Dystopia - new poor game (Running)
 

Hi folks,

I want to credit QM with the insanity of Forge of Godhood. Some of us on IRC think it's a neat idea but needs some adjustment to make a game that might actually end with a win for someone.

So here's my new plan for a poor game.

Map: Streamlands by Elmoki (great map maker)
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showpost.php?p=713433
Era: Middle
Players: 12-15
Magic site freq: 0
Gold multiple: 50
Resource multiple: 50
Supply: 100
Research: Very difficult
Independents: 9
Mods:
CBM 1.6
Endgame Diversity Mod by LlamaBeast
Zlefins F/W Thugs
Please download the following Combined mod prepared by Sombre for this game.


Hall of Fame: 15
Graphs: On

Host Schedule:
24h until otherwise requested

Victory:
Cummulative: Capitals are the only VPs. 15 vps are required.

Other rules:
No trading (meaning no sending gold/slaves/items/gems)
Breaking of alliances and NAPs should acceptable/expected
No magic above level 8 on pretenders (to prevent complete domination of blesses)
Water nations are allowed. Simply because I want to play Ryleh. But note, this map is very unfriendly to water nations which is a deliberate choice.

I might be open to negotiate some of these terms but frankly I doubt it. I'm too ornery and stubborn. Try me if you really want.

Folks who played Forge will remember a number of problems. It's very difficult to move forward after the middle game due to the overwhelming selection of D3 scalse. Also water nations can turtle forever which is why I've chosen a much more unfriendly map for water.

Cummulative victory points was chosen for the simple reason that once all the people have died, making armies large enough to take more capitals becomes nearly impossible.

I've chosen not to ban any nations. The freespawn nations like Pan and Ermor have some advantages but they were shown to be as much challenge as they were advantage.

Come on down for some bloody hard work. These are tough games but I had so much fun in Forge I want to repeat the insanity.

Nations:

1) Ryleh - Maerlande
2) Vanheim - don_Pablo
3) Caelum - LoloMo
4) Pythium - legolajrt
5) T'ien Ch'i - Sir_Dr_D
6) Mictlan - zlefin
7) Pangaea - LumenPlacidum
8) Agartha - FrozenLama
9) Bandar Log - Squirrelloid
10) Jotunheim - Zeldor
11) Abysia - Graeme_Dice
12) C'tis - GameExtremist
13) Ulm - StaggerLee
14) Machaka - Fantomen
15) Man - Rytek

Game is up. :) http://www.llamaserver.net/gameinfo.cgi?game=Dystopia

Re: Dystopia - new poor game
 

I'll try with Vanheim

Re: Dystopia - new poor game
 

Finally! A poor game! Caelum please :)

Re: Dystopia - new poor game
 

I changed my mind, I'm going to play a nation I've never played before. Switch me over to Marignon please. Thanks!

Re: Dystopia - new poor game
 

Forge was a ton'o'fun IMO, but sorry I'm burned out at the moment and can't see how your parameters are any different. Just the cumulative victory condition? How does that work anyway?

Re: Dystopia - new poor game
 

vfb: Maybe they aren't enough different vfb. My plan was to squeeze the players tighter to about 8 provinces per player. But that's about the same as Forge.

1) I squeezed the map by roughly 50%.
2) The map was specifically chosen to penalize water nations so they can't turtle. There is one small sea of 4 provinces which I will set to #nostart. The rest of the water provinces are small lakes not connected. This will force any water nations to get on land fast or die.
3) CBM 1.6 makes entering water easier with manuals of water breathing for N gems.
4) Cummulative VPs is huge. You get one vp every year for each capital you hold. So setting the cummulative at 6 for example ends the game on turn 72 no matter what. It won't devolve into a giant stalemate. I think we should got more than 6 though :) Probably say if you get 4 caps and hold a couple years you win.

My view on Forge wasn't that the settings didn't work. Just that no one could win in less that 120 turns.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game
 

don_Pablo:

You look new. Please carefully review the settings. Try out a single player game to test some ideas. These settings are extremely brutal and a lot of things don't work. You might want to read the Forge of Godhood threat to get a feel for the game.http://forum.shrapnelgames.com//showthread.php?t=43675

You are most welcome to play. I'm just offering some advice to make it enjoyable.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game
 

Here is my last turn as the sub for QM in Forge of Godhood. Note the extremely low populations and gold income.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game
 

Hey Maerlande, I'd love to hear more about what the Forge of Godhood threat is :D Is it along the lines of....

"I demand that you join this game :tough: else I'll curse all your other games to grind to a deadlock in a never ending midgame that lasts a thousand turns."

Re: Dystopia - new poor game
 

I am a tentative yes. My real life is getting very busy but I'm only in one game right now. If this game doesn't start right away I'm more likely to test some ideas and commit. Looks like fun though. :)

Re: Dystopia - new poor game
 

Sure! I'm trying to be serious but all you can do is make fun of my spelling Calahan. Jerk :)

Welcome pyg. Got a nation choice? I'm not in a rush to start.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game
 

How does the cumulative thing work? Is it checked at turn 1, 13, 25, etc, or do you get 1 VP for holding a capital for 12 consecutive months?

Re: Dystopia - new poor game
 

I'm waiting on more advice from vets on that, but my understanding is you get 1 point every year in the summer for holding a vp. So basically, you should get 6 points for just sitting in your cap for roughly 72 turns. I think it would actually be on turn 78.

So if I set the vps required to 6, the game with automatically end on turn 72 with no one doing anything.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game
 

I will try as Tien-Chi

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 5/15)
 

Yes, cumulative VPs are added only during mid-summer. Games start at early spring, right? So that should be around turn 4.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 5/15)
 

I'm interested, and hoping some of my games end soon.

I think LA would make a better dystopian era, but maybe that's just me =P

So no one has an undue advantage - would anyone like to explain for everyone how sites 0 actually effects magic site frequency and bloodhunting?

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 5/15)
 

I'm in, sonuds fun. Not sure which nation yet though; that'll depend on how many cum vps are needed as well, as some nations are more early/late game, even by how this game counts such things.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 5/15)
 

I'm in. I'll try Pangaea: Age of Bronze.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 5/15)
 

At a request from IRC I'm adding Llamabeast's cool new mod: Endgame diversity. It will be quite amazing if someone gets to Conjuration 6 to use it but who knows. Might make for some new strategies.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 5/15)
 

zlefin would also like to add his FW Thugs mod. I may do that, but I've not looked at it yet. Going to try it out.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 5/15)
 

Ok, count me in as... Bandar Log!

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 5/15)
 

Cool. I'll try to get an accurate answer about blood hunting. So far, I know it is affected but I don't know the math.

I will post about the specifics of magic zero on site searching.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 5/15)
 

Okay folks. Some fairly solid stuff on site frequency with magic zero:

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com//show...5&postcount=62

And some tests by vfb on blood hunting:

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com//show...1&postcount=21

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 5/15)
 

Except for the low magic site setting, this sounds a lot like Dom2, which makes me want to play C'Tis or Abysia.

In fact, I want to play them enough to actually go and play Abysia.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 5/15)
 

Are you in then Graeme_Dice?

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 10/15)
 

Yep, I'm in. And no need to use my whole name, it's so bloody formal.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 10/15)
 

I would like to play C'tis :)

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 10/15)
 

Dice: Which nation? Looks like Aby so I'll book you for that :)

GameExtremist: Done

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 12/15)
 

Sorry this game is filling really fast and I'm not anywhere close to ready. Please remove me from the players list. Sorry, next time.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 12/15)
 

I'm in no hurry to start pyg. I'll hold your spot until it fills.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 12/15)
 

Folks: I'm not going to start for at least a week. A number of people have asked for time to plan and test and that's fine with me. Let's not rush. The settings are hard enough.

Also, nation changes are not a problem. Feel free to switch if you find your testing falls apart.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 12/15)
 

I'd like to play Machaka

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 14/15)
 

Done. Interesting choice Fantomen. And welcome.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 14/15)
 

I would like man please.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 14/15)
 

Done. We're full guys. But I'll take a couple alternates in case Zlefin and Pyg don't decide on nations.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 14/15)
 

What with the upkeep-free aspect of spiders after their riders have been shot, it seems like a pretty damn good choice to me. Good ways of spending their national gems too.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 15/15) full
 

I've decided. Cummulative VPs are 11. That's it. Final, end of discussion.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 15/15) full
 

This is going to be a short game! Or do you mean 110 VPs? :)

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 15/15) full
 

Actually lolomo,if we do the math: 12 vps means the game is automatically over about turn 147 if no one does anything. Another way to figure it out is that if someone rushes a second cap they will accumulate 2 vps a year. Should end the game about turn 70 or so.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 15/15) full
 

I think your years weigh less than a standard metric year, or something.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 15/15) full
 

Hi Folks,

How is testing going? I'm still not sure of the best choice for VPs. If anyone has some results from testing using cummulative it might be good to share. So far I'm still thinking of 12.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 15/15) full
 

I was a fan of 11 based on your reasoning in the YARG2 thread.

(what do you mean you were joking!)

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 15/15) full
 

Nigel knows his stuff.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 15/15) full
 

Hi Folks,

We've got a bit of map adjustment to do. One or two connection problems and also I'm hoping to find a volunteer to help with fixed starts (but random nations) who is not playing. If anyone is interested let me know.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 15/15) full
 

i'm gonna go with mictlan, i dunno about vp count turns should always be fast for this game, I just dont' want the game to turn into whoever took the first cap wins, since nobody else can break the castles. but long-term investments need enough time to pay off.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 15/15) full
 

Got some ideas on amount of cummulative vps zlefin? I just don't want to end up with the stalemate of Forge.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 15/15) full
 

It is better to have it too high then too low. Just the fact that you are using cumulative victory points means that the game will end. My vote is for 15.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 15/15) full
 

Imho the more - the better.
I also vote for 15.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 15/15) full
 

Raiel has requested a nation change. Please check the OP.

Re: Dystopia - new poor game (Recruiting 15/15) full
 

I would like to change from Marignon to Ermor please.