Assimilation (recruit some conquered foes!)
 

Hello! This is a new gameplay-changing mod.

The short:

This mod allows you to recruit a few enemy troops types and commanders at their capital once you have conquered it.

Version 1.1 of the mod includes a file for each of Early, Mid and Late. Please ensure you only have ONE age (early, mid or late) active at a time.

Sites used are from 820 - 845 or so, to avoid this conflicting with the Magic Sites Mod (unless they've expanded it).

The long:

One of my favourite things about Master of Magic was conquering new races and adding their strengths to my own, creating a really diverse, interesting fighting force. It really gave me motivation to continue to conquer my neighbors (can't wait to get troll infantry and dark elf sorcerers to supplement my high elf forces, etc).

So I was always disappointed when, for instance, I conquered Jotunheim and couldn't convince any of the giants there to follow me. Seemed silly that some of the giants wouldn't be willing to join me, even if maybe the most powerful wouldn't.

This idea has been floating around in my head ever since I heard of the added site modding functionality (a couple years ago) which allows the use of #mon and #com commands (letting all nations recruit new units from specific sites).

Basically I've taken 3-5 (usually 5) of the 'second-best' or 'stock' units and commanders for each nation, added them to a new site (or a modded site for those races which have 4 startsites already) and given that site to the nation as a startsite. This has the effect of giving you access to those troops (at the enemy capital only) when you have conquered the enemy's capital.

The side effect, of course, is that the units appear twice in your capital's recruitment roster, but that's a minor, unavoidable blip, all things considered.

I did not attempt to balance perfectly. I chose flavorful, interesting units which I would generally like to be able to recruit as another nation, but never chose the most powerful troops available (sacreds only in a couple of cases where it made sense--Mictlan for instance--and never a race's "top" caster). Balance is not perfect nor should it be. I'm fully aware of the game-changing nature of this mod, which is the point, after all.

So please, no complaints about how much better it is to conquer Bandar Log than it is to conquer MA Ulm, or about how in some ways this makes Productivity a more valuable pick, etc etc. I know. But it sure is fun to be able to say "I can't wait to conquer Helheim so I can start up a blood economy to get my Antlered Shaman some Earth Blood Stones."

Feel free to make suggestions, or create your own dramatically better versions of the mod! It's easy enough. I created this for my own use, after all, and am just uploading it on a lark. :)

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

This looks really cool, I'm about to try it out. But what'd be better is instead of gaining the same units you gain some slightly different units. For instance a few types of enslaved Jotunheim giants forced to serve your god. Or some less powerful versions of say Burning Ones. This would however be a lot more work and have the side effect of them being recruitable by the the original nation.

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Awesome idea - what a great first post!

Thanks very much for posting this. I think that next time I get to organizing a multiplayer game I will include this mod as it sounds very fun.

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

I thought of that, actually, though I was thinking 'mercenary' more than 'enslaved'. But it's a lot of work to add all the units (especially if you want to modify the sprites a bit), and that opens up all sorts of questions--for instance, in that case I bet people would want to evenly balance the recruitable units, maybe make them slightly less cost-effective than 'normal' nationals, give specific types of commander to each nation, etc, which is just less fun I think. I also wanted to avoid mod conflicts as much as I could, and a great way to do that is to avoid using up any unit ID's at all. :)

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Excellent work! Kudos to you for filling something that has been a fairly frequent request.

There is some territory here that can fall into MAP commands instead of MOD. Ive found that adding a capital magic site to a nation causes it to be treated as a capital site. But interestingly, the game does not check to see whose capital site it is. In this way, I have given nations the capital-only units of other nations. And when the capital is taken, it is still treated as a cap site (it does not give the invading nation those units). A fun example is giving Erius glamoured infantry to MA Man which allows MA Man to really kick ***. Great for boosting AIs by allowing "allied" AIs to be super-allied and use each others units.

I know, the opposite direction that you went in. But Im wondering if what you originally wanted was the capital units? What Im thinking is that you can clean up that duping thing if you use a map along with the mod. Or you can offer it as a special online game using your mod by using an edited map for that game.

Can a cap-only site be duplicated in a way that creates a non-caponly site? IF a nation is placed in a specific starting location, then the map can clear out the sites that each nation gets in their cap and replace them duplicate sites that are not flagged for the cap-only checks.

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Thanks!

I wanted to avoid having cap-only units as the 'conquered' units since they tend to be the elites. I prefer the idea of the elites generally refusing to follow another god, but some of the rank-and-file units and commanders/mages being willing to join up.

That said, if you like the idea of collecting the capital-only units, it'd be easy enough, without having to worry about map commands, to just edit the sites that give capital-only units and replace the 'homecom' and 'homemon' commands with 'com' and 'mon' (which would then let the units be recruited by anyone who owns the site, rather than just the home nation). You just have to remember to re-add any gem producing commands since editing a site tends to wipe most of the site's attributes.

Technically that'd avoid the 'duplicate' issue, but I find it to be at worst a very minor annoyance, personally.

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

This looks like the start of a really great mod Azurain.

I've always understood why Illwinter decided that you can't recruit enemy national units when you took their cap, but at the same time always wondered how games would play out if you could. ie. If you could recruit enemy national mages, it would likely strongly effect who you attacked first.

I haven't checked the mod itself out yet, but might well give this mod a whirl in a future game* I organise to see how it works in practise.


* A newbie game probably, as testing experimental drugs on newbs is always the way to go :)

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

If its otherwise an Vanilla (no CBM) game, count me in.

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Great idea! I'd be very interested in seeing a game like this, seems rather intriguing.
I guess all the good nations will get attacked pretty fast now, so, dibs on Man! :)
Good work :up:

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

I would love to play a game with this mod, it sounds really fun!

Wondering if this would led to more aggressive play from players, could be interesting.

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

I'd join.

It seems like it would make you more agressive in the early game with the lure of military and magic diversity. also make some juicy nations much less likely to survive. I would be tempted to go with someone as bland as possible. Man would be screwed.

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Ulm would be screwed, rather. man would be fine...

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

MA Ulm's units are all high-resource, so you don't get all that much unit diversity from them, and their magic isn't the best. MA Caelum, on the other hand, with low-resource flying archers (ie, high-availability) and good air mages...

By which I mean to say, it's not always balanced with juicy nations being more inviting to conquer. In fact, I should probably re-balance it a little if I get some time at some point. Version 1.1 or somesuch, with Late maybe. :)

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

What i like about this is the possibility of seeing the worst of people when their friendly alliance kills Mictlan and then everyone turns on each other to fight over the capital

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Actually it's most of a balance mechanisme with the most powerfull nation being the most interesting targets. The main problem would be with nations that have specific interesting units without being that powerfull (Caelum for flying units of course, nations that have unusual cross path, ...)

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Ulm with its Forge bonus...

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Since nobody else seems to want to organize an game, I migth want to do it, in the not so distant future.
(ie if/when I get crushed in on of the 4 games I'm in at the moment)

How far along is the LA Mod?
(or is it in work?)

Would it work in combination with the OneAge Mod?

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

It'll take me maybe an hour to throw together the late age mod--If you're planning a game, I can aim to get that done this weekend, possibly tonight.

In terms of a one age mod version, it'd require a bit of tweaking since right now I used the same array of site numbers in each age, to avoid compatibility issues (the fewer site numbers used, the better, I figure). It's very little work to put together a one age mod version, though, just changing some site numbers and some startsite numbers.

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

LA + OneAge Mod would be great! :-D

But you don't need to stress yourself on my behalf.
I have time (and 4 games running, don't want to stretch myself to tin).

I'm thinking about an huge map, quasi anonymus pretender and the Assimilation Mod (+ OneAge). Oh and harder research. No CBM.

Still thinking about...

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Hmmm, I would prefer sticking to one age, but going for random nations. that would mitigate the potential detrimental effects of unbalancing the nations, and insure we don't get a selection of bland-trooped nations that make the mod less interesting.

of course, I could host it as well. I also have a loose end I'd like to see tied up before I take on another admining...

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Pre-Game thread:
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=46847

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Version 1.1 has been released, which includes a Late era version. More details in the first post of this thread. :)

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

I get a NAGOK... #badstartsite, event when removing every other mod for the mid era. Haven't tested the other eras.

It doesn't work with CBM either.

I use the latest patch (3.26). I tried CBM 1.7 (with or without it crashes)

Does this mod requires another one ?

I can't wait for trying it :) Excellent idea !!!

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Hmm. I didn't even notice there was a new patch out, so it hasn't been tested in that. The patch notes don't seem to suggest anything that would be a problem, unless the 'extra sites in caves' thing created new sites using the same site numbers I'm using here.

It should be fine with CBM. I'll update to the new patch and do some troubleshooting when I get home from work tonight. In the meantime, if you get a chance you could try the Early and Late eras to see if you get the same error, and perhaps also try the 'old version' since that was definitely working in 3.24 and hasn't been changed.

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

I tried all three eras. I always get the Error bad #startsite command.

I checked : no other mod is active.

I'm sorry I no longer have the previous version to test on my PC.

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Version 1.0 (old) which can be downloaded from the first post is the old version (I just renamed the file). But no worries--if the Late Era isn't working, then it's definitely a compatibility issue with 3.26, since Late was working fine last night for me on 3.24. I'll have to troubleshoot tonight. :(

Thanks for reporting it etc!

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Tried it on my other computer on 3.24 with several mods : works fine

So it must be 3.26 (or a problem with the first PC but that would be the first time I have such a difference...)

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Nah, it's almost certainly 3.26. It probably created some new sites within the same number range I am using (820-850 or so). The error message that was received with 3.26 is exactly what would happen if the mod tried to make a site with a number that is already being used, and then tried to assign that site as a startsite.

So it's just a bit of testing and editing to fix. My only real concern is the possibility that this won't be able to be compatible with the 'extra sites' mode any longer, if I can't find a slot of 25-30 'empty' sites.

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Just did some testing and I haven't been able to reproduce the error (by redownloading the files in post 1 of the thread). Is it possible you were attempting to use the mod on a map which has its own custom sites? I'm not familiar with how exactly custom map sites work, but it's probably possible that certain maps (I know the Faerun maps use custom sites) wouldn't be compatible with this mod...

In any case, it does appear this works fine with 3.26. Maybe try upgrading the other comp to 3.26 and see if it works there. Let me know if you figure anything out--if someone else posts that they're also experiencing this error, I'll look into it futher. Otherwise: enjoy! :)

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Ouch !

I have the error when I click 'new game' : I don't even get to select a game's name, a map or an era...

I'll try a clean reinstall this week-end...

Sorry if it's a specific problem with my install

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Oh yeah, I should have known that the error comes up before you select a map, given that it happened to me when I was first testing the mod (I had some site numbers wrong, which I fixed before uploading it).

Let me know how it goes after the clean re-install! Thanks for the feedback, etc. :)

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Azurain, thanks for the idea and hard work. I have not tried it yet, but it sounds like a lot of fun.

I'm thinking of organizing a game in a few weeks, with traditional settings as opposed to the variant that's been out there for a while, and I'd be willing to give this a try if there is enoguh interest. Are there any compatibility issues with EDM?

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

There shouldn't be any compatibility issues unless it happens to modify startsites or use any site numbers between 820 and 845. I can check at some point but personal life complications just came up and I won't have much spare attention to devote to things for a bit. :)

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

I was a bit lazy : I used a back-up which I upgraded to 3.26 and copie my mod folder.

Works fine. Dunno why my previous install caused a bug...

Very, very interesting mod :) Makes solo playing easier after you defeat your first adversary, but it adds some much flavour and fun ! Yes, a bit like MoM where you went Wahoo when being able to recruit another flavour of troops. Seems highly logical too if you push your dominon : you just converted the population, at the heart of the nation (capital), right ? So even if some former elite units or units specific to previous god's blessing refuse or can't be recruited, a majority of the standard units should be recruitable and bring you new military capacity.

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

Thanks
This Mod is great, just what SP needed, now on to another computer controlled capital, heh, heh, heh...

Re: Assimilation (Conquered Lands)
 

I'm in a Dominions 3 mood again, lately, so thought I'd see if anyone has any suggestions or requests related to the mod. In particular, let me know if there's any interest in an all-eras version, and if anyone's experiencing issues with 3.27 (haven't tested it myself, yet).

Re: Assimilation (recruit some conquered foes!)
 

We are using it in Frashkart at the moment.
Don't know if anybody got an second Capital yet.
Mictlan is sieging Gath, so if there is a Problem we will here soon about it.
(At least I didn't think to test the mod before the game with 3.27...)

Re: Assimilation (recruit some conquered foes!)
 

Is this mod compatible with CBM?

Re: Assimilation (recruit some conquered foes!)
 

It should be, unless newer versions of CBM make changes or additions to sites.

Re: Assimilation (recruit some conquered foes!)
 

It looks like CBM 1.92 should be overall compatible with Assimilation.

Exceptions to watch out for would be: EA Ermor, ME Man, ME Ulm, ME Agartha, and LE Man. This is because CBM messes with these nations' start sites a little. Most likely there will be no issues. Worst-case, the nations might be missing a site given to them by CBM, or might not have their Assimiliation recruitment site. I'll see if I can find some time to test this in the next few days.

Re: Assimilation (recruit some conquered foes!)
 

I've encountered an issue with EA Mictlan, the eagle warrior is gone. It was in the temple of the land which you adapted. You have to add it to one of the other sites.

Re: Assimilation (recruit some conquered foes!)
 

Ack. I'll fix that at a more reasonable hour and upload 1.2 -- thanks. :)