AI Tank delay
 

While the AI is much better than it used to be, it still sends tanks in a blind charge on meeting/advance/assaults. Granted, they have infantry riders (much better than naked!!), but it still would be nice if the infantry sometimes got there first.

I'm not at all sure this is possible but here is yet another idea to get closer to that: Let the AI put all tanks purchased in as reinforcements with a time delay equal to T as given by:

T = 1+ (0.25M - (1.5M/S))

where M equals the map width and S equals the tank speed rating.

This is, of course, just a rough formula that assumes an average movement cost of 3 per hex. Given the head start by their deployed positions plus the reinforcement delay (assuming the tanks start out on a home row reinforcement hex) this would mean that on average the tanks and infantry would arrive near the enemy start line about the same time.

For advance missions perhaps the time delay should be an extra turn or two, with three or four extra turns delay for assault missions.

Even if the delay had to be a fixed one, for whatever coding reasons, a 12 turn or so delay in tank start would make a world of difference. Maybe it could be a value loaded from config?

Having worked with legacy code myself, I'm in awe of what you have accomplished with this game and would understand if something like the above is just not doable.

Thanks,
Brian

Re: AI Tank delay
 

What you need to do is set up a battle,but as a scenario.

That way somebody can set up the AI to do all kinds of things you wouldn't normally expect from the AI.

If I play the AI in a normal battle I always give it at least 50-150% more buying power.

It doesnt stop AI from being reckless,but it makes it much more difficult.

Re: AI Tank delay
 

I don't believe you can do that for long campaign? :(

As for increasing AI buying points, I've been running at 125% ever since that was added to the config.ini file. Also I tend to buy 'junk' for some battles with support forces just to increase the AI's points. That basically just ends up with more tanks rushing to their early demise.

Thanks for the input though.

Re: AI Tank delay
 

The AI is very handicapped on useing infntry supporting armour, it just does not understand that concept, even worse it will keep tank riders on too long even when fired on.
It also buys too much armour( when it can) and drives them into oblivilion.
Suggest you do what Skirmiser says and have a 3rd party buy for the AI
OR
play a human and you will find no more blind charges there;)

Re: AI Tank delay
 

No I don't think so. Did not realize thats what you were talking about.


You can always make a custom campaign.

I don't do alot of WW2 vs human player because I find that
moral is to easily broken in WW2 games.

I can't stand playing and having most of my army running away from the front lines.:sick:

Re: AI Tank delay
 

I've been tempted to get back into pbems but my health is such that it'd take a very patient opponent since I am sometimes unavailable without warning for a month or more at a time.

One possibility I have been thinking about is to string together a number of existing scenarios (suitably modified) into a player made campaign. However, having done a few scenarios some years ago for different versions, that might be biting off more work than I can finish :re:

Re: AI Tank delay
 

Brian, actually you can - I'll be glad to help you out.

There are two ways:

a) using the user campaign and adding induvidual scenarios as you go along. I'll build the scenarios. You as player will need to have basic knowledge of how to edit campaigns, i.e. how to add new scenarios to the campaign - but this is easy and I'll walk you through it in no time.

b) editing the save file. Send me your save files on turn 01 and I can change the deployment, troop type, set op fire filter and ranges, way points and all sorts of tricks to make the game much less predictable...

;)

Re: AI Tank delay
 

The b option sounds like a reasonable way to continue my current long campaign: last page of small core - KG Krafft campaign. It was that campaign which mostly prompted this thread.

I remember doing edits on campaigns in another mod but for some reason didn't think you could do it in this one with long campaigns. :doh: Is there a writeup somewhere that details the process? IE: copy/rename file x to z, open with editor,... etc.?

Thanks for your offer of assistance, I'd like to take you up on the offer with the KG Krafft campaign. I'll get a save game and some notes zipped ready to go later today. :)

Re: AI Tank delay
 

Actually its much worse than that. There is no AI. In games of this generation, there are just some simple hardwired behaviors. That said, one surprising outcome of simple behaviors is when you add enough of them together they start seeming to be 'smarter'.

I wasn't going to bring this up except, after finding out I could edit the files for a long campaign, I did an experiment. I simply made every armor unit on the computer side a 10 turn 50% reinforcement. Wow! What a difference!

Some very unexpected things did occur, for one, artillery all of a sudden got a lot more accurate and dangerous. Your scout cars start getting half blinded by ATR fire and then finished off by early arriving tanks. By the time the tanks arrive you're already up to your eyeballs in enemy infantry.

If I knew the layout of the dat files, I'd simply write a script to apply a reinforcement delay and chance to all vehicles on the computer side.

Re: AI Tank delay
 

Your idea has some validity, we've been discussing something similar which for obvious reasons we won't reveal the details. However, your theory that "artillery all of a sudden got a lot more accurate and dangerous" has no basis in fact. There is NOTHING in code tied to reinforcement delay that's connected to artillery so what you've seen is either what you hoped to see or another case of randomnumberitis ( i.e you got lucky or you had good eyes on the target or both)

Don

Re: AI Tank delay
 

Sorry if it wasn't clear from what I stated, it was an observation, and only applied to computer opponent artillery - my theory is that it is due to the increased number of eyes on the targets and less smoke from wrecks interfering.

Anyhow, glad to hear you're considering something along these lines, it will be a worthwhile improvement from what I'm seeing :)

Thanks!

[Note: continuing the test battle I think I made the delay a bit too long and the chance for (per turn?) reinforcement too low. A 8 turn, 70% reinforcement might have been a better choice for the 80x80 delay(me)/advance(computer) battle.]

Re: AI Tank delay
 

What - to add to the armour that the AI already holds back in reserve when assaulting, attacking or in the meeting engagement (when it has lots of armoured formations)?

Oh - and the attack helos it reserves in MBT, and the heliborne infantry that is also held back in reserve?

In other words - nice idea, but already thought of, back in the DOS days when reinforcements were added.

And if the AI routinely held its tanks back, then the player would probably exploit this by advancing his own armour to stomp the grunts approaching his front, most likely (since the tanks would be back in the deployment area, or off the map if reinforcements).

Nor would holding back armour be a great idea in the meeting engagement either - the human would snaffle the available V-hexes and turn it into an impromptu 'delay' mission.

Cheers
Andy

Re: AI Tank delay
 

....and that's what those nice little "random variables" are for.... keeping people on their toes and why more variety is better than less and what's being discussed is more randomness and less predictability like knowing the tanks will almost always arrive before the infantry will

Don

Re: AI Tank delay
 

I can only state what I'm seeing repeatedly in long campaign battles. The computer opponent is sending a wave of tanks, indeed the majority of its armor strength, forward long before any infantry other than the riders arrive. I've been seeing this behavior consistently.

I only play WinSPWW2 these days so I have no idea about MBT's behavior.

If the delay of the initial armor was too long, certainly it would be exploitable. Perhaps a degree of randomness? The current behavior is certainly exploitable, simply put AT units up front and the majority of the computer opponent's forces are destroyed before the first ten turns are done.

Thanks,
Brian

Re: AI Tank delay
 

BOTH of you see what I wrote in post 13

Don

Re: AI Tank delay
 

Sorry, you ninja'd me :o I'm gonna shutup and step out of the convo now :D

Re: AI Tank delay
 

As a matter of interest - what sort of map depth are you using?

In other words - are you expecting the AI's grunts to walk 3+ KM (60 hexes+) to get to you.

(I find 60 hex deep maps to be about right for WW2 type combat, where the infantry is leg by default.)

Andy

Re: AI Tank delay
 

The long campaign generator around the time of Stalingrad likes to ignore my settings and go to 80x80, I'm guessing that's because of the Stalingrad maps. In the autumn 1942 period I'm changing the map location to 45 (Russia) to simulate the Rzhev pocket battles (Soviet operation Mars offensive) which occurred at the same time.

So 80x80 human delay, computer advance, my setup line is 40. Not sure where exactly the computer setup line is but I'm guessing 60. So about a 1.5km walk until effective range allowing for a few hexes back from the lines.

I play with smaller (heavily reinforced company to understrength battalion) force sizes, core force point value is 2586. I buy pretty much the full allotment of support forces and have the ai strength set to 125% in config.

I'll try 60 depth to see if that makes a difference (would prefer 60 height too for my force type/size).

Thanks,
Brian

Re: AI Tank delay
 

A generated Stalingrad map won't override what you have in your settings, but remember to change those at the correct point in the LC (simply changing the one in preferences, will not change the preference held internally by the LC - it will hold onto its last setting). I think you get the opportunity to change that at the build/repair screen point - MAP/preferences button.

Otherwise, it simply uses the setting you had when you started the campaign.

Cheers
Andy