Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

Each empire gets one palace at start. You are only allowed one palace per empire. Your palace should grant bonus production to host planet and local combat bonuses. But the draw back is if it is distroyed your empire starts to break up. Let's say it makes all of your colonies become very angry. This would allow them to revolt. Everything goes back to normal after a new palace is created.

How difficult would it be to place that in the game? Could it be modded in?

[ July 23, 2002, 21:20: Message edited by: atomannj ]

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

That couldn't be modded in at this point. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

and if youre really dippy: you build your palace on top of a swamp, have it burnt and sacked twice, and keep rebuilding it in the same danm place out of pure stubborn arogance.

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

I actually like this idea.

Really, there is nothing that differentiates a homeworld from any other besides population masses. This struck me as perhaps a missing element when I first started playing.

The palace concept at least touches on the psychological aspects of 4x type games...

Beings are motivated by history, territory, and symbols. Just look at us humans.

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

Play Proportions. Homeworlds are definitely very, very different than colonies in that mod. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

It all depends on what you mean by "break up." The CapitalMod, in its first Version, adds palaces to the game, but really only as a way to tell the capital of an empire from the rest of the planets. As yet, I have it givin some minor bonuses, like combat and it stops all star and planet destroyers. However, I do have grand future plans for this mod which will give the palace a more important role, so that if it is destroyed it will severely affect one's empire.

I am not completely sure if this would work, so I'd appreciate some input. But what if you dropped the minimum resource storage for an empire down to almost nothing, maybe even nothing. Then added to the palace facility a large storage ability, and reduced the other storage facilities to small increments or got rid of them altogether. Almost like a central grainary.

This idea depends upon how resources are computed. Not entirely sure, but I think this would hurt any empire operating at a any kind of a loss. Just an idea.

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

Yeah, anyone running in the red would be absolutly toasted by losing the palace then. Especially if you eliminate the other storage faciliites. A sneak attack on your home planet by your largest trade partner stabbing you in the back could knock you out of the game in one shot.

Without some way to only allow one palace per empire though, it would be tough. It's have to be a gentelman's agreement not to build any more.

Geoschmo

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

I figure Malfador could make some changes to accommodate. This is what I think the palace should be able to do:

- +15% to attack and defense in system
- bonus to moral in system
- +15% production bonus on capital planet
- +15% research & intel bonus on planet
- palace has a high hitpoint defense (3000pt+)
- loss of palace severely lowers empire moral
- limited to one capital per empire

Malfador, any chance adding this in? How difficult could this be to complete? We could mod most of this except for the moral and one palace limit.

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I guess you could give everyone one of these at the start of the game, and then make the facility really expensive to build... I'm talking astronomically expensive. Then people wouldn't build extras, atleast not until well into the later phases of the game. By then, who knows, maybe they've discovered decentralized government http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

automannj,
all of that can be done...except the Last two. What hinders creating effective palaces are any empire effcting abilities.

There are two ways to go. The Proportions way, where in making it a long arduous process to build alternative centers of everything, you make the homeworld indispensible. So then if the palace has abilities which significantly hurt the homeworld, you accomplished your goal. To me that is the more realistic way to go.

Or try to make the palace itself important. This is nearly impossible given the present abilities available.

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

You know, come to think of it, why doesn't this game contain some sort of order/command aspect like quite a few wargames.

Either every command or perhaps only every military command takes an order.

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">That is certainly an option. Two problems with it though are if you have a multi planet start, you would get one on each homeworld, not just one for the empire. And secondly, if they are astronomically expensive you can't rebuild them if destroyed. That would be allright for some people, that is what they prefer for the palaces. But others are of the opinion you should be able to rebuild it if destroyed, or relocate it if needed. But just not have more than one at anyone time.

Geo

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

All good points. That why I put it to the attn of Malfador. Maybe they could add some more functionality to this excellent game. The ability to limit only one structure shouldn't be to hard for them to add. Also adding an emipire wide effect would be very cool too. It shouldn't even effect the current AI.

I hope they consider this addition.

[ July 23, 2002, 21:44: Message edited by: atomannj ]

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Haha!!! Am I the only one to get the joke??? It's the White House dummies!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

or.... a quote from memory from the holy grail

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

RE: sacked and burned twice
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Sorry, no. The White House was only successfully sacked and burned once, by (IMHO) Canadian troops acting under the British Flag. It is my understanding that the buffet was quite good http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

Canadians.. phooey. the Brits burned the thing in 1814. there might have been a few Canadians along for the ride, but the way i hear it, they were too drunk to participate. hell, i dont even think canada was an independant country then. Proudest moment in Canadian history, sheesh. I think you guys would be more proud of your astounding performance in WWI rather than your minor involvement in the burning of a city that you didn't have all that much to do with.

my history isnt the best though, because the incident i was thinking of when was washington burned for the second time in 1864, it was actually Washington, NC. heck, for all I know, the Canadians could be responsible for that one too. chalk up the 1989 earthquake to them, too.

ah well, if its any consolation, we set the roof on fire in the 1920s. i dont think there was so much sacking involved for that, though.

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

Well, back to the main subject. Malfador, what do you think?

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

back to the main subject, i dont think i have seen Aaron comment on this board once in its entire history, and its unlikely that he reads it with any kind of regularity. The best way to reach him (I have gotten responses the couple times I had a reason to email him) is se4@malfador.com

the best way to get features in though, is to harass the beta brigade, the cabal of long time malfador fanatics that have been playing this game since before it had a roman numeral after the title.

as for the feature request though, i think its a good idea. some where there is an old thread with lots of nifty ideas about what a palace should do, it might be worthwile to do a search to dig it up. that way we could get a list together of all the best ideas for what a palace should do, and send MM one organized request instead of a bunch of different ones.

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

Good idea. Well, let's put up a list of options to be emailed to Malfador for the Palace.

Here is my two cents:
- +15% to attack and defense in system
- bonus to moral in system
- +15% production bonus on capital planet
- +15% research & intel bonus on planet
- palace has a high hitpoint defense (3000pt+)
- loss of palace severely lowers empire moral
- limited to one capital per empire

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

I was kinda keeping track of that thread oh so long ago. It was called Intergalactic Civil War. There was even a primitive poll I did of what people thought about the civil war and palace ideas. If you dig it up, there should be a topic summary somewhere near the top. I did send both the summary and the poll results to MM. They said they'd move it to the top of the feature request, but nothing has been done, as far as i know, since.

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">you know, only the Last two of those things are not supported now. if you make the palace ability unique across the empire, and make its loss impact morale, you could easily add any of the other abilities to the same facility.

perhaps some new ability ideas would be empire wide bonus to morale, production, intel, or research.

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

There's an interview with Aaron at, what is it, se4.org, where he talks about adding palaces. Since the destruction of facilities are tied to population, he said they were too easy to kill. Or something like that. Sounded like they were in a beta and then were taken out...not sure, that is just speculation based on his statement.

There is perhaps a long workaround, but it would involve taking one of the three resources out of any production of vehicles, components or anything else. Use say organics. Then make the only component using them the bridge. Call it morale points or discipline points. Make most of these points be generated by the palace. Perhaps the player can build some military garrisons that generate a small amount of them or something to that effect. Then if the palace falls, the military dissolves. Or so in theory.

Re: Attn: Richard/Malfador: Palace use idea
 

Good news from Malfador. I heard back from Aaron and he said that "Its a great idea. We'll add it to our Wanted list."