Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

this would be one of those nice to have things.

for research it would be great if the pool was liquid, so points could be assigned exactly (as is, it seems that each researcher has to be totally on one path or the other)

also, it would be great to have a 'lock out' feature on the research settings so that the amount of research in one path could be locked, and wouldn't change while the other paths were adjusted. If you want to fiddle with more than two paths, it is nigh impossible to get them all set where you actually want them.

of those two things, i'd rather see a lock out feature.
of course, some one's probably going to post and show me how there already is one.

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

If I'm right about what you're talking about, the pool is liquid. To test, start with an awake rainbow and split his research between 2 paths.

As the numbers get bigger, the interface makes it hard to split it exactly where you want, but with a few hundred rp being off by a couple is usually not an issue.

I would like the lock out feature, though it's rare I want to work on three paths.

What I think I'd really like, inspired by your post, would be an entirely different system for assigning research. An interface that would let you specify what levels of which paths you'd like to research in order. Rather than "18 more points to get to Constr 4, then the rest into Conj. Next turn I'll finish Conj 3, then work on Evocation", you'd say, "Research to Constr 4, then Conj 3, then Evoc 4" and your research would be allocated as needed.
This would also eliminate my most frustrating thing with research: Carefully adjust research levels to finish the current target and start the next, then remember I wanted to forge or cast something. Next turn, 4 points from finishing the level.

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

To fiddle with research levels, use "+" and "-" keys instead of clicking.

-Max

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

Eventually even "+" and "-" give you more than 1 point.

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

It's granular to a single percentage point, so once you break 100 RP you start losing a little bit of control, but really, it's less than 1% of your research for one turn, not something I'd want the devs to spend time addressing.

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

ok.

but i'd still like a lock out feature.

i like that automated contingency research idea from thejeff. it would cut down on micromanagement, and would prevent those "D'ohs" from when you forget to assign research for your next turn, or when you set your research but then assign different orders to mages who were researching.

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

seriously this is just not needed.. you usually should just want to research in 2 paths.. the one you are busy in and maybe the one you want after that if you'll be there with part of the points for next turn. There is no advantage in researching 2 at a time since then it'll just take you the same amount of turns but not getting some advantage in between.

In the rare case you need 3 paths you can usually get what you need even now with like 2 tries.

Maybe not needed is a bit harsh but there are about a zillion things they might do befor this IMHO

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

The ideal way to implement this dialog IMHO is simply to (somehow) let the user specify the order in which he wants to research the different schools. Voila, no twiddling about with awkward sliders or trying to remember how many points the next level costs etc, it would simply work.

Stretching my imagination, I can think of at least one reason why I would want to deviate from the straight approach of researching stuff sequentially, but it's pretty obscure :)

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

It's adequate as it is.

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

I wouldnt mind a way to specify what is next. Such as when Im only 20 points from getting 2nd lvl evocation. So that as soon as it level in evocation switch to conjuration without me having to nitpick the amount of points in each then remember to drop the points in evocation next turn.

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

you are all just lazy (except Sombre who voiced the same opionion just more compact)

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

Granted. But isnt that what is usually behind feature requests? :)

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

well if your catching up research in late game, it isn't unheard of to be able to be able to level up three or more paths in one turn. if you absolutely NEED a particular spell for a big battle in the next turn, then it is really important to have the lock out feature. otherwise you spend 15 minutes attempting to get right amount into each bar.

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

Later in the game (mid-game) I'm often finishing my current path, researching one more level in a different path, and also starting a new path.

So it takes 2 or 3 minutes of fiddling to optimize. Then I change the orders of my mages because I forgot to summon something or forge something, and I miss all my targets. :)

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

The suggestion of locking the RP set into magic paths is a really old one. That was one of the first things that I wished for when I've been playing Dom2, too. But it really makes no sense whatsoever to put points into more than two schools at a time, the first what you want researched right now and the second for leftover points that you plan to spend elsewhere after you reached that next level. Sometimes it's not really exact, but I think that you can always achieve to spend points up to +/- 1 point at least.

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

Yes it does make sense: when you only need to go up one level in that 2nd path, and your total research is higher than the incremental research needed to get that one level. It happens all the time to me, especially if I concentrate on just a couple paths for the early game.

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

That's a border case, but usually it can only be experienced when you have an enormous amount of RP from lots of mages and have neglected some schools before. In that case, it usually doesn't matter. But while it isn't easy, it's still possible to split up the RP well enough so that you can break the next level in multiple schools at the same time. It does require a little bit of fiddling around, and sometimes it involves spending more points into a school than you need and reducing them later on again, or even temporarily putting points into a school that you don't plan to research in the end. It feels like playing Towers of Hanoi or the Can't Stop game. We could make a competition out of it, who is able to spend the points the closest to the optimum? :) I'm willing to bet that you can get it up to +/- 2 RP with more than two schools at the same time, that's what I usually got out of it in MP gaming.

Being able to lock research for a school in the GUI would make all this fiddling around with the markers unnecessary, yes. But the suggestion isn't new and thus I have my doubts if it's going to get implemented.

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

A lock feature is exactly the kind of thing I'd expect of a ten+ programmer team, working on those big projects, like HOI for example. As we all know, dom3 is under the 'lone wolf programmer' curse, so it's a bit harsh to ask them features that are not even guaranteed in blockbusters.

As a conclusion, I'd say stop asking for lock option (frivolous), and let them add 3 new nations and 200 spells for the next patch (much needed indeed). They can't do everything, ya know ?

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

I agree, it's totally possible to still optimize the research levels (excepting the +-10 RP that you can't hit exactly). I can't remember off the top of my head, but it's something like, if you move the top slider down, the one below it goes up ... or something.

And sorry, by "all the time", I mean a couple times in the midgame almost every game, because I'm always neglecting a couple paths. :D

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

New nations don't usually require any programming (unless Kristoffer wants to add a new ability, like forestshape or population-eating).

Furthermore, if it would take ten men to make the change, Johan can ignore this discussion and do something else. If he thinks it wouldn't be too hard, he can add it in. This is a low-priority fix and probably boring as well, so I doubt he we'll see this. But then, who knows, Johan has been on a roll lately and fixed a lot of old bugs and weirdnesses, even improved the user interface.

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

I've ignored magic paths for a fair time, so that their research costs are far less than my total research, and grabbed 1 level in 2 paths in one turn with a third path for the spare RPs. It's a little clumsy sorting it out, but it's small enough that personally I wouldn't bother the devs when there's so much else that could be done instead.

Re: Liquid Research and a Lock out button
 

In considering requests it can be a factor worth noting that there is very little you can bother "the devs" with. They are pretty well divided in their work. So requests tend to be aimed at one dev or the other. Johan is the programmer, and Kristoffer does the content. So balancing the worth of requests needs to be feature against feature, and content against content, in order to make a point.