How do I kill a water queen with a medusa shield?
 

Re: What are all the ways to increase attack skill
 

Just stack attacks, 2x sword of swiftness, horned helm, stone bird and quickness will drop his defense by 2 for each attack, so after the first quickened round of swings he'll have -16 defense skill from the incoming attacks. (Luck might mitigate this somewhat, not sure if a luck'd attack counts for defense penalty). Plus quickness gives you +3 attack skill to boot.

Re: What are all the ways to increase attack skill
 

Oh shoot... well the problem is that this thing I'm trying to kill has 64 hitpoints and regenerates half of it every battle round, so one or two hits don't do a thing.

Oh oh! How about panic or terror? This water queen has 30 morale. How many panics or terrors will it take to route her?

Re: What are all the ways to increase attack skill
 

Then use 2 SCs or hit her with mages....

Re: What are all the ways to increase attack skill
 

Or you can forge the Harvest Blade. It is an AOE weapon, so defense is ignored. Don't give it to anything you want to cast spells with, since it auto-berserks you like a lycanthrope amulet.

If the SC is not fire or frost immune and has low HP, you can just whack it with a Fire/Frost brand.

Can you teleport or trapeze a bunch of mages and blast it? Sometimes that's easier.

Edit:

Okay, forget all that stuff. Just give an SC an Eye Shield. When the Queen goes blind, her defense will drop to zero.

Re: What are all the ways to increase attack skill
 

Did some tests: Poison Golem with two eye shields will die attacking the water queen with medusa shield.

Re: What are all the ways to increase attack skill
 

Just use insti-kill. Soul Slay, Disintegrate, Moon Blade. Stuff like that

Re: What are all the ways to increase attack skill
 

How hard is it to get through 23 magic resistance with 3, 2, or 1 penetration and 4 nature casting charm?

Re: What are all the ways to increase attack skill
 

Another test: Purposely blinded a poison golem with two eyes of aiming. Blindess does not protect you against Medusa shield. Is this a bug? However, naturally blind units are protected.

Re: What are all the ways to increase attack skill
 

Are they? We had a thread just the other day where someone said they weren't - only beings with the hidden 'stone' tag were.

Re: What are all the ways to increase attack skill
 

Yeah, I just did the test. Fire elementals didn't get affected by the water queen. Water queen died from fire elementals. It's stupid if a medusa shield kills constructs. Poison golem should be immune.

Re: What are all the ways to increase attack skill
 

Another test: Sandals of the Crane + Spirit helm

Basically this combination will cause the poison golem to teleport infinitely and cast lightning bolt infinitely.

However, the golem routed, even with 50 morale. What the hell?

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Auto rout.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Another test: Gargoyles - get killed from the medusa shield.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Another test: lvl2 astral mage paralyzed it. Wow... how did it get past 23 resistance so easily?

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Blindfighters get killed by the Aegis, I just tested it. That's interesting that fire elementals are immune.

There is a recent thread about petrification somewhere.

Edit: I just ran a test with Fire Elementals (unit #599). They got petrified by a 100%FR unit wielding the Aegis.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Ok, I'll let you if my water-queen killing plan will work. For now, I don't want to reveal my plan.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

She's not immune to fire OR lightning. Incinerate deals 18+ points of AN damage, so three incinerates/turn should be enough as long as the mages have decent precision. Three hits from Lightning Bolt/turn or two hits from Thunderstrike/turn would also work. Thunderstrike would also deal fatigue damage, which lowers her defence (-1 defence/10 points of fatigue, more detail on pg 76).

Pg 5 of the manual gives details about chances of beating difficult rolls. Base penetration 10 (sor S2 caster casting Paralyze) against mag res 20 (no S) is -10 in the table, or 3% chance. For S4 caster (base penetration 14), the chance would be 6% already.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Endo, the problem is that the queen is running around where there are no lightning or fire mages! Plus, she has luck. It seems that luck makes anything only work half the time. So you really need a small army of fire or lightning mages to kill it. Plus, she regenerates 36 hp per turn... very hard to kill.

If you regenerate 36 hp per turn and have 64hp, i'm pretty sure you need to do 64 damage PLUS 36 to kill the queen at full HP. That's 100 damage needed to kill her at full HP.

Edit: How do you know S3 is +4 penetration?

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Is two rune smashers more effective than one? Or does penetration not stack?

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Penetration stacks, but two items of the same kind don't, so two rune smashers doesn't help you out. +5 penetration is quite easy to reach though, with rune smasher, eye of the void & spell focus. That would give you 14% chance of a clean kill.

In general I would be very afraid to send out the gem investment such a queen represents with only 20MR. Very afraid.

Re: What are all the ways to increase attack skill
 

Argitoth,

Have a good read of the magic resistance section of the manual. There a lot of details that are critical. I learned a lot last night doing just this. I am on the other side of the problem, as I have SC who keep getting knocked out by astral spells like paralyze and, especially enslave mind. I am trying to boost my MR, but knowing how to penetrate it is closely linked.

Rune smasher is not the only item to boost penetration and boosting the levels of the caster is also important. If you have communion capability, you should really explore that, as that can really boost your penetration.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

The one I'm up against actually has 23 MR

At the top of my head to boost magic resistance:

Rainbow Armor
Amulate of Magic Resistance
Lead Shield
Starshine Skullcap
Amulate of Luck (doesn't raise MR obviously, but helps)


That's at least +17 magic resistance with all those items after you cast resist magic on the battle field. +13 if you don't cast it.

Edit: Also Astral Bless Effect helps (+1 to +4 MR)

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Don't forget that the astral bless won't raise MR above 18 (I think 18).

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Try Petrification

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

There's no way any of your suggestions would work for the situation I'm in.

I said at the beginning of the thread that I have access to any item and any spell. YES! I DO! However, I never said I had access to any army, any mage setup, etc. There's VERY little chance to setup the perfect army and move on the right province that the queen moves to.

That is why I have my plan and I don't want to reveal it. Don't post any more suggestions, I'll let you know if my plan works in a day or two. I can't reveal it on the forum because I don't want Wazooking to find out.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

My 29MR water queen got killed by lucky Disintegrate recently. I wonder what was the chancce of striking it as it looked really buggy in the end of battle.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

There is no level of MR which makes a unit invulnerable to the single-target insti-kill/disable spells. As zeldor has found even high 20 MR is not enough to protect you. The problem is severely compounded by the fact that SCs are usually the only prime (size 6) candidate for the many enemy mages to target since those spells favor larger targets.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

I find really tough guys tend to go down to fatigue spamming. As far as fatigue goes Stellar cascades, heat aura, thunderstrike, pillar of fire etc. will circumvent the MR, defense, protection, and MR and regen doesn't help. Additionally fairies, manikins, etc. don't completely circumvent it, but work pretty well in numbers. She's got reinvig, but not that much, and once she's passed out most any half decent thug should be able to pound her into the ground. (just give him good MR). Presumably she's buffing herself a couple times and with that encumbrance she'll be more than halfway passed out before you do anything...

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Baalz, you don't understand just how impossible this situation is. Your suggestions on spells are great! That's IF I have an army of mages that I can move to the right spot at the right time.

Like I said, I currently have access to any spell and any item, but I don't have access to any army setup. Again, the medusa shield pretty much kills everything. No amount of manikins, vampires, fairy queens, or ghosts will take the queen down, they die before they deal damage.

No more suggestions, just wait till I reveal my strategy! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

- She is already horror marked. Spam more horrors. One of the Twin Spears can cast "Lesser Horror" in battle, Oath Rod of Kurgi gives more Horrors Marks. Combine with Quickness / Boots of Quickness for two lesser horrors per turn in battle.

- Sceptre of Corruption again coupled with Quickness. She has good regen, but not that many HPs.

- Gifts from Heaven.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Some of your suggestions would simply take a lot of testing. There's too many variables, too many unknowns for your suggestions to be valid, such as:

-Horrors might get killed from medusa shield
-Gift of heavens is too inaccurate
-Gift of heavens casters are hard to get in numbers
-Gift of heavens may not be casted after script is over

The only suggestion that I think may have a decent chance is the sceptre of corruption. However, for this situation, I don't actually have access to blood magic.

BUT LIKE I SAID! I don't need anymore suggestions! I'll reveal my plan after it has been executed.

EDIT: Lol, I just did a test with the sceptre of corruption. There's no way it would work. I bet a group of mages casting banefire would work though. However, the problems are pretty much exactly like the problems of Gift of Heavens.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Cast windguide or the like before casting gifts from heaven.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Argitoth, it is humorous to see you try to stop the inflow of good ideas.

I feel bad for your predicament so maybe people can help you throw your enemy off the trail by giving you some bad ideas...

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

I got it! Hire like 300 militia to attack her! Problem solved!

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Indeed that would be good. Also, I never send a mage anywhere without gouging out their eye for eye of aiming. It's defintely a good idea if you had a mage with air, earth, and astral.

(of course for my situation, I don't have a mage like that.)

Medusa shield will pose a problem for this idea.

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif Yep, I can't wait to reveal my plans after I kill the water queen. Everyone will be surprised... well not everyone. There's one suggestion in here so far that BARELY HINTS at my strategy.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

I'm sure you can mindhunt her with your astral mages. I built some nearly unbeatable SC (king of Banfire and Air Queen + Earth King) in a previous MP game, after 20 or so mindhunts they evaporated from the face of the earth.

And, how about blood spell life for a life? never tested this on a SC with MR of 20, but it's a very potent spell.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Combining both Pixas and Proxas axes of rulership should allow you to disarm the waterqueen.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

I don't understand this "I have access to any spells or items, but I don't have any armies", especially with the implied "she kills my armies, but my battle-mages aren't where she fights". Any items? Make twenty-something Rods of the Phoenix, Vision's Foes, Piercers, Black Bows of Botulf etc, keep an A2 mage in lab. Teleport the air mage to somewhere, and move magically armed commanders, where you think she's moving, and cast Wind Guide and let fly. If she didn't attack, instantly move the items elsewhere through your network of laboratories.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Dis-arm. Ha ha http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

leech, the most powerful spell in the game.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Oh yeah, Life for a Life as well.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Endo: I think serious consideration was lost in this thread a page or so ago.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Mind hunt it to death.

Wish it to a province with some nature mages and take it for yourself with charm spam.

Make a few thugs and give one of them that blood axe that causes a chest wound. Once it has been afflicted with a chest wound its just a matter of time until the fatigue piles up and it starts taking big hits.

Teleport a few mages on top of it and cast Paralyze/soul slay with some penetration items.

Not sure if death grip works underwater. But that is a great spell to take out lone SC's.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

http://shup.com/Shup/37135/waterqueen.png

http://shup.com/Shup/37133/living-flames.png

http://shup.com/Shup/37134/high-magus.png

And that is how you kill a unsuspecting water queen with a medusa shield without fire resistance.

Ritual: Teleport
Battle Script: (Phoenix Power)(Living Flames)(Living Flames)(Earth Power)(Living Flames)Cast Spells.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

There are many ways to kill that water queen... she should not have been traveling solo.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

You can continue to talk about all sorts of situations, all sorts of strategy, endlessly. But my strategy was the only way to gaurantee killing the water queen in my current situation.

For example, if the queen wasn't travelling solo, there would be complications for the enemy as well as for myself. It would be a totally different situation and require different strategies.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Then you probably shouldn't waste everyone's time by asking for suggestions.

Jazzepi

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Yes, maybe I shouldn't waste time sharing a brilliant way to take down solo supercombatants. Anyway, it was only after the first page of comments that I realized I would have to answer the question myself.

Jazzepi, this really isn't the place to be rude. I provided screenshots and explanations. That's not something people do everyday.

Re: How do I kill a water queen?
 

Argitoth:

You should have teleported second mage there with empty slots to grab some stuff she was carrying. Then resummon her, equip that and send her against previous owner.