The UAV Club
 

At this point why not? Here's a couple of sites that might be useful to you.
http://www.airforce-technology.com/
http://www.flightglobal.com/
http://www.aviationweek.com/Defense....hannel=defense
http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/
http://www.globalaviationresource.com/index.php
http://www.globalsecurity.org/index.html
These by their listing are my "big boys" for all things flying I use for refs. I have a couple of more but they just specialize in aircraft or helos or both. bottom line they wouldn't work for here.

Have fun! :)

Regards,
Pat

Re: The UAV Club
 

I Hope realistic UAV simulation wilk be included in 6.5

Re: The UAV Club
 

Personally I'm still overjoyed that last patch Area SAMs no longer fire on spotter aircraft.

I've spent a LOT of time experimenting with various size and EW ratings for UAV's. So far I can't say as I've had much success at keeping the AI MPAD hordes from blowing them outta the sky sooner far more often then later.

Just "one of those things".

Re: The UAV Club
 

In my honest opinion, UAV/Hellfire for USA OOB and MQ1 Predator A in the USMC OOB need to be updated.

They carry in the typical payload NOT ONLY ONE HELLFIRE, BUT TWO.


http://defense-update.com/products/p/predator.htm

Regards, luigim

Re: The UAV Club
 

I recall A-10s sometimes carry two Mavericks, one armed and one disarmed to use as a target designator. That might be it but since the Hellfire has a purely passive seeker probably not.

The other possibility is that the Predator is carrying a Finder mini-UAV in the other pylon to locate targets.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miniatu...d_.22Finder.22

It's also not unknown for Predators to carry just one Hellfire in combat. Maybe they don't want the operators wasting $60000 missiles.

The reasons why are probably classified, but I don't know if it's normal to fire two Hellfires in flight because the airframe can barely handle one launch without falling apart. The Predator actually uses a special Hellfire with reduced thrust to prevent that.

But since I see pictures of MQ 1s with two missiles all the time, it probably makes sense to change the Predator loadout to two Hellfires.

Re: The UAV Club
 

The standard predator has already been upgraded to 2 hellfires. The latest version the MQ-9 Reaper..... carries 14

Don

Re: The UAV Club
 

Looks like Al Qaeda now has + 5 Defense on rolls against drones.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...usaolp00000003

Would be amusing if the brown-green cars in the Al Qaeda OOB got reduced size or an EW point.

Re: The UAV Club
 

So is Al Qaeda claiming they've invented camouflage?
Or that they just figured out how to use it?

Re: The UAV Club
 

Just came across this interesting article on NAV's some might find interesting. The videos are worth a look as well. DRDO is tasked to make them smaller and smarter. You don't to read this however, the next time you're in the garden etc. and "spy" a beetle on a plant, you just might want to make it's not really spying on you!
http://www.airforce-technology.com/f...-in-the-skies/

And a new mini UAV SpyLite from Israel.
http://www.airforce-technology.com/p...ni-uav-system/

Regards,
Pat

Re: The UAV Club
 

That SpyLite looks fairly similar to the original UAVs from the 80's.
Basically a model airplane with a camera mounted in the nose.

I also recall reading they made a 40mm round for the M203 with a camera in the nose.

Re: The UAV Club
 

If nothing else this will provide a very good start point for the small UAV types, countries and capabilities of these "craft". They are more capable then is being discussed, for instance the first has an IR integrated system and can carrying a payload to pick up up acoustic "signatures" etc. Also in Post #1 I listed further good sites that cover the topic. In no particular country order.

CANADA: Aeryon SkyRanger sUAS...
http://www.airforce-technology.com/p...kyranger-suas/

SWEDEN: APID-55 VTOL Miniature UAV. This does more fall into the class of a intermediate class but, you need to be aware this class does exist so as not to deprive anyone (Country) not to have them.
http://www.airforce-technology.com/p...ro-apid55-uav/

U.S.: Avinc Puma AE Unmanned Aerial Vehicle...
http://www.airforce-technology.com/p...vincpumaaeuav/

Avinc Wasp Unmanned Aerial Vehicle...
http://www.airforce-technology.com/p.../avincwaspuav/

Bat Unmanned Aerial Vehicle (UAV), again of the more medium class with the difference being as the lead picture shows needing more logistical support though it's still a off map battlefield UAV.
http://www.airforce-technology.com/p...ropgrummanbat/

ISRAEL: BirdEye 400 Unmanned Aerial Vehicle...
http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/birdeye400/

AUSTRIA: Camcopter S-100 UAV another medium class, much in line with SWEDEN's above.
http://www.airforce-technology.com/p...opters-100uav/

TAIWAN: Another "backpack" UAV that are probaly entering the field now.
http://www.airforce-technology.com/p...rcraft-system/

That'll get you through the "C's" the rest were more in the standard version larger versions. As you can their would be work hear just insuring these countries get them into the game-I'm not saying it's not worth the effort necessarily however this is opening a can of worms for forum members who might be finding that "I didn't know we had those!" I don't blame them as generally speaking these are slightly less of a niche than Gunships in the overall scheme of things and you have to realize the "Big Players" no longer have exclusive rights to having "eyes in the sky" even if that means a few 100m over the next treeline.

About http://www.airforce-technology.com/ 1. On the left side second "box" down, click on
"See All Projects".

2. In the middle column, you'll see "By Category", then click on "Unmanned Aerial Vehicles (UAV / (UCAV) (81), as you can see they cover 81 types.

Funny how when this started the conversation was all over the forum. There was enthusiasm for the thread, it died sort of, and cycles back. The way of the forum at times. But note some of this been around for a very longtime including a Russian one I found going back to the late 70's/or early 80's. Amazing.

Have a great day!

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: The UAV Club
 

It's been at least 6 years now since this thread was "needed" so to my mind it's like "one stop shopping" like the others. As I noted in Post #11 (Just checked those links and they are all working, including those on Pg. 1.) above...
"Funny how when this started the conversation was all over the forum. There was enthusiasm for the thread, it died sort of, and cycles back. The way of the forum at times."

For me and after long thought it's (This thread.) cycled back just from the simple fact of organization among others.

I'll be using it again, for my own purposes as noted. Please feel free to do the same if you wish.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: The UAV Club
 

Two new drones described here

UJ-23 "Topaz" Ukrainian indigenous loitering munition used now with WB warmate
https://en.defence-ua.com/weapon_and...army-3987.html

And here article about Revolver 860 Taiwanese drone for Ukraine
https://en.defence-ua.com/events/tai...bild-4009.html

Anti-drone electromagnetics rifles build already on Ukraine
https://en.defence-ua.com/weapon_and...pads-3966.html

Re: The UAV Club
 

Just do like to mention that is first real proof that Russian used on eastern front Iranian kamikaze loitering drones Shahed-136

https://en.defence-ua.com/weapon_and...pecs-4207.html

Re: The UAV Club
 

Now info about Ukrainian made loitering munition is called RAM II Drones they are already build and used and earlier were reported as unknown locally made simple kamikaze drones. But in fact are quite advanced and used probably since beginning of Russian invasion. https://en.defence-ua.com/weapon_and...rone-4513.html

https://en.defence-ua.com/media/cont...6f2e47dd43.jpg

Information what was found inside Shahed-136
https://en.defence-ua.com/weapon_and..._136-4446.html

And what is most usefully weapon to fight against Iranian drones
https://en.defence-ua.com/weapon_and...orun-4514.html

Re: The UAV Club
 

Here practical fight with Shahed-136 by Ukrainian Police they prepare post when they try shot down passing vehicle they are hard to be captured by radars because are slow and flight on low altitude but have very loud engines and policemen can spot them by loudness.

Article and movie from shooting down
https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-ato...s-in-kyiv.html

https://www.facebook.com/1609570575/...9479811608185/


https://en.defence-ua.com/news/ukrai...ones-4585.html

https://en.defence-ua.com/weapon_and...orun-4514.html

Re: The UAV Club
 

The Shahed seems little more than a 21st century V-1

Re: The UAV Club
 

There is not only Shahed they also mention about small number of Kub and Lancet drones. They created Mobile Firing Group (MFG) which may be worth to add to OOB

https://en.defence-ua.com/analysis/u...ense-4599.html

Re: The UAV Club
 

New info about Ukrainian drones

They have now more WB Warmate lothering munitions drones https://mil.in.ua/en/news/armed-forc...ing-munitions/

Their locally build UAV Shark https://mil.in.ua/en/news/ukrspecsys...new-shark-uav/

Horlytsia UAV build by Antonov https://en.defence-ua.com/weapon_and...like-4720.html

Re: The UAV Club
 

Can (should?) this be represented in WinSPMBT?

By 2018, the Marine Corps was deploying a Counter-Unmanned Aerial System (C-UAS) that can be mounted onto an M-ATV.

https://news.usni.org/2018/06/04/mar...killing-system

Re: The UAV Club
 

Manufacturing of standarised bombs for UAV is already on the way

https://en.defence-ua.com/industries...ombs-6270.html

https://en.defence-ua.com/analysis/h...tant-6229.html

meaby its time to add this small robots also as a bombers inside game ??

Re: The UAV Club
 

Then we need to prepare to enter them for at least 2/3 of all the OOB's in the game. We have SO MANY COUNTRIES that don't even have any UAV'S etc. etc. in this game but, in the RL do.

To some degree it at times boils down to the "Have and Have Nots" but more to the point it was more a case of the few having the technology versus those that didn't at the time for several years until the technology became more widespread.

I believe when I started this, that in my first Post, I hoped someone or others would do the submissions in this area. Also, I'm sure I also posted just a small portion of what was already available back then.

EDIT: Just note the dates between my Post 11 and the next Post 12 from me.

Kind of indicative of what I already wrote about next below.

The push has always been Armor and Artillery and to a somewhat lesser extent Infantry, Helos, Planes and Jets etc. etc.

The thread Posts and Views speak volumes to what I just noted above.

To qoute one of my all-time favorite movies and taking Armor and Artillery from above into consideration,

"Are you not entertained!?!"

So, there you go in a "nutshell".

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: The UAV Club
 

Weapon Class=27 (NLOS ATGM, i.e. no line of sight anti-tank guided missile) does a pretty good job of replicating a suicide drone. As to armed ones, there are several in the US and USMC OOBs.

The REAL question is how many do people have?
Is a dozen, fifty, one hundred of something worth creating a unit/formation for?

If you need one just use the "Captured" option when purchasing forces.

Re: The UAV Club
 

Not a UAV per se but close enough and supposedly they are being given to Ukraine

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ion-detonating

Build enough of these things and the effect on an armoured assault would be little different than the English Longbowmen at Agincourt\

Longbow would be an excellent name for something like this... way better than ALTIUS-600M

Re: The UAV Club
 

Here are articles about others new bombs for Ukraine drones which will use a dive bomber tatics like Ju-87 stuka and after release of bomb will come back to operator so this will be not a suicide drone.
https://en.defence-ua.com/weapon_and...ideo-6364.html
https://mil.in.ua/en/news/ukrainian-...or-fpv-drones/


Russian from others side using now various drones with MON-50 mines in one way missions.
https://en.defence-ua.com/news/fpv_d...e_of-6376.html

Re: The UAV Club
 

That can easily be done by putting regular bombs (vice guided) on a UAV such as those currently in some OOBs.

The main issue is ...
How many do they have?

It's highly impractical to create a unit and formation for something that exists only in small quantities, i.e. less then say 500.

There are a limited number of unit slots in each OOB (999) and many of the major nations have them filled already since the game covers a 75 year time frame. So what do you remove to add something new?

Take advantage of the ability to purchase units from any OOB and date range via the use of the "Captured" option. If you want you can give the 1946 Soviets an M1A2 SEP Abrams.

Re: The UAV Club
 

I was wondering how such a small drone could take out tanks when it was designed as an anti-personal weapon.

That's because it can't.

The USA is no longer buying them (SB 300) and the SWITCH BLADE 600 is a private venture project NOT BOUGHT by the USA. From the ref.

"The Wrong Tool for the Job?
We have more information and more videos of the Switchblade 300 in Ukraine, where the response has been lukewarm.

This is a different type of war, and the key targets are Russian tanks, air defenses, and artillery for which the anti-personnel Switchblade 300 is unsuited.

A larger version, the Switchblade 600, was promised to Ukraine last year and small numbers have reportedly arrived in the last few weeks. This version was launched as a private venture and has not yet been acquired by the U.S. military. The upsized loitering munition boasts longer range and a more powerful warhead capable of destroying armored vehicles."
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/techn...073fc8f0&ei=31

I don't know how it's set up for the game against armor, artillery and anti-air sites but as the article suggests it's not been successful against those targets.

It's a "sniper weapon" for precision strikes against people we don't like in the terrorist business etc.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: The UAV Club
 

Given the range, warhead size, and weight of the Switch Blade 300 I really don't see it being any more useful then just replacing it with more 120mm mortar ammo.

That said if you need a couple for an ambush/raid/etc. they could be useful ... BUT ... useful enough to bother buying, storing, maintaining, training in the use of, transporting to the right place at the right time to be used?

Re: The UAV Club
 

From: https://www.armyrecognition.com/defe...ntent=cmp-true

Re: The UAV Club
 

Well, this will be where I'll put my defensive anti-drone info alongside what's already here as these issues are "hand in hand" topics.

Some of what's really not being mentioned here;
APS:
"Manufacturers are taking notice already of how readily adaptable hard-kill APSs might be for tackling uncrewed aerial threats. Israel's Elbit Systems says its Iron Fist system "can detect a drone or a loitering munition at around 1.5 km range" and has "successfully engaged drones simulating loitering munitions attack profiles" in testing, according to a story last year from EDR Online.

Iron Fist is a hard-kill APS that uses small active electronically scanned array (AESA) radars as its primary sensors to spot incoming threats and then uses projectiles with explosive warheads fired from small turreted launchers to knock them down. Passive infrared sensors are also an option for use with Iron Fist." From this month.
https://news.yahoo.com/tank-active-p...000944906.html

USA LIDS/USMC MADIS (Same system overall.) :
"Advantages KuRFS and Coyote bring to the Army’s LIDS

KuRFS:

LIDS is deployable as either mobile or fixed, relocatable platforms.

Multi-mission KuRFS is so accurate, it can detect a 9mm bullet, and it has few false alarms or dropped tracks.

The radar offers flexibility of fixed relocatable (KuRFS) and mobile (Ku720) deployment options.

Precision targeting KuRFS discriminates between actual targets and clutter.

Coyote:

Coyote is able to down drones at longer ranges and higher altitudes than other systems.

Coyote Block 2 kinetic effectors defeat single drones and swarms of varied size and maneuverability.

The Coyote effectors are affordable; therefore, cost-effective to counter UAS threats." From AUG. 2023.
https://breakingdefense.com/2023/08/...gainst-drones/

What does "kinetic effectors" sound like to you? That's right, exactly what APS uses. The above testing took place in the Summer of 2022 if I read it correctly. Seen a couple of articles while looking into this that are saying the USA has already fielded them.

I can say for sure that the USMC MADIS will be fielded MAYBE this year, have to re-read the article I saved on MADIS and will post it in here.

There is so much going on defensive systems but to a degree is being "lost" on all the offensive side of the discussion.

Andy and Dons problem will be with some OOB's is where to put it all with all the new "standard" game land and air equipment to come and what's not already in but, ready to be added as they are fielded.

Something I know they are well aware of.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: The UAV Club
 

Drone and counter-drone systems would require work (i.e. coding) to implement "properly".

Right now drones are just a variant of Observation Aircraft and any counter-drone systems would be, by necessity (i.e. the game code) Anti-Aircraft weapons.

I'm sure you can all see the potential problems that arise.

Re: The UAV Club
 

I absolutely do see the issues here. And you're right those defensive systems should act as normal AA/SAM systems.

The following are doing so in the RL concerning smaller drones etc. like Iron Dome, GEPHART and PANTSIR-S1/S2 are taking them out very effectively along with other systems in the real world.

Will those systems do so in the game, is something I have no knowledge of in my AI battle world.

Much more armor has been taken out by precision munitions i.e. BONUS, EXCALIBUR and more with the use of observers, drones and helos lazing the targets or relaying the coordinates.

My view quite honestly at this point in time with self-defense systems already out there a many more to come soon, is that it's about a "wash" much like air superiority is over the Ukraine at this time.

Russia like Germany during the Battle of Britain lost their opportunity by waiting too long to act and by changed tactics.

Read a book on the topic and you'd fully come to appreciate how close Germany came to defeating Britain in the air. Same can be said of the Russians before all that Western air defense systems arrived in country.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: The UAV Club
 

At least Andy was able to jiggle the code so Area SAMs (i.e. "Surface to Air Missile" Weapon Class 12) do not fire on drones. So we don't see a $6-10,000,000 Patriot missiles wasted on a $2,000 micro-drones.
YAY ANDY!

But any/everything else, including a squads rifles, will shoot at them. The same way you can shoot down a helo with a tanks main gun if it sits still long enough (best way to deal with the infamous MI-24 Hind).

Re: The UAV Club
 

Russia creates MiS-35 hexacopter drone that comes back when communication is lost


https://armyrecognition.com/defense_...n_is_lost.html

Re: The UAV Club
 

I expect to see SEAD systems on larger/more expensive drones.

"Jam me and get a little something for your trouble."

Re: The UAV Club
 

If it can be mounted on a drone, it will be.
If a larger drone is needed to carry the weapon, it will be built.
That is the new reality of the battlefield

Re: The UAV Club
 

Well based on the last two posts I'd say what I just found out is very timely indeed. :D

It's only just been tested so it's not on the battlefield yet but, I have no doubt we'll find out soon enough when it does appear.

For now, the score appears to be Russia 1 Everyone Else 0.
https://www.armyrecognition.com/defe...ight_mode.html

And it appears while we're "stepping down" due to political posturing in the "House" the EU as a whole is "stepping up" where several countries are increasing their supply of weapons by any means possible. The below is just one example of this. If you haven't been keeping up with the news I (My "boat".) participated in what is still considered the largest NATO Naval Exercise to date.
https://www.armyrecognition.com/defe...ense_deal.html

NATO however just started the largest Combined Arms exercise since the Cold War.

Germany has accessed in their long-term planning for the Ukrainian War; that WWIII (Non-Nuclear) could occur in 2025.

You don't even want to know where the "Dooms Day" clock is at. :p
We are living in an interesting time.

ADD ON AFTER I JUST LEFT:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world...85c84bc2c&ei=3

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: The UAV Club
 

Look around at what has been happening politically and socially in the "west" in the last half-decade for the answer

If an old adversary looks weak and foolish expect someone to try and exploit that

You will recall the hearings into Harvard etc etc handled the Hamas supporters

Consider how the Russians are handling eduction

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world...17381f15&ei=24

INDEED "interesting times"

Re: The UAV Club
 

UAV related.

US Ground drones/robots in development.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhaawIbfqYE

Re: The UAV Club
 

I thought that video was real good until that integrated jewellery advertisement, so I couldn't watch the whole thing, sorry. I just hope my computer doesn't catch a virus from the thing. It should be OK though, it's just the "sh*t hits than fan" when I see commercialism nowadays, there's so much of it wherever you look.

Re: The UAV Club
 

Yeah, wish there was a way to remove that stuff.

Re: The UAV Club
 

Youtube - annd many news sites - are only watchable if you have an ad blocker installed.

I have:
-Privacy Badger
-uBlock Origin
-NoScript
-Disable HTML5 Autoplay

installed in my Firefox browser - its a simple thing to add, just tools->Add-Ons and type in the names of the above. The microsoft browser may have these available as well - but I dont use theirsas its the most targeted by exploiters....

Once installed, after a little bit of training to whitelist sites you do want to interact with you - no pop up adverts, usable youtube. The disable HTML5 Autoplay helps with news sites that want to fire up 99 different simultaneously running stupid videos on articles you havent read yet (or dont have the slightest interest in, like the CarCrashians say). Bliss.

Re: The UAV Club
 

I think the ad he was referring to was part of the video and done by the person that posted it.

Re: The UAV Club
 

Oh - an embedded advert by the presenter?.

Easily skipped over.

1) note that your presenter is in "advertising" mode
2) immediately pause your youtube video
3) now use the mouse to browse along the video's track line till the advert seems over by looking at the preview picture shown above the track line. Then, click on that part of the track line
4) and finally, press play and continue watching actual content

easy peasy, lemon squeezy.

Re: The UAV Club
 

Yup.

Re: The UAV Club
 

Is this even a real question?

https://www.moore.army.mil/Armor/eAR...12%20Payne.pdf

Re: The UAV Club
 

Romania taking a major step forward in this area by purchasing the Bayraktar TB2 the latest version in this "family". I would recommend a START of OCT 2024. That date will allow for the numbers to make this worthwhile and allow some time to prep the ones delivered sometime this SEP. From what I can find; it looks like they'll get both weapons as noted in the article.
https://www.armyrecognition.com/news...-aerial-drones
https://baykartech.com/en/uav/bayraktar-tb2/
https://www.army-technology.com/proj...-tactical-uav/
https://www.bing.com/videos/rivervie...5784&FORM=VIRE

The video is pretty good gets into other current users and weapons.

This video was interesting for a different reason and is indictive and should act as a cautionary tale. For every counter there is a counter measure.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OlG2Meqombg&t=149s


Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: The UAV Club
 

Forget lasers, electronic jammers etc. etc. the revival of the shotgun is in full force in our military again though it never truly went away in the first place.

Some European militaries are taking notice, and some are already equipping units.

It's cheap and a very effective way to deal with the drone situation.

The question you need to ask yourself is why we haven't in the last few months heard more about tanks being blown up like we did up until about the first of the year?

Just maybe those countermeasures are working.

The primary drone use as is being recorded at this time in the KURSK area is in the more traditional observation and targeting role.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/video/webc...1396d44&ei=155

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: The UAV Club
 

Well in my last post it showed how easy it was to bring down drones with a simple shotgun and you don't exactly have to be on target just close enough for a couple of pellets to do the job. I suspect I might know the type shot they'd use to maximize both range and impact. We might or might not necessarily use the same shot that is not commercially available to the public.

Now you'll see some of what's already being in combat now but, what's soon to come or is just now getting fielded.

With this "zeal" by some to get these drones into the game, I hope this same "zeal" is applied to defensive systems such as the GEPHARD which has time and time again more than proved its abilities to bring these systems down and how old is the GEPHARD?
https://www.msn.com/en-us/video/webc...26c02d60&ei=54

Also, Israel has already tested "Iron Fist" against drones successfully take them out to 1.2km apparently with no misses with "360 degree" protection. More on that later.

OK, TROPHY has also been tested successfully to within the limitations of the system but unlike "Iron Fist" TROPHY is limited by the fact the launchers/actuators are set to a 55-degree angle however after that testing I'm sure you all have figured out that they are already looking to modify and improve that situation. But as above more on that later when I can post those refs.

Germany has one also, another APS system that's proven very successful against drones etc. as well.

It might also affect how many shots a unit gets based on watching the German video. How many of us have experienced multiple shots from anti-tank units in the same turn?

Regards,
Pat
:capt: