Counter intelligence projects?
 

I am a bit confused on how the counter-intelligence projects work in Empires (F9)/Intelligence.

Whenever the counter-intelligence project is completed, it says it has failed. What gives? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

And what is the difference between the levels? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

Different levels store more points.

You don't want to complete counter-intel projects. They work by using the points stored in them to defeat enemy projects. If you are not spending any points in counter-intel, no stored points in it will be used at all, so always make sure to be spending points in counter-intel at all times.

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Ah-so!

Where are the points stored? Do they accumulate if not used?

And what if there are a number of attacks...is it possible for the "stored points" to be overwhelmed and one or more of the intelligence assaults (enemy projects) to succeed?

These may seem like dumb questions...but I want to be sure I got it right! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">They are 'stored' in the little green progress bar at the bottom of the project.
They do accumalate. If too many have accumalated push the counter intel back to the end of your queue and make sure you don't divide the intel points.

They can be overwhelmed.

Askan (who can't spell, or type)

[ August 23, 2002, 08:10: Message edited by: Askan Nightbringer ]

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

Ahhh...

More stuff to micro-manage! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

Its not too bad.
You can just get some counter intel for a few turns, stick it at the back and not worry about it unless other empires really try to intel you out of the game (and the events list will report all blocked attempts).

Askan

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

So, if a person has a choice between 3 levels of counter-intelligence, then he would be wise to select #3, because of its greater capacity to store points?

[ August 23, 2002, 08:25: Message edited by: tbontob ]

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

One point in level 3 is worth 3 points in level 1.

With level 3 counter intel you only need to produce a third of the enemy's intel to shut him out.

Being able to store more points as well is just a plus (and remember you can have a couple of counter intel projects hanging around at the end).

Askan

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I am not clear as to what you mean by this phrase?

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

Move the projects to the end of the queue.

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

Right...it was a stupid question!

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

There's no such thing as a silly question! I was trying to sort out what was happening to my counter-intelligence projects, and found this thread on a search. I hadn't realized that the points in the project are "used" along the way to foil the enemy's plans. Thanks, tbontob, for asking the right questions, and thanks to all for the answers!

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Technomage, I thank you for the support. I sometimes wonder if I am making a nuisance of myself. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif And yes, thanks to all of you who take the time to answer our questions. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ September 19, 2002, 21:55: Message edited by: tbontob ]

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

I've been reading (or at least been trying to read) all Posts on counter intel but there are some things still unclear to me. I appologise in case I missed the explanation somewhere but this is how I understand how counter intel works.
I always have counter intel 3 going on and sometimes not 1 project (if I'm heavily attacked - not to run out of points). Now we're playing PBW SEIV gold patch2. I have ~80k of intel points and 3 counterintel 3 in a row (NOT distributing points evenly). First intel project is crew insurrection and after that - 3 counterintels3. I get the turn and see that my counterintel has NO progress at all but AI managed to get through with 2 nasty projects (one of them - planet conditions 'deadly') which made me VERY angry. _BUT_ I don't know which AI attacked me and I don't know how they managed to get through my counter intel measures. I'm pretty sure AI does not have more intel than me. And in case of multiple AI attack - why my counterintel has no progress at all?
Thanx.

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

IIRC, you must be feeding some points into counter-intel for it to be effective. That is to say, you can have 2 3/4 full counter-intel 3 at the end not receiving points and 1 counter-intel 3 after an intel project that is recieving points and the accumulated counter-intel points will protect you. I froget the exact numbers, and i'm too lazy to look right now, but lets say you have 90,000 intel points, your first project is 100,000 points, your second project is counter-intel. Turn 1, 90,000 goes to first project and none to counter. Second turn, 10,000 goes to project to complete and 80,000 goes to counter. If you get hit on turn with no points going to counter, it will get through. If you get hit on turn with points going to counter, enemy project is defeated.

Hope this makes sense.

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

Gandalph thanx for explanation. Now I think I understand it. You must have more intel points than your attack operation in order to complete it _and_ still have some points left for counter intel. Otherwise, (for example your attacking intel operation takes 2 turns to complete) counter intel is not working.

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Alternatively, you can turn on "divide points evenly" until the attack is down to 0.1 years to complete.

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

Hmmmmm.

I'd like to give a number of hypothetical situations with my conception of the results for the experts to comment on.

Hypothetical situation #1:

The AI's mount a truly massive intel assault which will take almost all of the counter-intelligence points in to withstand.

Intelligence points available for distribution is 10,000

In order of completion with divide points evenly off:
1) Intelligence project - crew insurrection, 5,000 points to complete.
2) Intelligence project - steal technology - 5,000 points to complete
3) Counter-intelligence3
4) Counter-intelligence3
5) counter-intelligence3

In this scenario, counter-intelligence is dormant and all AI operations succeed.

Hypothetical 2 is the same as hypothetical 1 except that Divide points evenly" is on. In this scenario, the enemy intelligence assault does not succeed.

Hypothetical 3 is the same as hypothetical 1 except that the intelligence points available for distribution is 10,001. In this scenario, 3) would be used up to partially withstand the AI intelligence assault. But would 4) and 5) also be used up to withstand the AI intel assault or would they remain dormant thereby allowing the AI intelligence assault to partially succeed?

Re: Counter intelligence projects?
 

As far as I know your comments in situation 1 and 2 are correct although I personally never tested the situation where you spend no more points on counter intel.
In situation 3 all counter intel projects are effective and in fact the drain on the counter intel points will start in project 5 (the Last one) and not number 3.