What is an 'archer'?
 

I'm trying to think of ways to mess with enemy tactical orders, and I thought it might be fun to have a commander who's almost immune to missiles being targeted by enemy fire. The thing is, if the enemy is set to 'Fire archers' then I need a way to attract their bolts. So, I started to wonder how the game determines which of the enemy's troops are archers. If I give a fire bolas to a commander, does that make him a viable target if he's closer than other archers? Does it have to be a 2-handed ranged weapon? Or, is it essentially impossible to make a commander the target for this order?

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

Got too many x-bow bolts coming your way of late?-)

Anyway, that's an interesting question I don't know an answer to. I'd like to add to it in case someone knows: What weapon is enough for an unit to be an archer? More specifically, javelins are ranged weapons. So are javelinists counted as archers?

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

Good question.

A trick that can work sometimes, btw, is setting archers to fire.. then not specifying a target. They pick a random guy and start firing at him. Sometimes that random guy is a mage or other vital and possibly no prot commander.

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

My impression, which may or may not be correct, is that anything with a ranged weapon is considered an archer, and the game picks targets within the allowed target group based on how many hitpoints of damage it expects to do (similar to spell targetting).

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

Anything with a ranged weapon is an archer.

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

Damn right! The sorcerers of Machaka officially declared that eclipse of the sun to be a "bad omen, possibly indicating the angering of the spirits," before being impaled by hundreds of bolts.

Continuing with the question, if something is set to Fire Cavalry or Fire Archers, then do they fire at the closest group or does it select randomly / based on expected damage?

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

My experience with archers is that they tend to go for the nearest unit that qualifies for their targetting orders. Thus small decoy units at the front often draw fire.

This makes them differ from spells, which almost invariably look for most damage. Trying to distract mages with small 5-strong units pretty much never works. Firstly spells with AoE more than one cannot maximise damage, secondly low-prec spells are likely to miss. Consequently, mages will drop them into big unit concentrations.

Also, bear in mind these sorts of things also make cavalry much less likely to be targetted by mages. There are 3 infantry per square, at about 10HP each = 30+ total. Cavalry only fit 2 per square, as almost none have 15 or more HP, so have a lower HP/square. Add to that, heavy cavalry are often better armoured making them even likely to take less damage, and also operate in smaller groups so low-precision spells are more likely to miss.

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

Another difference between enemy ranged attacks (archer fire) and enemy magic attacks is that the magic attacks retarget each combat round.

Once archers target an enemy combat group, they usually maintain that target until it is destroyed or has fled the battlefield.

So you can put a group of decoy shielded units up front, and enemy archers will continue to target them, even if your decoy does something like retreat to the rear (using Guard Commander). Sometimes the archers will miss a round of fire because they are trying to get back into range to shoot at your decoy group.

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

I'm pretty sure that there is no fancy targeting algorithm.

Fire Closest will target the closest, of course. Any other targeting selection will select an entirely random squad of the specified type. It tends to be harder to see than with melee orders, but they both function in the same way.

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

Followup question: what counts as "cavalry?" Do units have to be mounted to count, or is it on the basis of move (e.g., high move = cavalry), a charge attack or ???

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

It appears to me it goes after units with the mounted tag. It didn't seem to want to target centaurs, for instance.

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

ISTR (from the manual?) that it picks a random eligible from all those available and then targets its squad. So if there is a squad of 99 cavalry and another squad of 1 cavalry, 99% it will target the squad of 99.

The reason archer decoys work is because if there is a squad of 1 within range and a squad of 99 out of range, it will target the squad of 1 100% of the time instead of moving into range to shoot at the 99.

-Max

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

While we're at the issue, I swear to all local Gods that the single troll archer that shows up with Bogus' band has a "shoot commanders" order.

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

it does. hellbind heart him and see. its a commonly known exploit

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

I believe it's only considered an exploit to copy his orders to other commanders. But grabbing that archer and using his pre-set 'Fire Commnaders' orders just on that one unit is considered ok. At least that's how I've always viewed it. Although never captured him myself in a MP game to even attempt to use him.

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

give him an eye of aiming and visions foe or bow of botulf can make that one usit pretty nasty. but i've never seen anyone do it much less do it myself

Re: What is an 'archer'?
 

Yep, quite a few nice options available if you can get him :)