Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

Hi!

I don't know if this has been asked before (and I've looked through the HTML guides) but is there any way to change the number of Support Points you get in campaign battles?

I ask because I tend to prefer playing games with smaller numbers of units (and hence less core points). Generally, I go for something like a 500 point force consisting of one infantry company, plus a platoon or two of supporting arms (usually tanks and ATGs), in a 30x50 map.

Having a core force of 500 and having a support point of around 750 (for Meeting Engagements for instance) seems to skew the focus away from my Core Group, since I can buy an even bigger force of Aux units. And, from my understanding, the AI buys its units based on the formula (Actual Value of Core Force) + (Number of Support Points), so it kinda puts my company-level force at a disadvantage.

(Although I have tried adjusting the total build points the AI gets via the text file that was added two updates ago)

Also, this is also kind of a problem in Steel Panthers MBT too, since the prices of units have gone up a lot. It'd be nice if I can adjust the number of available support points in SPMBT upwards, especially since even a small company-sized force of mechn infantry can cost several thousand points - a lot more than the support totals.

Can we have a similar way of adjusting the Support Point totals? Even if it's via editting a text file?

Thanks

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

In WW2 all you have to do is not use all the support points, just spend 100 if thats what you want the AI force is based on your total force so the more you spend on support the bigger its force gets to match, I normaly dont buy any for meetings but have a larger core & buy air arty for attacks, ATGs & possibly some air arty for defend

On MBT dont quite understand now you seem to be asking to buy a bigger (better) support force than your core.

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

Ah, so if you don't spend support points the AI doesn't get it too. Gotcha.

In MBT I meant that the support point totals aren't enough even for small units. A mech infantry company for instance can often hit around 4,000 points as a Core force. Having only 750 or so support points is often disproportinately small compared to this

(Often enough for one set of arty tubes or a pair of helos, but that's it. Being able to buy more than that would be nice - i.e. throw in a platoon of recon troops to soak up fire)

BTW, are the first five battles in a campaign now automatically meeting engagements? Is there a way around this?

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

Ah, so if you don't spend support points the AI doesn't get it too. Gotcha.

In MBT I meant that the support point totals aren't enough even for small units. A mech infantry company for instance can often hit around 4,000 points as a Core force (especially around 2000+ if you play American units). Having only 750 or so support points is often disproportinately small compared to this

(Often enough for one set of arty tubes or a pair of helos, but that's it. Being able to buy more than that would be nice - i.e. throw in a platoon of recon troops to soak up fire)

BTW, are the first five battles in a campaign now automatically meeting engagements? Is there a way around this?

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

I would disagree & guessing here, for meetings 750 is the minimum but generaly its about 10-15% of your core total, more for advances etc I think. That sounds reasonable it is support & gives the flexibility of tailoring your force to the terrain/engagement type. Yes there are times you cant buy what you want but thats life rarely do you get the perfect force so you have to make do, if that means you buy 1 good helo 2 average ones or change the plan so be it.
If you find yourself regulary using/wanting the same stuff add it to your core.
Wanting more support points for sacrifical lambs, why? Suprised HQ gives you any support at all if you just send them to there deaths.

I think its the first 3 & yes would be nice if you could overide & choose the type. You could make more of a story out of it or base the next battle on the last outcome. Near enough given up campaigns because of this but tend to do the following if play one.
Set visibility low change turns to 2 & set all flags to me.
Dont bother deploying just press turn end 2 times & the battles over.
At the start of the 4th battle I now start the campaign so remember to fudge the dates if needed.

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

So far I haven't seen any value other than 750 for a meeting engagement. The value for Defense/Assault also seems fixed (500 for defense, 3000 for assault but my memory may be fuzzy).

If the support value is actually variable then I haven't seen it happen yet (maybe I've never met the threshold needed to make the game change the support values?)

Because US/Western units in 2020 to be used for front-end recon tend to be very expensive regardless? And one can't really avoid losing men to stuff like mines or RPG ambushes even with careful advances?

But by that time the Polish Campaign for my Polish company could already be finished ;_;

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

So what?
So your core loses some men big deal you are fighting for that country & they still count towards victory conditions.
in fact think about it logicaly
Bonus from being in the core.
1)They might improve if survive increasing there chances of doing so.
2)You always have spare repair points even on the hardest setting so it costs you nothing.
3)This gives you more support points available every battle.

As I said if you buy regulary put it in the core it should be there & stops you forgeting to buy it. I have seen all the arguments dont buy trucks ammo resupply etc in your core. Trucks are a waste when defending as have to hide them but an experienced truck driver dodges better meaning its passangers are more likely to survive being shot at so they are a good core unit if you use them in any risky situation. Plus a better chance to rally so you can unload rather than being shot at as it retreats & dies.

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

I've always added 1 set of ammo bunkers and 2 sets of ammo trucks to my core for the very reason you listed of increased survival.

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

Dude, not everyone plays your way. Stop trying to make everyone conform to your idea of fun. It's not useful.

What if you'd like to be leading a core US supporting allies who are bought via support points? You can't exactly buy allies using core points.

What if you're sentimental about your core troops and would like to try and get them to survive without expanding the core to a huge size?

Stop trying to justify when you haven't even answered my question yet at all. Is there a way to change support point totals? Does it change based on core size? Answer the damn question before waxing poetic about tangential topics about how I should play the game the way YOU bloody like.

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

For my MBT campaigns I generally do add some ammo sections as well as part of the company's organic resupply team, largely to resupply units with low ammo (ATGM teams in particular).

In WW2 I tend not to buy ammo trucks at all except for Defense missions. It's rare that you'll run out of bullets for a company-sized action, though there was one mission where my Polish Matildas were reloading while under fire from Italian tanks. Somehow the Italians had 60+ tanks coming after us. It was a whole fraking Armored Division!

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

I can definitely see that at the ATGM's of SPMBT - as for WW2, I do so as I tend to have mortars, on-board artillery, and quite a few engineers / snipers. I tend to have to reload the snipers more often than others. Having 1 set of Supply Bunkers, even at 200+ a set, has been well worth it to me. I've lost quite a few units to ammo trucks going up and them being adjacent. I've learned from that mistake but occasionally it does happen.

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

Thought I had in my second post when said support is about 10-15% of your core minimum 750 blah blah. So as far as I know you cant change it it varies based on core size & meeting type, is that clearer?

As you wanted more support points I then resugested putting stuff used regulary in your core & yes cant understand the need for lambs
In fact your support point total might go up to as your core has increased though did not mention that.
Then yes gave you some reasons why its not such a bad idea which you did not ask for as seemed anti doing so.

Dont get shirty but the answers in the question, you want your core to support the support.
A way to do it is buy lower quality allies say Russia supported by Poland & use there infantry having a mainly armoured core. You will never get enough support points to buy much of there armour but playing as a Tank Co you can buy a couple of Inf Co Scout sections or whatever.

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

From your second post:

"I would disagree & guessing here"

So are you sure about this now or not?

You know what? Never mind. I'll just try it out myself.

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

For company level actions I tend not to use a lot of artillery - I usually have around just 4 or 5 missons and the starting ammo is usually enough especially since I tend to go for a set of off-map tubes.

Snipers do tend to have an ammo problem in WW2 though.

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

I always try to start out with 1 set of field artillery and their transport. By the time I hit the french campaign, I'll be able to field 4 SiG's instead of 2 15cm guns and 2 trucks. Those SiG's are eventually converted into the rocket mounted halftracks down the line. More inaccurate in indirect fire but devastating when fired directly. Having vet ammo trucks and bunkers just sweetens that deal in that they don't flee at the first shell exploding in the distance. I've even wonder, though I doubt it's true, if vet ammo units restock other units faster. Would be nice if that were true.

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

Don't waste your core pt.s on them ammo units, support units are just as good.

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

They might resupply at the same max rate, but definately not just as good. Even a little H&I fire incoming will send support units scrambling, even if they are dug in. Veteran units will stick tight, esp. if dug in, and they rally easier, raising the practical resupply rate.


Matt

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

Same with trucks survive better rally so you can move to safety or unload. Besides for great service for your country you might become mechanised so switch them for HTs later on.

Re: Changing Support Point Totals in Campaigns
 

Suppressed ammo units do not supply as well, or do not supply at all. Immobile unit crews (ie bunkers, dumps, ammo carriers that have been immobilised) - may run for the rear.

Better morale may therefore make the difference to units under counter battery fire. But better still not to be under CB fire in the first place with units that can explode with the force of up to several 1000lb bombs beside your experienced arty.

Therefore - I prefer to buy ammo supply from support, and to resupply away from the firing line (drive SPA back to a replenishment line, or pick up mortar teams with a halftrack) and move to a new firing position when topped up.

It takes time for a mortar team to build up experience, and so become more responsive to fire requests. I did the "bad" thing and parked a komsolets by one of my teams the other day. It blew up due to incoming fascist fires, and wiped the expert mortar section alongside it. Now that particular team is back to 2.5 initial delay where the other in the platoon is at 1 point something ... GRR :mad:!

As to the initial query re support points: Use the button to use up excess build points as support points. (Game Guide -> Purchase Screen -> Use Repair Points).

I am on a most difficult setting campaign, with AI forces set to 120% and usually have around 6K points sloshing about in the repair pool, since my casualties are never massive. But I find the 1700 points or so I get for an advance is quite sufficient to buy 6 or so 107mm batteries, and a few BA-64 armour cars, cavalry scouts etc., so never use that option.

Andy