Double Shield ?
 

Say i got a big pretender with no armor and big hp and i want to take out some "mediocre" indies (like 20, 30 heavy infantry or 50 militas) would it be a good idea to get my trampling pretender 2 black steel tower shields ?

Re: Double Shield ?
 

Yes and no.
Yes, double shields give double the defence (and protection if the attacker semi-fails his attack roll).
On the other hand, a lone trampler will always be surrounded so defence won't matter all that much unless it has other, additional means of defence (be it huge protection, fear+awe, mistform, luck, etherealness...).

As always, if you want to test things out, the debug mod if your friend.

Re: Double Shield ?
 

I think that would be a bad idea, unless your pretender is 0 enc, and since it sounds like you are talking about a Great Mother, it's not. Trampling racks up crazy enc, and the blacksteel shields add 2 enc each! Also, shields add defense, which is the worst...er, defense...against chaff, because each subsequent attack subtracts 2 defense. Protection is better, so a black steel plate would be a better use of gems, and you wont need that after you can research stoneskin. If you are using CBM, an owl quill is good gear for tramplers, as it now lowers base enc, but any reinvigoration gear is useful. With enough reinvigoration, dual shields can be useful, but shields with magic effects like vine, accursed, charcoal, gold, or lantern shields are all better than those that just provide defense.

Re: Double Shield ?
 

Again, depends on what *else* he's got besides the two shields, and exactly what kind of opposition he's expecting.

I've succesfully used an E4/S4 Lord of Plenty as a dual-shielded, boots of the behemoth'd trample machine before. Personal Luck, Body Ethereal, Stoneskin, hold, hold, attack closest. Later on, Earthpower, Invulnerability, Body Ethereal, Astral Shield, hold, attack closest.
Even though the fatass permanentely hovered around 40-60 fatigue at best, and even went unconscious many times, he just destroyed indies, or in my case clumps of 40ish Pan Revelers trying to be cute. Didn't have fear, either (he did have Awe from a golden shield)

Re: Double Shield ?
 

Is there a pratical/theoretical maximum to how much defence you can lose if surrounded? As I understand it, you lose 2 for each attack after the first. Just how many adjacent attacks can there be?

Re: Double Shield ?
 

in theory, as many as 6 hoburgs x 8 squares = 48 attacks ?

Re: Double Shield ?
 

3 se'irim (size 2 demons with 3 attacks) x 8 squares = 72 attacks. Since Se'irim are sacred, with a W9 bless, every other round will have 144 attacks.

Re: Double Shield ?
 

2 shields, when used for the specials on the shields, rather than the defence, are great for 0 enc tramplers or an SC that relies on passive damage.

It mainly usefull because there are some great shields available that are relatively inexpensive; black steel, not one of them.

Re: Double Shield ?
 

Even if we're just talking bottom of the barrel human spearmen with 10s everywhere, 3 dudes per square times 8 is still 24 attacks. Even if your guy has 54 defence (10 to offer average defence to the last spearman, 44 to be shaved off 2 at a time by successive attacks) and zero fatigue, he's going to get hit at least once every other round, statistically :).

Re: Double Shield ?
 

Shields don't exactly add "defense" per say. It's more like they add a chance to add protection. And IIRC shield-given defense can't be mitigated. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong. But the way that dual shields works out is non-obvious. It *seems* that shield defense is additive, and if you have dual shields then they will block based on the sum of the parry value, and may or may not their protection together. If someone has hard facts stating otherwise please prove me wrong because to my knowledge no one knows exactly how dual shields work in this game.

Re: Double Shield ?
 

As others said, double shields are only worth it for especial effects (i particularly like vine shields), and if the user has a effective secondary effect like a aura or trampling (but be wary of fatigue).

Re: Double Shield ?
 

The special ma agartha olm pretender was capable of expanding with double shields. That was a fun trick. but with trample, I would not bother.

Re: Double Shield ?
 

I came across my first double-shielded AI guy the other day --- but I don't suspect he was built to some cunning plan :D

Re: Double Shield ?
 

Would double shield of the eye be good for a trampler ?

Re: Double Shield ?
 

It's better to combine different shields, because using the same type of shield twice it shouldn't stack. And there are shields with better statistics than eye shields, so no, that would be fairly weak. Ideally you want a combination of two nice abilities.

Re: Double Shield ?
 

I think the eye shield is a good one, but as rdonj said, two of them are no better than one. The golden shield is my favorite, as Awe is a hugely valuable defense against chaff. Charcoal might be best for a trampler, as it's an extra source of damage.