Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

Ok I got the bright idea to add in a few foxholes in the area of a militant base camp. Currently there are only 4 units purchased.

Great I though, that will do for foxholes. So I changed the battle from a meeting to an assualt and dug the 4 infantry units in. I move the 4 units out of the holes and great. Oh no not so great. The 4 units I removed are coded into the ground(dug in)

No matter where you move them they are still Dug in.

So much for that idea.

Question. If during the course of a battle with foxholes or entenchments, another unit not coded into the ground uses the foxhole/entrenched hex. Does that unit benefit in any way from the foxhole or entrenchment?

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

This could be wrong but
The foxhole is part of the unit & is placed in its start hex with it.
Thats why when you see a unit that has left its foxhole you see its foxhole to.
Using enemy foxholes trenches is quite possible, takes a turn to get the dug in status.
Very useful if defender has placed close to objectives as enter & throw smoke, when it clears welcome to WW1 as 2 dug in armies now duke it out. No idea if the morale boost I think you get for being in near a fortification applies if it belongs to the other side though.

Why not just place trenches if you do not want units to start in those positions? Also gives benefit of being able to move in them & retain protection. Drawback is they are visible from the off I suppose.
Would suggest buying guns first & having them dug in, as its a base the troops might still be in the barracks but the guns would most likely be emplaced.

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

It's node 000 of a campaign,no AUX units allowed.
The player will have an expanded starting area to include the
area where I wanted the foxholes.

Trenches don't seem right as base is supposed to be low key.
But the Pakistani's are coming to get you anyways.

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

Really? So your saying that a unit can occupy another units foxhole or entrenchment and become Dug In status?

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

Yes like I said its useful at times, "cheat" I have been known to use if I have APCs that are not up to much is deploy them as a second line of defence. If operating tanks becomes untenable probably due to arty pull them out & take up 2nd line positions evacuated by APCs. You have to be aware that if these APCs enter his LOS he will know the entrenchment locations, not done on purpose but have fooled a player into blitzing with arty there empty emplacements before as they engaged:)
When deploying on the defence taking into account what happens if the player takes over your fortifications should be a factor & making them a pre targeted arty hex is worth considering so can hit him before gets a chance to dig in. Once enters the hex he will be dug in at the start of his next turn. Bit unrealistic for vehicle maybe as will need to position but infantry are just taking over a hole in the ground.
Can use the same thing for your arty giving them a second emplaced zone to move to
Great fun sticking your MGs in his defences & pressing on if he has set next lot up in sight of.

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

Well concerning the APC/tank-in-foxhole thing, if we're talking about "infantry" foxholes mmm... yes it's a cheat. Infantry abandoning and reoccupying a foxhole or trenchline to avoid the arty barrage and then "man the defenses" to face the upcoming attack is not an unheard of tactic. It is difficult to implement, case sensitive (terrain and enemy's ability to coordinate his attack) and the risk is to give up, with little or no resistance, your defensive position if not properly executed.

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

I've used much the same tactic VS the AI many times.

In a meeting enguagement the AI will almost invariably shell the hell outta the first victory hex you capture, so I try to grab one as early as possible then evacuate the area letting the AI shell nothing and allow my counter battery to perhaps fire and also allow me to (hopefully) spot some of it's on-board artillery/mortar positions.

In situations where I have to defend I'll move screening units up so the AI encounters them before it locates my main (dug in) defensive positions and again it frequently blows the hell outta nothing.

Such tactics may work VS a live opponent, but would be much harder to implement.

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

Have never tried to get hull down status in an infantry foxhole with a vehicle as expect it not to work. Infantry & vehicles can gain dug in status in vehicle/gun emplacements. I dont take over enemy ones with vehicles either as they are probably set up to face me & besides the best defence against his arty is to keep mobile

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

Partly because its more fun than sitting there once you know where the main thrust is a counter attack or hit & run tactics verses any secondary force works well unless he is a canny opponent. Losses sight of his objective & diverts forces & arty to your roving force costing valuable time. If you can make it an inneffective force all units in the area can then head to bolster defences vs his main force or swing in on his flank head for the arty park if you have fast stuff.
Anything that diverts him drawing forces from main thrust & wasting time is worth its weight in gold as he will pay dearly later as time ticks away.
Takes a bit of practice but as said much more fun than just sitting there & carries its own risks.

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

Well I confirmed it, though I didn't beleive it. Ran a little test.

So If I just go ahead and place the fox holes, when the scenario actualy starts, the units used to make them won't be dug In anymore.

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

Are you sure? They will dig foxholes in their deploy hexes & be in them, you can occupy any foxhole trench but units dig them in start hexes. The likes of foxholes to take cover in during air arty strikes or whatever have to be represented with trenches.
So for a base for instance even if it has no defensive trenches could have air raid trenches.

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

According to the test scenario I have here, the unit maintains it's Dug In status but once you move the unit it goes away.

The ONLY foxholes present are the ones I made in ASSUALT mode.

The scenario is a meeting engagement.

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

So you use "cheats"?

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

Suggest you test it before progress any further by playing turn 1 as is to see where the foxholes actually are

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

Think I just said that ;)in a PBEM campaign where I will generally have transport if I am going to hide them so his armour does not pick them off may as well take advantage of there empalcements till its safe for them to join the fray.

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

The Units DO NOT make new foxholes on scenario start. And when I test it in the context of the campaign,the units are lined up along the back map wall just like they are supposed to be.
And they are not even dug in status. ANY unit can use the foxholes and become Dug In. Woot! Thats what I wanted in the first place. Keep in mind you can only create foxholes in Assualt mode. This battle is a meeting engagement.

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

I seem to recall once trying an experiment where I bought some units, deployed them, set to assault mode so they dug in, then saved the map - with foxholes.
Then reloaded the map and the foxholes were still present.

Might be worth an experiment for someone with more free time then I have at present.

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

Well Skirmisher looks like you have found something that might be handy switching back to engagement probably locks the foxholes or as Suhiir said the act of saving the map probably did it. You can have foxholes for them to head to but start them in the mess having tea & biscuits, good call.

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

Standard scenario design trick since SP came out, to get assault/defence items in a non-assault scenario. Nothing new.

See the GG, "Scenario Editor" about para 5, beginning "And we may as well take some time.."

Andy

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

That's exactly what I was trying to do too.
With the new capability to split crews from vehicles with air transports you can create a situation where a garrison force starts in the barracks and has to man it's positions and vehicles in response to an attack.

That's the basis of one of the "showcase" scenarios in the minicampaign I'm creating to introduce my USMC OOB revision.

Re: Dug In/Enchrenched Units Effect.
 

Yes I keep meaning to do a hit & run raid on arty park & HQ parked up for the night, time at the moment is the factor.