New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

It would seem another glitch as popped up. After fighting the first battle and starting the next I've noticed I now have ghost crews attached. They appear in the unit lists and must be cycled though when playing although they DO NOT appear on the map or anyway effect play. Just thought you should know. I'll attach a turn and E my password word when I get home in a few hours. I'm not sure if my opponent has run into the same thing. Also this did NOT happen when I started the next battle in the WW2 version.

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

Here's the file, I'll PM the PW.

I also just noticed a truck in ghost mode. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/shock.gif

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

Hi,

You may PM to me the password and I will contact Andy.

cheers,

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

I am experiencing the same thing.

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

Ok - I see these crews (or rather don't).

1) Are you player 1 or 2 here?

2) An in battle save is not much use for debugging what happened here - do you have a save at the point where you were about to fix/upgrade (end turn of your previous game would be fine I think).

Cheers
Andy

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

Which battle number in the campaign is this?

both sides have these crew problems.

One side has, yet again, deployed "dead" vehicles on the map - as advised not to do. (You have to use deploy all with the versions you have at the m0oment - now fixed in the development code), or physically select the dead units from the list and then click on the map, as described earlier. don't do this!.

I'll need the end-of-turn move for player 1. It looks like player 1 has not had the points to fully repair, and the crews ownerships are getting mixed up, most likely.

But I'll need the save at the upgrade/repair point of P1 in order to fully debug this (and separate any crews that are valid bail-outs from your 3 turns of play in the sent save, from the crews of unrepaired units on both sides cores)

Chinese player - did you repair all units, or leave some unfixed.
Greek player - ditto?.

Andy

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

I will also need a "history" from each player of what exactly they did with thier cores in between battles.

As well as "did you leave units destroyed/damaged" :

- did you delete any core formations (if so - were any with damaged vehicles with crew out?)
- did you buy new core formations?
- did you upgrade any core troops (change type etc)?

It's likely a subtle little thing, as player 2 previously was not allowed to be core, and some small administrative routine is likely not tracking the P2 change for destroyed units & their crews for P2. My initial guess, anyway.

Now to find the offender, since the PBEM campaign code is pretty much 100% there, bar this one (which the playtesters did not catch unfortunately).

Andy

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

I left some unfinished, not enough points for repairs.

I did not delete any core formations.
I did not buy new core formations.
I did not upgrade any core troops.

Now that I can understand the problem it won't be a problem for me, although it is annoying to have to check every single unit if it has damage and how much before I deploy it since I can't possibly remember which one or more units I did not had the points to repair. Not game breaking though.

BTW, the deployed but already destroyed units, that get destroyed again, do they count for points in the current battle?

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

Sorry a little late getting back to you.

I'm player one.

This was between battles 1 and 2

I didn't leave any units unrepaired IIRC.

I deleted some core formations (yes there were bailed crews)
I replaced them (example replaced Helos with Recce Units)
I really did not upgrade anything replaced it was downgraded if anything due to cost.

Unfortunately Andy I have not been saving all the turns, maybe Wdll has.

I'll make sure I save the lead up turns etc as we move from battles 2 to 3.

Thanks for your efforts thus far.

Bob out.

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

Its OK - I managed to recreate part of the problem in a test game or 2.

Seems only to happen to player 2 crews - the problem being that when the crews are deleted on recombining, the core flag was not reset, but the active flag was set to null. Another routine was checking the core flag and the active flag, and letting them through on either being true - should have been a test on both flags true. So some surplus "crews" were appearing - depending on the data they happened to have when incorrectly deleted, they might show up on either side. Anyway - the problem seems fixed in the development EXE now (still testing).

Andy

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

As mentioned in another post - the damaged vehicles will no longer be deployable whatsoever, in the forthcoming EXE.

For now - don't use the "deploy all" or "auto deploy" on a human campaign core. Nor should you pick things directly off the formation list when deploying your forces.

If you have damaged units carried over in your core - the damage points on the cripples are credited to your opponent at end game as VP, as is normal. Thus being forced to "carry" damaged core helps your opponent.

Moral - protect your core troops! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

If damaged already, and they become destroyed (easier done with badly damaged cripples) then even more damage (VP) will be credited to your opponent. Plus they are in danger of having the crew destroyed thus losing some experience in those units.

Leave any such on the grey hexes at the rear of your deployment zone is best, should you have made the mistake of deploying them. They will then be removed from the map, like any other retreater/router.

As said - that problem is fixed in the new EXE.

Cheers
Andy

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

Something else, not directly related perhaps, but if I eject a crew from a vehicle and then that vehicle gets destroyed, will the opponent get VPs for this? (for example gets destroyed by artillery).

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

If you bail from a vehicle - the opponent will always get the damage points done to it as VP, which could be 1 point for a de-tracking.

But if the wandering crew are suddenly made dead, the vehicle is now considered fully destroyed for any VP purposes at game end. And for campaign core crew, they are going to be replaced with a less experienced newbie next battle.

If the crew are wandering about away from the damaged AFV, and an enemy occupies the same hex as the damaged unit, it is destroyed. Crew is then irrelevant (nil points), so if killed, it is only of consequence as regards campaign progress (it will become a newbie) - or for the killing unit as a kill point (aids experience gain), if it is itself core. Or, for any suppression to neighbours that its destruction adds. Or, if it is the formation leader, of course.

If you are thoroughly defeated (not a draw), any vehicles (and other crewed items like arty) with surviving crews away, even if alive - at end of game are considered dead for VP assignment, and are marked as destroyed. Even if only 1 point as a track hit. This is not the case for the winner, as he is considered to control the battlefield and so easier repair of wrecks on it. Recombining a damaged AFV or gun may be a good idea if you can, if you are likely to be marginally or totally defeated - or they will be considered lost to the enemy as he will have battlefield control. Always providing that those units are in somewhere reasonably safe to do so of course!.

Basically - the crew is the damaged AFV/gun, and so using bailed M1 (say) crew once rallied for "cheap expendable" scouts - is a false economy http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.



Cheers
Andy

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

Great, thanks http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

Glad you were able to track the problem and put in the fix for the next release. For now it's not a big problem, just something we thought you should be aware of.

Thanks again, Bob

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

I use the re-assign key a lot. Creating tiger teams, scout formations, ammo resupply to arty batteries, etc. Has this been tested? I know in a 'normal' campaign, those re-assignments come thru the repo-depot intact, will they cause 'ghosts' in the PBEM campaign?

Re: New Problem PBEM Camapaign \"Ghost Crews\"I
 

The normal reassignment should cause no problems.

Cheers
Andy