Shamblers
 

30 gold, 1 resource.

Yet they cannot even defeat an equal amount of tritons. About 75% of the time they're thrown back with near total losses. Abominable.

They have 6 protection, 9 defense, 10 attack. Having 22 hps and 15 strength doesn't really mean anything when they die in droves and can't hit anything.

I hate Shamblers. They're like the cavemen of the deeps. Never, ever spending gold on them again.

Re: Shamblers
 

When I use them I always mix them with smaller units in the same squad. They are also pretty good as flankers.

Re: Shamblers
 

They're not good at anything, just face it! Mix them why? So you have a big fat target in the square so enemies won't attack your 10 gold infantry instead? Gah.

They're 11 movement, how is that good flanking? Well, at least they get to face cavalry out there that will kill them in one shot with a lance with their pathetic defense and protection, and never be able to hit at 14+ defense. Good riddance!

Oh... I mean, they're actually awesome! You should definitely sink some gold into them and use them against me. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

Re: Shamblers
 

Shamblers are almost always a poor investment... unless they are the only amphibious troops you can recruit. If that is the case, and you need to take a water province, you recruit them en masse. As many as you can command. Very expensive, but en masse, they will take out most water indies. It helps if you can send a priest with them to keep up their morale.

Re: Shamblers
 

Maybe I lied a little but they are pretty good as flankers underwater when you don't have anything better.

Re: Shamblers
 

Ling, that's the ticket right there. But it's pretty darn sad when you wish you could recruit net-throwing Ichtyids instead for 10 gold and 3 resources. I mean, this is a 30! gold unit we're talking about.

Re: Shamblers
 

Shamblers are good if you're a land nation with a lot of gold, want to start conquering the sea and have to build up a big force very fast.

Some protection spell support helps.

Re: Shamblers
 

I used Shamblers recently against R'lyeh, as Oceania. I use Knights of the Deep for fighting. But I need more weight to siege Rlyeh dark fortresses.

I can spend 30 gold on 3 Knife Tridents for 3 siege reduction, or 30 gold on 1 Shambler for 2 siege reduction. But 3 Knife Tridents are going to be stuck underwater costing me money forever. At least the Shamblers will do me some good out of the water. At worst, at least they'll die!

And I've got sloth-3, so resources are always critical. It's nice to be able to buy 60 points of siege reduction without having to drag it one province at a time from a faraway fort. I'm looking at pretty much only 30 points average of resources in unforted provinces.

By the way, if you're planning on invading R'lyeh underwater, Ichtyids are not a good plan. With 8 MR they will just get destroyed.


Above ground, I should try Shamblers out versus tramplers sometime. Defense 9 is a base 38% chance of taking just 1 damage, and Shamblers don't fatigue much. There's only 2 Shamblers per square to trample. They'll usually survive the first 20-point damage trample from a size-6 trampler. And 2 Shamblers is 4 15-damage attacks against one elephant.

... testing ... testing ...

I did some testing, and you pretty much need double the gold in elephants, then the Shamblers win. I tested with a big blob of 18 Elephants versus a big blob of 120 Shamblers. Guess I won't be winning any economics prizes. Still, a bunch of Shamblers up front could slow/disperse elephants somewhat, and Shamblers might fare better versus Troglodytes or Minotaurs.

Re: Shamblers
 

Trogs are much more dangerous than elephants against almost anything.

But your point is well taken about the sieges, and amphibious nature of Shamblers. You can definitely build up a very nice siege force in no time with Shamblers, and then throw them away against some average PD when you don't need them anymore.

Re: Shamblers
 

Okay, so I had to go test. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Shamblers are even better against Trogs than they are against Elephants. With even gold costs, Shamblers actually won 2 out of 5 battles (120 Shamblers against 72 Troglodytes).

Re: Shamblers
 

Oh come on, 5 trials, that's practically a case study. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

Re: Shamblers
 

Not every troop has to be cost-effective, sometimes they just live there for flavour. Shamblers are old and they dont want to fight, so they are hard to enroll (unless its a thrall, admittedly). Seems logical.
And occasionally they are even useful. Shamblers are ok if you ask me. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Shamblers
 

Shamblers at 30 gold suck but at 1 resource they rock. In almost every case I have come across from dom2 to now I can build a force capable of taking an indy water province in 1-2 turns with them as compared to uhh 3-6 turns with ichtyids.

Now, or soon after is better almost all the time

Again, yeah the 30 gold sucks but "sometimes" you just gotta get in there right now. Admittedly in MP games I never use them. Either I set myself up to Really Play in the water or I try to be meticulous with my diplomacy towards the water nations.

If I have a ginormous pile of gold then they also make rapidly formed speed bumps but are perhaps poor for that due to the 75% of total hp's lost routing rules. I am not one of those folks who scoffs at impossible AI though so grain of salt applies.

Re: Shamblers
 

As someone has stated, not every unit is supposed to be cost-effective, but the capability of rapidly-spam is also of value.

Shamblers can be useful if you are planing a blitz-landing for EA_Oceanaia. Some guides have also covered such an idea for MA_Atlantis. Ichtyids can not fit that strategy well, since they will take you about 3 times longer time for the recruitment.

Btw. I personally would also suggest considering a little discount for them. IMO, Atlantis is accepted to be the weakest underwater races, which can also benefit from it.

Re: Shamblers
 

I use shamblers when i need troops with darkvision, and i try to buff them with spells.

Re: Shamblers
 

Shamblers were key in my success in Evermore with Atlantis. Read my guide to MA Atlantis for more details, but short story is I was pressing an economic advantage and flooded R'yleh with shamblers. The hitpoints and claw attack were great against the low defense, low protection troops R'yleh frontlines, the numbers I was able to recruit them in due to their resource cost was great vs the mind blasters, and the fact that I could recruit from 4-5 provinces right on our border allowed me to hit him everywhere at once. Once R'yleh fell I used my swarms of amphibious troops to hit 11 provinces of Caelum in a sneak attack, capturing close to 20 of their provinces by the second turn of the war.

Cost effective is a relative term.

Re: Shamblers
 

Oh, forgot to mention, the reason they were so effective against Caelum was...drumroll....high hitpoints and low armor are the least effective thing to use AN lightning and cold attacks on and I sieged everything so fast he couldn't field (or afford) many archers.

Re: Shamblers
 

I used them in the Big Game as well against Lanka who typically had darkness up in battles. When i was using them, i buffed them with fog warriors, mass protection, and mass regeneration.