Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl. Complete. Wraithlord wins.
 

Hi,

Map Sharivar (Sombre ver. 1): "A beautiful Dom2 map by Sandra resized and updated by Sombre for Dom3 usage, with considerable help from lch. Shahrivar is a persian month that ends summer and opens autumn. Its name means Tempting Territory. There are a number of pre-discovered magic sites on the map, usually indicated graphically. There is room for only one underwater nation, so going for random races might crash the game. 180 provinces 12 of which are underwater."

At this point the game is open for both sign-up and discussion.

The following are the settings I had in mind. The ones I don't plan to change are in bold font:
Map: Map Sharivar (Sombre ver. 1)
Hosting Pace: First 15 turns every 24h, turns 15-30 48h, turn 30-45 72h, turn 45-60 96h, turn > 61 120h.
Hosting is planned for busy ppl!
Disallowed exploits: copying Bogus' orders and overfilling enemy lab to prevent his own forge.
Victory condition: 60-70% of # players capital VPs. 8 VPs.
Nations: All LA but UW (the map has very little UW provinces).
Hosted on llamaserver.
Diplomacy allowed.
NAP's are not considered binding.
(I for one have no intention of breaking my NAPs but every player is free to act as he will in this regard)

Discussion:
Edit: Discussion phase is over. I have compiled all the votes and went with the settings that got the most votes

# of players: 12
Gem gens: no
Mods: CBM 1.6 (w/o gem gens)
Research: Normal
Graphs: on
HoF: 15
Indies: Normal
Magic sites: 45%

Players:
1. WraithLord, Ermor
2. Aethyr, Midgard
3. Aristander, Man
4. rdonj, Jomon
5. Festin, TC
6. Trumanator, Ulm
7. mscfish, Pythium
8. Meglobob, Pan
9. Viccio, Ctis
10. Dimaz, Gath
11. Fantomen, Atlantis
12. ghoul31, Caelum

Game is hosted here on llamaserver
Please refer to FAQ if you are have question about how to join.
Please use the attached map.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion]
 

It might be worth you mentioning whether or not dimplomacy is allowed, and if so, what the situation is regarding how binding NAP's are. The latter obviously helps offset any later disagreements on the issue :)

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion]
 

I would like to sign up as Tien Chi. For mods, I vote for using latest CBM without gem gens.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion]
 

Updated first post.
Thanks 4 the tip Calahan.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion]
 

I would prefer CBM 1.6, no gem gens. As for the rest, standard settings are fine, but I don't mind deviating either so long as indy strength doesn't go astronomically high... playing jomon, I don't think I can afford such a handicap.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion&signup]
 

I would like to point out that the previous game w/ the first three players, Wraithlord was thrown the game by his allies Aristander and Aethyr. One can peruse the Asiatwist game thread for details. Instead of fighting for a win, after an epic 9 month game, Wraithlord had his friends abandon their victory points and actively aid in wraithlord's taking of the final two needed.

If you wish to play a game of many months only to have the game thrown by collusion, then this would likely be the game for you.

I myself will play play Mictlan; perhaps I will be able to bring some balance to this set-up.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion&signup]
 

You've got to be kidding me. You are throwing slander at me all over the place and cont. spam the same ridiculous lies.

So long as you persist with your vengeful behavior you are not welcome in this game, nor would I want to participate in any future game with you.

Guys, I can assure you that no "throwing" of the game is gonna happen. I'm not even certain Aristander would be able to participate (though he had expressed interest). Even if he would there's no knowing whether we would be in game friends or foes. Same thing for Aethyr. In-fact, being as I chose to take Ermor it's most likely that all would gang up on me anyway :D

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion&signup]
 

Slander needs to be untrue. Please state what it is I have said that you feel is factually incorrect. thank you.

Again, what lies do you maintain I have said? Seriously - you can say they are lies, but the facts are pretty obvious. Do you deny collusion? Do you deny Aristander threw you the game? I really don't understand what it is you are disputing.

I'm interested in playing in order to have a real and fair competition this time.

What is the basis of your assurance? It happened last game; your argument was that it had not been specifically rejected by the game's rules.

In fact, this is a good game for us to have a rematch with, as due to your being LA Ermor, diplomatic issues are likely to be less relevant.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion&signup]
 

Seriously Archae, this is getting a little ridiculous. Its one thing to dispute the win, but posting in every damn thread he does is pathetic. As far as I'm concerned, its irrelevant what happened in AT until/unless it repeats. Then, I might start worrying.

I would like to join as Ulm.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion&signup]
 

hi trumanator. this is the only thread he has done, so, technically you are correct.

It is relevant for a game that it's operating conditions and rules and standards of conduct be discussed. As such, and given past history, I merely want to know whether throwing a game is considered legit here. Is it, or not? I mean, really, why wouldn't it be legit to do so in this game? Do you feel there is something wrong with that?

You are right, though. A proper discussion on good game play and throwing games should have it's own thread. Further debate on that issue should take place there. In order to reduce the amount of threads this issue is spread over, I will create a thread for it.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion&signup]
 

Hi,WL:
Thanks for your invite.And I will take the race of PY.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion&signup]
 

Due to the unsatisfactory conclusion of the previous game, I'm interested in a rematch, which is why I am joining. Whatever the past, I certainly do not preclude good diplomatic relations with players from prior games. I do not feel WL bested me before; now is his opportunity to do so.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion&signup]
 

Can I have Pan?

Yes to CBM.
No to gem generators.
Graphs on.
Research easy.
HoF max.
Indies normal.

Any chance of having magic sites higher than 35%, perhaps 45%? 35% is a bit boring.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion&signup]
 

Btw any chance of a link to the map, Wraith? Looked in maps/mods but can't seem to find it.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion&signup]
 

research normal or hard, indies hard, but no real preferences. CBM, no gem gens, though.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion&signup]
 

I am in.
I would like to try Man.
Thanks

Aristander

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion&signup]
 

Yes, I also vote for high magic sites if we play without gem gens.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion&signup]
 

Well, you called me a player w/o honor and a liar (and then you edited your msg to moderate that). You go around posting in every place I do always with the same thing to say.
I don't understand you. Why do you want to play with me?- just so you can exact vengeance on some perceived grievance you have?
I tell you I'm not here for the ego. I don't want competition with you or anyone else for that matter. I enjoy playing and winning like everybody else but have 0 interest in ego competitions. You think you're a better dom player than me, well that's all well and good and perhaps even true. It doesn't matter to me one whit. Had I any interest in this we could have just arranged a 1:1 ( and see whose the man ;) ). But frankly I don't find this prospect enjoyable. Anyway for sure not now, perhaps later in the future I'll change my mind (maybe if there's a good prize for the winner I will :D ). For now I'm more into playing with lots of ppl and have interesting & varied games.

Also, you have the right to express your opinions in a civil and polite matter, nothing like the post storm you did the last few days with name calling and finger pointing and giving your very emotional interpretation of things.
If you want to open a new page then I'm all for it and although I can relate to your frustration I still think you went over the board with your reaction and believe that you owe me an apology.

I have nothing against you. I'm not upset with you nor do I feel any animosity towards you. I'm just somewhat disappointed at your disrespectful reaction. The way things are, heated and emotional, I don't think anything good would come of you participating in this game and frankly, given the way you feel, I find that strange that you'd even want to.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 8/12]
 

I would like to play with C'tis

Viccio

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 8/12]
 

Gath, please.
I prefer no mods, standard settings.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion&signup]
 

Yes. Part of Sombre's project for converting old dom-II maps.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 8/12]
 

really, you're that afraid of the competition, even with the game filled w/ your hand-picked buddies?

I made an attempt to have something like a rematch; you rejected my offering.

and ego competitions? who said anything about that? As to claims of lies and slander, I seem to recall you making those accusations.

and post storm? I"ve posted in 3 threads. The game thread, a reply to your posting the win for the game, and in this thread. All are clearly relevant. You have posted in many other threads, and you do not find my posts there. This would seem to be a misstatement on your part, then.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 8/12]
 

Guys, please take into account that the open settings will be decided by the majority.

As for not "throwing" up games and such we can have some house rules in that regard but I personally this would end up very artificial. let's say we decide something int he vein of:
A. Players are/aren't allowed to pass X gems/items/gold to other player [after turn Y] [in case player is Z in the score graphs] etc.

or
B. Players must defend their VPs with all their might. If they have more than one VP they must divide their forces equally between them. Players are not allowed to teleport/raid/suicide attack or otherwise risk their armies and thus prevent them from defending their VPs.

I'm not saying we can't come up with some plausible formula but how would it be enforced?- Is it even worthwhile to enforce it?- And why go to all that trouble if we can just do RAND?

I think this discussion is way out of scope of this thread. I suggest we stick to diplomacy and trust the players good judgment. And if someone just passed his 400 N gems to allow another to cast GoH and win the game via his tart factory - well, so be it.

That said, your opinions on that matter are of course welcome :)

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 8/12]
 

Yes, that is 100% true and nothing remotely close to slander ;)

Who said anything about rematch?- Why on earth would you want a rematch?- If you are so keen on a rematch then join the next RAND game (whenever that be) with me.

The sheer volume of your repetition is soooo tiring.

What on earth are you talking about?- What other threads?- And pray tell me, are you now stalking me as well :confused:

Drink some beer, play some dominions, just give it a rest man :)

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 8/12]
 

If you were truly interested in moving beyond this and "giving it a rest" you wouldn't be denying my attempt to join this game in good faith.

And I'm pretty sure that even in those three threads, the number of our posts is about on par.wut? you've made posts in strategy threads - reading the forums really doesn't constitute stalking. That's a bit bizarre. I guess you've decided to try to spin this as some sort of persecution of an innocent. Whatever.

Yes, good faith. Coming to the game I host, telling everyone I'm some kind of villain with a mafia of undercover friends hell bent on stealing victory. I truly believe you.

Yes, on par, a thread I opened for a game I host, game thread in which I'm trying to do an AAR worth a damn, and HoF thread in which I posted game results. All (but HoF) full to chocking with your repetitive msgs. Yes again, that makes perfect sense indeed.

Edit, nitpick, I've made no posts in strat. threads today. How could I, when all I do is read your posts here.

Edit2, Oh, that's getting ridiculous. I should have just ignored you like I promised myself I would. Look, If you ever feel differently and want to open a new page plz let me know. Otherwise please respect my will to stay out of touch.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 10/12]
 

Hi wraithlord, have room for me? I´d like to play Atlantis.

I vote for latest CBM 1.6, would be nice to try it out.

Edit: Jesus Archaeolept, you don´t go around ****ting on people like that. Regardless what they did. You´re making a fool out of yourself to be honest.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 10/12]
 

@Fantomen, I'm sorry for neglecting to mention this. IIRC the map is not appropriate for UW nations (it only has a small lake in the middle if memory serves). I'll update the first post with this bit. Would you care to select a different nation instead?

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 11/12]
 

I'm happy to play the fool, I guess. Like I said, the discussion of what happened belongs in its own thread. I was looking to join this game. All I've done is post in three relevant threads, for which I receive abuse. As I keep saying, I'm happy to keep discussion of the events involved in Asiatwist, and the topic of throwing games in general, in its own thread, which I will create later. Any posts since then have been due to my interest in joining another game - clearly this is not it, for Wraithlord's reasons.

Fantomen, I don't see you adding content anywhere on the issue. Hopefully you will have something relevant to contribute to the appropriate thread.

edit: in LA, Atlantis is mostly a land nation, and would work on this map, though I believe it, like LA Mary, should have its capital border on the large lake.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 10/12]
 

If I start bordering the lake Atlantis will be fine, it´s strong on land as well as in water. I´ll test the map to see how I´m placed. Is that ok?

Edit: Well Atlantis plays fine on this map.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 11/12]
 

I'll take caelum

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 11/12]
 

archaeolept,

You can put as much sugar on this topic as you want, but it still tastes like crap.
Please let it go, agree to disagree and enjoy the game.


POST #29

POST #6
Consider this an official warning.

Board Rules:

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 11/12]
 

I have sent a PM asking for clarification on the proper manner in which these issues should be discussed. I would propose a single thread for the general issue, without personal attacks or the like. Anyone can avoid the thread if they do not care for the topic.

I would like there to be some means of discussion that does not constitute flaming or trolling. I would hope that an honest discussion would lead to an improvement in the community's enjoyment of its games, whatever my personal opinion of Wraithlord.

This will be my final post in this thread.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 11/12]
 

I am confirming my participation in this game.

Trumanator, I agree with you but I cannot remain silent.

@Archae, you accuse me unjustly sir. I defended my VPs vigorously against multiple attacks by you and held them until the end of the game.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

let's aim to start this game in a week from now or when all pretenders are in. Whichever comes first.

Good hunting :)

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

Oh and make sure nobody uninvited takes your nation's place!

rdonj, would you care to share your sage advice and refresh my memory as how to deal with such a thing if needed?

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

Well, there's no way to stop someone from signing up. Just set the game not to auto-start, and I'm pretty sure until the game has started you can just remove incorrect pretenders via the game page. You have to rely on the players that were unable to get a pretender in to let you know if there's a problem though.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

Thank you for the advice!

You heard rdonj, Plz report to me if you were unable to get your pretender in.

You should get a confirmation response form the server like:
"
This is just to confirm that I've received a pretender file from you for Ermor in the game Sharivar1, and everything seems to be fine with it. Here's a list of nations which have signed up so far:

Ermor

Note that you can check this at any time at www.llamaserver.net.

Details of your e-mail:
Subject: Sharivar1
Sent at: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 12:47:01 +0300
Attachment: late_ermor_0.2h
"

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [discussion, 11/12]
 

please cite where I ever claimed otherwise. Also, please do not bring me back into this thread. If you wish to discuss specifics, we can do it somewhere else.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

Umm... Guys? Are you absolutely certain that you want to play on the unedited map?

There are some pretty crazy stuff in there, like pre-placed Summoning Circle and a site that let's you recruit S/W/D mages. There are numerous other minor bonus sites all over too.

Just to let you guys know, since those things can be pretty easy to miss. If you want to play on, I'd keep an close eye on provinces 158 and 171.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

Shaharivar is a beautiful map, and one of my favorites from DomII days. We used it for Ironhawk's original artifacts game, but the original .map, which Sombre seems to have included, needs to be fixed up a bit.

1. the two western mountain chains overly restrict mobility; especially the nw start position is relatively hemmed in. This led to a number of complaints from users about playing on this map. We added a couple mtn crossings iirc, one to the north and one to the south, and that helped a fair bit. Perhaps we added another northern river crossing too, can't recall.

2. summoning circle is an insane site to have pre-placed in a game (60% blood bonus). I think we swapped it out for the nice but innoffensive circle of standing stones [edit: nope, demon gate. standing stones would better match the image though]. a few other sites were toned down as well.

3. there are some connectivity issues in the se plains esp. that need to be cleared up, where neighbours don't connect to neighbours, or connected to places they shouldn't.

4. there is somewhat too little terrain variation in the south/se plains, which is easily rectified by adding some mtn/waste/forest terrain in appropriate areas.

5. also the pre-placed sites were made #nostart, for obvious reasons.

i've included the revised .map that was used for Artifacts I. changes are documented at the start of the .map. I'm not sure what sorts of changes, if any, are needed to make a dom II .map compatible to dom III.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

In this case it is probably a good idea to use a new map version.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

Thanks Archae.

I really think we ought to use the edited version. Personally, I know that if I start anywher NEAR the summoning circle I am going balls out for it!

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

Yeah I vote also for changing summoning circle to something else, It should still be a nice site IMO, just less game breaking.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

Burnsaber, thank you for the heads up.
archaeolept, thank you for the detailed report and revised map. However, this game will host on llamaserver and can only use the maps on the server.
I assume, being as the server is so awesome, that there is a way to upload user maps but am not yet familiar with it. I'll try and see if I can learn more by checking the server FAQ.

Guys, I agree with all that we better use Archae's edited map. I won't start the game until I find out how to load it to the server and set our game to use it.
If you are doing test games then you should use this map as well.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

The tourmaline map already uploaded should work.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

Hi Trumanator, What is the exact uploaded map name?- I'm trying to find it in the list of U/Led maps. So far w/o success.

Does it contain all the fixed to the issues pointed out by Burnsaber and Archae?

EDIT: BTW, I checked Archae's map and it works with dom-III (after editing the tga map name). I also found out how to U/L it to the server. Since we're back from a party and it's late night here I'll probably take care of this tomorrow.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

Seems like something's wrong with Archae's map. I just noticed in a test game that the provinces connection doesn't make sense. For example, 147 should be connected to 151 , 160, 157, 138 and 145 but is instead connected to 156, 164, 146 and 141.

Probably something to do with dom-II to dom-III transition.

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

I think you could use Sombres Dom3 converted map file and copy Archaes balance changes into it.

Upload the map using this linkie (can also be foud through the map & mod browser)

Re: Sharivar - LA game 4 bussy ppl [12/12, Accepting pretenders]
 

it sounds like someone may have modified the tga instead of the .map in order to rectify the obvious original connectivity problems, as what you report sounds pretty similar to the original issue.

it is easy to edit .maps to correct connectivity, luckily.

also you may want to double check that none of the magic sites have been taken out of the game. I know many were added in DomIII; possibly some were taken out.