Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

Hey all,
I'm playing Eriu in the MP comfortzone and attacked an Abysia porvince at turn 15. I moved two armies to the province, one is from my captiol and the other is from another province. But when turn 16 is received, I found the captiol armies is patroling! Armies of the second province attack with themselves and get slaughted. My pretender is slained in the battle, so the result is quite annoying.:mad:

I know move command will be cancelled when the unit is attacked, but there is neither battle nor assassination in my captiol this turn.

A possible cause is Abysia tried to attack my captiol at the same turn. It halted my captiol force, then the move itself was cancelled too by my protender army. Anyway, I think it's not reasonable. If Abysia force is intercepted, how can it stop my captiol force? Is here anyone can explain the mechanism of move order for me? Thanks!

Re: Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

There is a bug where armies refuse to move even when they should, but we'd need a set of files from the turn before the move is supposed to happen and the turns where the move should have happened but didn't. A before and after snapshot, as it were. Otherwise it is impossible to pin down.

This would require making backup copies of every turn. Nobody has provided the needed files yet.

Re: Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

I have the turn files and .2h file of Eriu. But I don't know if llamaserver reserves the previous turn & 2h file of other nations...

Re: Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

That is odd (speaking as Abysia from that game).

Though i'm not sure how much more troops would have helped you, but clearly it wouldn't have hurt your chances.

I don't believe I had that army moving anywhere anyway, so it shouldn't have had anything to do with some strange bounce effect.

Re: Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

I see this bug fairly regularly (once a month?). Should I post my files next time? I generally just grunt in frustration and ignore it, but if JK still needs more data to solve it I will save the files next time. I always have before and after versions of each turn so I can see e.g. whether the province that I just lost had any interesting magic sites.

-Max

Re: Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

I'm doing backups of every turn for the games played on my servers. I think somebody even had the problem of non-moving armies in one of those games. AFAIK that's not enough, though, JK wants to have the error reproducible, that it happens for every hosting of the turn in the same way. This seems not to be possible, unless he'd start to save the random salt value that has been used for hosting the turn. Otherwise you can't expect to get the same hosting result at all.

Re: Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

Those files would be really helpful, Max.

Re: Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

Okay, I'll post the files next time it happens.

-Max

Re: Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

Hey, I get this error regularly in SP games. I have this huge Sauromatian army in Faerun adventure that absolutely refused to move to capture Fomoria capital for about 6-7 turns in a row!

The last turn it moved and I was mightily surprised that it finally did so. Note, that the army was not attacked in these said turns.

I don't backup SP games but next time I'll hit this I can raise the flag and send the files if needed.

Re: Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

Coincidentally enough, I just had this happen on your server. In the OO-Karan game, my Shinuyama army was ordered to attack the Pythium capital at least twice. The 1st time was in the orders that gave rise to turn 40 (my sneaking gem scout sneaked without the army and got caught by the patrollers - bummer). The other I'll have to check on a different computer and PM you, Ich.

I eventually ordered the army to just stay put, and, sure enough, the Pythian army showed up and we had our little party.

Even if "army bouncing" is working as intended, it makes no sense. If two armies head toward each other, itching for a fight, and they unexpectedly crash into each other - would you expect them to just have a cup of tea and go back home to their camp?

Re: Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

Thanks RonD, that saves me the hassle to use the search function to find a game where this happened and was reported. Please email me the province numbers where the armies were supposed to start and where they were ordered to attack, so that I can verify it.

Re: Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

Okay, see the attached file(s). Scenario2_backup is the prior turn, and you can see that a commander is ordered to move from Province 18 to 30 to engage an Ulmish army. If you examine Scenario2, which is the current turn, you'll see that the commander in question did nothing and was not actually involved in the battle that took place on turn 30. This is not the best example that I've seen of this bug--I wish I had one of the specimens where no opposing army is involved at all--but I hope it's helpful.

(I've included my ftherland, .2h, .trn, map and mod files, but I left out silentseas.tga because of course JK would already have it.)

-Max

Re: Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

When I re-run the turn for Scenario2_backup, I see a battle in 18 (Ulm invaded with one commander and units). I can see that wasn't the case the first time the turn was run.

What happens if you re-run Scenario2_backup, Max?

Re: Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

I re-runed the turn too. No battle occured in #18 and the commander moved normally. Maybe the bug relys on other player's action or some special factor like random events.

Re: Bug or WAD? Armies refuse to move
 

I haven't tried, but presumably I'd get a different outcome. (The random seed is not deterministic relative to prior turns.) That's what usually happens when you run a turn multiple times, anyway.

-Max