MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

OK not quite Chess but close to it. This is for those who have wished to challenge others to a game of Dominions with equal nations. This wipes out all of the nations in Era 1 (early age) and then replaces them with nations that are all matching except for flags and scoreboard colors. Same gods, same units, same magic sites, same heros, etc. So you an challenge your buddy to a game and call the game "Skill-n-Luck" (because the winner will claim it was all skill and the loser will claim its all luck).

Mega Vanilla NationsVer 0.00

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

The projecty is housed here for now...
http://www.dom3minions.com/~mmdom3/MegaVanilla/

The VanillaNation.txt is one of the nations printed out with some added notes.

The MVmod_maker.sh is a script I use to generate the dm file. So if anyone has a suggestion it will be really easy to generate a new version with the change in all of the nations involved.

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

Im still working on the magic sites. Id like to come up with 4 that gives equal amounts of each gem and some decent units. Something that provides for pursuing as many of the magic paths as possible for different strategies. All while still using only the units that are in the game. I want to avoid modding sites and units altho I might have to go with that.

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

I like this mod. When I've got a few less games going on, I might well put up a MP on llamaerver with it.

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

Why no militia? If ever there was a nation that would benefit from militia, it would have to be this one. You could maybe use flagellants as chaff instead but it would be nice if they could be made cheaper also to feel more chaff-like. Also, it seems like if you're going to have flagellants in a nation, the priesthood should be a little stronger to inspire that sort of faith in its followers. Another thing that could be interesting is if you add high priests for example, allow them to summon a small amount of flagellants each month.

I'm not entirely sure I like the idea of making druids the only non-cap only mage. They're fairly weak as far as mages go and if one player finds one or two good mage sites and no one else finds anything that interesting they could end up being much more powerful than anyone else. And with forts having such low admin the independants that a player finds could also have a very significant effect on how the game turns out. Unless you played on an NI map with the no mage site mod....

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

The druids were my idea of a "generic" independent version of a mage. 1 point in nature, plus 1 in priest. And stealth, leads 10. Seemed to cover some bases. There is the amazons of course but they are so obviously amazon. There are the shamans for the various poptype tribes which might work.

But as I said this is version 0.00 so feel free to suggest something else.

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

Well, probably something that's still fairly weak but slightly more diverse. An alchemist's paths don't look too bad... might be a bit weird making an alchemist the generic mage type I suppose. Augurs could work also. I would almost suggest more that there were several types of generic low level mages, so there was a little more diversity in national mage strength.

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

I guess there's got to be a choice here - either give access to lvl 1 in all paths at each castle, or have only a token researcher. If it's a token researcher, how about a unit with no paths and a sage bonus?

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

Hmmmm..... I might have to mod replacements.
Give everyone?

A) 8 mages and each has 1 in a magic type

but that shuts down some strategies that need combination magics.

B) mages with 3 randoms off of all magic magic types

But that brings luck back heavily into the game. Trying to get the combo for the spell or equipment vital to your strategy

C) create slightly different nations and have each one a slight lead in two magics.

That way they can select the nation they need. But then how many combinations is that? (Im terrible at math)

D) create 8 nations and have each get a mage with 1 in a specific magic and 2 randoms of any magic.

That allows for maybe getting 3 in the same magic. Not too bad. People can select the nation which boosts them toward their strategy. But are we then back to the original premise of Dominions? They still will go up against a nation who is balanced against them. Same strengths and weaknesses.

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

How about this?
16 nations with the same recruitable units and also
1 sage
1 minor mage with 2 in x magic
1 capital mage with 1 in x magic and 2 randoms
also 1 magic site that gives 1 in each gem (and a blood slave)

Each magic would exist twice. So 2 nature boosted nations, 2 astral boosted, etc etc. So if you wanted to EXACTLY match then you could. That way if your favorite strategy, spell, equipment needed nature you could take the green nation and if his needed astral he could take the white one. You would both be operating with exactly the same bonuses in your chosen magics.

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

That is not a bad solution, and would provide a lot more diversity than the original druid would. And then the game doesn't depend so much on finding good independant mages.

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

And if you were going to take a different solution, I would go with option B from your previous post.

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

Personally I'd say that if you are going to do it like this you should make ALL nation exactly the same. If you give all nations a very wide selection of troops and mages covering most of the standard "human" troop types that would be best IMHO. The mages would need to be without randoms IMHO to remove most possible luck factors, all would depend on the changes you make yourself and what you do with those in the game.

my choices would be slightly different from those in that txt file.

I'd say:
- a militia with some armour
- a light infantry (with about average armour for a light infantry)
- heavy infantry (with about average armour for a light infantry)
- Flagellant
- archer (no armour)
- crossbowman (least armour version)
- light cavalry (again av. armour)
- heavy cavalry (av armour)
- some sort of medium powered sacred cavalry (not TOO high in prot, preverably less than heavy cavalry, probably cap only)
(also you could remove both flaggalant and sacred cavalry if a bless strat becomes a must have, or make flaggelants cap only too.)

- scout
- assassin
- commander
- mounted commander
- priest
- a high priest
- a variety of level 2 mages in all paths

- 1 gem income in each gemtype for starting sites. It's more than average but not extremely powerfull in any one type. Generic site names "Castle" which produces 4 gem types and "Knights guild" which poduces the sacred cavalry and the other 4 gemtypes or something.

start with scout, commander, 15 archers and 15 light infantry.

Options would be
- recruitable barbarians
- recruitable longbow men (but would make archers obsolete so I'd go with one of the two)
- instead of 8 types of level 2 mage you could make them level 3, or level 2 in 2 paths (FIXED), or level 2 and level 1. (if you go this way I'd optimize the crossmatched paths for spell and forging options.

So concluding: keypoints for me for this "chess" game would be NO RANDOMS, TOTAL EQUALITY IN CHOICE, WIDE VARIETY OF CHOICES.

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

The problem with 2/2 or 2/1 as fixed settings, how many would you have to have to cover the possibilities. Isnt it something like 8*8?

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

You can give linked full-random, elemental-only and sorcery-only randoms.


7.12.1 #magicskill <path> <level>
Gives a magic skill to the active monster. The
path must be a number from Table 9 and level
should be a number from 1 to 10. If the monster
already has this magic skill then the old level will
be replaced by the new one, unless it is a
random skill.

End of Table 9:
50 Random
51 Elemental
52 Sorcery


Male mages could have
#magicskill 51 2
#magicskill 50 1

and female mages
#magicskill 52 2
#magicskill 50 1

1/32 chance of level 3 path, all path combinations are available and all mages can do something worthwhile.

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

No gandalf you'd not need to cover all..

I've got a new proposition for the mages

4 mages with 2/2 magic skills (together covering all paths, but of course not all combinations... which isn't a problem at all since you both play with the same options.. even if you'd only have a lever 3 earth mage and a level 3 water mage it would be fair.. but 4 mages covering all paths might be nicer.

AND 4 old age (except maybe for the nature mage)cap only mages with 3/3 with DIFFERENT matching paths. So all paths would end up teamed with 2 others.. which should cover most (not all but most) spells options and forge options since some combo's are very rare while others more common (and those should be used)

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

While this idea is not my I still feel that random paths would destroy some of the idea you've posted (but you'd know better since it's your idea :D)

Re: MegaVanilla "lets play chess" mod
 

No you are correct. Randoms was a compromise to not having to have too many mages. And creating my own was a compromise to not being able to come up with a set of magic sites that seemed to cover all options.

So you are back to talking about 8 mages, but not full coverage of options, in order to avoid randoms.

If I have to go to something that doesnt cover all options, then I figure I might as well go back to using pre-made units and magic sites since those came pretty close to it.

Oh and by the way, there is another mod like this recently created by DrPraetorious called Mirror Match
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=41453
which I feel has released me from needing to fill a niche for EXACTLY matched nations. And his is even CBM friendly.

(of course the biggest difference between his and mine is that his will get listed in the mod lists) :)