The Maddening Multiplex
 

The way I thought Multiplex worked was as follows:

1) PDC do not need it

2) Shooter picks a target per Fleet and Empire options and shoots until target destroyed or shooter runs out of applicable weapons,

3) Next and subsequent shooters fire,

4) After all shooters have run their first pass, either all shooters move or not but, in either case,

5) The first shooter is checked again to see if have any unfired weapons AND a Multiplex of at least 2 target rating,

6) If #5 is "yes," then first shooter fires until target destroyed or runs out of weapons applicable to that new target,

7) Now #2 shooter checked, as per #6,

8) Now #1 shooter is checked again, for unfired weapons and a Multiplex rating of 3,

9) Process continues until all shooters have fired all weapons, run out of targets, or maxed their Multiplex setting.

However, this does NOT seem to be what is happening. Now, I am running the Last non-Gold Version, so perhaps it is just another thing fixed for just Gold.

What I have had happen is Huge Bases with Multiplex (they might not even need it) will leave large numbers of weapons unfired despite a host of ripe and in-range targets. I have lost bases, battles, warp points, and even systems before I just gave up on Multiplex.

The problem also occurs with massive WP sets on Planets, and large warships. The smaller ships have less of a problem, mainly because there are fewer weapons to fail to fire.

I have tried work-arounds such as:

- vary weapon types to make shooter change weapons

- vary targeting orders,

- stick PDCs in between other weapons,

- stick non-weapons in between weapons Groups,

and other things, but to no avail.

Any thoughts? Ideas?

[ June 21, 2002, 01:25: Message edited by: jim ]

Re: The Maddening Multiplex
 

Yes, you can also set the percentage of damage per target under strategies (the crown button in the main screen, then the strategies button). I think that what is happening is the AI is allocating as much damage as it thinks will be required to destroy a target and doesn't 'recalculate' and reassign the weapons when it succeeds more easily than it expects. It may also be that the damage bonuses from mounts are not being taken into account. Try setting the percentage of damage per target at different levels and see if this changes multiplex behavior.

[ June 21, 2002, 01:39: Message edited by: Baron Munchausen ]

Re: The Maddening Multiplex
 

I experience the problem even when I do not direct the shooter to switch targets after a set damage inflicted.

That is, even if I have it set not to shift fire until after the target is destroyed, it still does not shoot at a second (or sometimes a thrid) target when it has available in range targets.

For example, I'll have a monster base, with gazillions of shield accelerators and APBs. The AI will come at it with several LCs. The base will kill the first, have well over half of its weapons left, and it will not shoot. Once in a while, it will shoot (and kill 2), but it will not use the rest on others. I'll know darn well how many weapons it has, but it will not use them all. I have counted the range, and that's not it.

Re: The Maddening Multiplex
 

Jim I tested the multiplex in the simulator (SE IV Gold Version 1.67) and it worked as it should: my huge ship with multiplex V destroyed five attacking light cruiser in one single combat turn.

Re: The Maddening Multiplex
 

Yea Jim, I've seen that often enough and there is no fix yet. Q, multiplex works when you are doing the shooting, but I've never seen the AI shooting at 5 targets in one turn, even if it has the weapons remaining.

Re: The Maddening Multiplex
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Maybe; although I've also seen the AI fire at multiple targets without moving in between. Of course, in that case it was a mostly seeker-armed ship with a couple beam weapons, and it launched a couple missiles at the largest ship, then fired it's two beam weapons at the closest ship, and finally launched the rest of it's missiles at the largest ship again. So maybe that makes a difference.

On the other hand, I do know that my Point-Defense cannons change "targets" only after moving. For instance, one of my dedicated point-defense ships will destroy all missiles in a given square, then move one space, then fire at the missiles in another square.

Re: The Maddening Multiplex
 

Hmm.
From my own testings i can say that usualy the AI calculates the damage from the weapons requied to kill the target(lightcruiser = 400), then adds a little from itself. Then the remaining weapons go on the rest if possible.

I do not know how accurate is that but what i've tried was base with large repulsers. I did count the damage from the repulsers, it skipped just enough to kill the ship IF it was actually damaging weapon.

I dont know though. I think this should be realy looked upon by Aaron because it makes largest ships pretty useless when swarmed by smaller ships.

Re: The Maddening Multiplex
 

Am I right, then, that this phenomenon is a bug?

It seems worse for planet WP stacks and Bases, almost as bad for BaseShips.

Does it affect only non-Gold games?

(So far, I ignore it, and accept as just another handicap that I conceded to the AI - along with high difficulty, high bonus, no Intel, no Mines, don't use Training, and put the AI(s) ahead of me in the Player #. BTW, can anyone recommend a non-Gold AI that I will get a game with, 1-on-1 under those conditions? Small, Medium, Large, or Huge galaxy, 2K-3K-5K, I don't care. Intel led to easy wins, as did mines, as did Stellar Manipulation, as did Training - so I disable all but the Last, leaving it because some AIs do use Training.)

Re: The Maddening Multiplex
 

I think the problem might be related to the fact that bases cannot move... Am I wrong or ships move before changing targets?

Re: The Maddening Multiplex
 

You know what it is? Damn those weapons technicians, but after scoring a crippling hit on a ship, they get out of their chairs and do their silly victory dance for the rest of the combat turn http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Re: The Maddening Multiplex
 

What I'd really like to see is the ability to set what order the ship will fire its weapons in, regardless of component order. I'd like to just click tractor beams five times, repulser beams five times, then add shield depleters and beams to fill it up. Put the firing order in as tractor beams, shield depleters, beams, repulser beams. Ideally, what would then happen with multiplex tracking 5 is that all five tractors would pick a different target. The shield depleters would then either fire on one ship at a time until all the shields are gone, or simply follow the current model. Then the damaging weapons would fire, then the repulser beams would fire.

You can do this in tactical combat, and it would be great to be able to do it in strategic combat. The idea is to have a decked-out starbase that pulls five ships right up to it, smashes them, the sends those same five flying some 25+ spaces away.

Re: The Maddening Multiplex
 

Yes, we've requested a configurable firing order before. If you could just supply a list of weapon family numbers in the order you want them fired you could do this and many other things.