywhere. I still think an online repository of pretender builds would be great, and you could have it pick some at random and download for use in your SP games. Here is the old dom2 thread where I tried to stir up interest.

Sill

What spells does the AI favor?
 

What other useful spells does the AI use often?

Re: AI Helper Builds
 

I completely agree... there's nothing more painful then watching 5 or more AI opponents all send their pretenders into the arena death match.

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

Re: What spells does the AI favor?
 

Air: The AI has access to decent evocations like Orb Lightning. They can also use Mirror Image and Mistform effectively.

Blood: Summon Imps, but don't trust the AI to keep slaves around in a responsible manner.

Death: Frighten and Terror, skelly spam, Ghost Grip, Wither Bones and Dust to Dust.

Earth: ...Flying Shards? Nothing useful comes to mind.
Fire: Fire Flies. Same problem as earth.

Nature: Vine Arrow, sometimes buffs like Barkskin and Personl Regeneration nothing really useful comes to mind.

Water: The only spell I can think of is the dehydration spell. Sailor's Death? Or maybe Dessication. Nothing worth casting.

----

I think the AI grimoire should just have more spells. I wouldn't mind seeing enemy mages using magma bolts and whatnot. Disintegrate and Pillar of Fire might be a bit over the top, but giving them most spells up to ~level 5 would serve to boost the AI experience.

Re: What spells does the AI favor?
 

One devestating water spell the AI uses frequently (a global actually) is Lure of the Deep.

Re: What spells does the AI favor?
 

I agree exactly... spells like disintegrate and pillar of fire have low path requirements with powerful results and should not be added. Powerful spells with high path requirements should be added to the AI grimoire as this will not change current game experiences and only help us map makers.

Re: What spells does the AI favor?
 

I know for a fact that the first two globals the AI casts are usually Gift of Health (1) and Mother of Oaks.

Re: What spells does the AI favor?
 

The AI will also use Curse like a mutha. Enough that I avoid lizardman-held territories for as long as possible. Decay and Shadow Bolt also seem to be popular.

Re: What spells does the AI favor?
 

I remember the AI being smart enough to use Shadow Blast and Terror on my large armies.