Damage Calculation
 

Could someone help me by giving me an in-depth explanation how damage is determined?

Just to get it started...

1) We add all the attack percentages.

2) We deduct all the defense percentages.

3) We deduct a percentage (IIRC, it is 10%) for each sector away from the target (if it is a beam weapon).

The above may be unclear, fuzzy and possibly incorrect. In all likelihood, I probably missed some things. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

So, is there anyone out there who has a a clear understanding of damage calculation. And has the time and the energy to explain it to me?

And possibly to the other readers of this thread.

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Those attack and damage modifiers only affect the chance to hit the target. Once the weapon hits, it always does the same damage (at each range). Unfortunately, there is no variable damage.

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Here's the sequence as far as I can tell. This is all stock SE4, some of this can be modded. This also applies ONLY to direct-fire weapons; seekers are different.

1) We add all the attack percentages.

2) We deduct all the defense percentages.

3) We deduct 10% for each square of range

4) The chance to hit is capped at 99% or 1% (i.e. 130% hit chance is dropped to 99%, 0% hit chance is upped to 1%)

5) Religious talisman, if any, sets the ship's hit chance to 100%

6) Hit check, hit or miss time..

7) if hit: damage. For normal weapons, Shields are hit first, then components with the Armor ability.

From there you're on your own..it's fairly simple up to this point but damage is weird and complicated.

Phoenix-D

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Thanks Phoenix-D for the excellent starting point. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I am wondering if we can make a list of factors which affect the attack and defense bonuses in a standard SE4 game.

ATTACK BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (aggressiveness)
Combat Sensors
Weapon attack bonus (for example 70% for PDC's)

DEFENCE BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (defensiveness)
ECM
[Edit] Weapon defense bonus (ie 50% for drones)

SPECIAL CASE
Religious talisman sets the bonus at 100%

The above are just what comes to mind...there must be more!

[ November 16, 2002, 02:04: Message edited by: tbontob ]

Re: Damage Calculation
 

"SPECIAL CASE
Religious talisman sets the bonus at 100%"

Err..this isn't how it works. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif What the talisman does is set the *chance to hit* to 100%. Typo? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

ATTACK BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (aggressiveness)
Combat Sensors
Weapon attack bonus (for example 70% for PDC's)
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
Fleet Experience level
Chassis bonus (ex: fighters get a 50% bonus)

DEFENCE BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (defensiveness)
ECM
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
Fleet Experience level
Scattering Armor
Stealth Armor
Chassis bonus (fighters get a 40%? bonus)

Phoenix-D

[ November 16, 2002, 02:18: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Hmmm, maybe I am missing something here.

I thought the attack and defense bonuses are used to determine the probability of a hit. And that the talisman just sets it at 100%.

In other words, the talisman is totally unaffected by the values of the attack and defense bonus as it is locks the probability of a hit at 100%

Would this be an accurate assessment?

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Yes. The key here is that the Talisman SETS it to 100% no matter what, rather than simply ADDING 100%.

No matter how much defense bonus you have, the talisman trumps it.

Without the talisman, you also get a max of 99%. Ships have been known to MISS a planet by that 1% http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Thanks Phoenix-D for your list

I am wondering if we can expand on it to include the special cases.

ATTACK BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (aggressiveness)
Combat Sensors
..lvl 1 25%
..lvl 2 45%
..lvl 3 65%
Weapon attack bonus
..PDC's 70%
..Ripper Beam 10%
..Wave-Motion Gun 30%
..High Energy Magifier 30% (crystalline)
..Tachyon Cannon 10% (temporal)
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
..lvl 1 10%
..lvl 2 15%
..lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..lvl 1 10%
..lvl 2 15%
..lvl 3 20%
Chassis bonus (ex:
..fighters 50%

DEFENCE BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (defensiveness)
ECM
..lvl 1 20%
..lvl 2 40%
..lvl 3 60%
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
..lvl 1 10%
..lvl 2 15%
..lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..lvl 1 10%
..lvl 2 15%
..lvl 3 20%
Scattering Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Stealth Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Chassis bonus
..fighters 40%? bonus

[EDIT]SPECIAL CASE
Religious talisman sets the bonus at 100% (cannot be modified by the attack/defense bonuses)

[ November 16, 2002, 02:46: Message edited by: tbontob ]

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Actually that was why I put it in as a special case...it is just automatically 100% chance to hit.

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Probably a better way to put it...

Factors which affect the probability of a hit:

ATTACK BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (aggressiveness)
Combat Sensors
..lvl 1 25%
..lvl 2 45%
..lvl 3 65%
Weapon attack bonus
..PDC's 70%
..Ripper Beam 10%
..Wave-Motion Gun 30%
..High Energy Magifier 30% (crystalline)
..Tachyon Cannon 10% (temporal)
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
..lvl 1 10%
..lvl 2 15%
..lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..lvl 1 10%
..lvl 2 15%
..lvl 3 20%
Chassis bonus (ex:
..fighters 50%

DEFENCE BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (defensiveness)
ECM
..lvl 1 20%
..lvl 2 40%
..lvl 3 60%
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
..lvl 1 10%
..lvl 2 15%
..lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..lvl 1 10%
..lvl 2 15%
..lvl 3 20%
Scattering Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Stealth Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Chassis bonus
..fighters 40%? bonus

[EDIT]SPECIAL CASE
Religious talisman sets the probability of a hit at 100% (cannot be modified by the attack/defense bonuses or changed by the 1% rule to 99%)

Re: Damage Calculation
 

The experience bonuses do not depend on tech level. Only the acutal experience a ship has.

They can be trained for "free" experience, but it takes time to complete, and they can also get up to 50% experience through battle.

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">SJ, it is a good point, I'll include it in the list a bit later...

What do you mean by 'trained for "free" experience'? Do you mean the training from the Ship Training Facility?

[ November 16, 2002, 03:07: Message edited by: tbontob ]

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Updated list.... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Factors which affect the probability of a hit:

ATTACK BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (aggressiveness)
Combat Sensors
..lvl 1 25%
..lvl 2 45%
..lvl 3 65%
Weapon attack bonus
..PDC's 70%
..Ripper Beam 10%
..Wave-Motion Gun 30%
..High Energy Magifier 30% (crystalline)
..Tachyon Cannon 10% (temporal)
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Chassis bonus (ex:
..fighters 50%

DEFENCE BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (defensiveness)
ECM
..lvl 1 20%
..lvl 2 40%
..lvl 3 60%
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Scattering Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Stealth Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Chassis bonus
..fighters 40%? bonus

[EDIT]SPECIAL CASE
Religious talisman sets the probability of a hit at 100% (cannot be modified by the attack/defense bonuses or changed by the 1% reduction rule to 99%)

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Does anyon know for sure what a fighter's defence bonus is?

I'd like to include it with the small ships and drones defensive bonuses.

Re: Damage Calculation
 

As far as determining actual damage, Death Shrines add a 5/10/15% bonus to actual damage amount for weapons fired in that system. IIRC, that is.

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Fighters have a 50% offense bonus and a 60/70/80% defense bonus for large/medium/small hulls, respectively.

Re: Damage Calculation
 

New, new list http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Factors which affect the probability of a hit:

ATTACK BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (aggressiveness)
Combat Sensors
..lvl 1 25%
..lvl 2 45%
..lvl 3 65%
Weapon attack bonus
..PDC's 70%
..Ripper Beam 10%
..Wave-Motion Gun 30%
..High Energy Magifier 30% (crystalline)
..Tachyon Cannon 10% (temporal)
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Chassis bonus (ex:
..fighters 50%

DEFENCE BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (defensiveness)
ECM
..lvl 1 20%
..lvl 2 40%
..lvl 3 60%
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Scattering Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Stealth Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Chassis bonus
..drones 50%
..fighters 40%? bonus
..escort 40%
..frigate 30%
..destroyer 20%
..light cruiser 10%
..baseship (40%) brackets denote easier to hit
..space station (20%)
..battle station (40%)
..starbase (60%)

[EDIT]SPECIAL CASE
Religious talisman sets the probability of a hit at 100% (cannot be modified by the attack/defense bonuses or changed by the 1% reduction rule to 99%)

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Thanks Krsqk for the info on fighters.

On the Shrines, it is my understanding they do not affect the probability to hit but the damage amount. So, I’ve started a new Category for damage bonus.

Factors which affect the probability of a hit:

ATTACK BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (aggressiveness)
Combat Sensors
..lvl 1 25%
..lvl 2 45%
..lvl 3 65%
Weapon attack bonus
..PDC's 70%
..Ripper Beam 10%
..Wave-Motion Gun 30%
..High Energy Magifier 30% (crystalline)
..Tachyon Cannon 10% (temporal)
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Chassis bonus
..fighters 50%

DEFENCE BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (defensiveness)
ECM
..lvl 1 20%
..lvl 2 40%
..lvl 3 60%
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Scattering Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Stealth Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Chassis bonus
..drones 50%
..fighters, small 80%
..fighters, medium 70%
..fighters, large 60%
..escort 40%
..frigate 30%
..destroyer 20%
..light cruiser 10%
..baseship (40%) brackets denote easier to hit
..space station (20%)
..battle station (40%)
..starbase (60%)

SPECIAL CASE
Religious talisman sets the probability of a hit at 100% (cannot be modified by the attack/defense bonuses or changed by the 1% reduction rule to 99%)
================================================
DAMAGE BONUS
..Death Shrine 1 (Religious) 5% damage bonus to all weapons used in system
..Death Shrine 2 (Religious) 10% damage bonus to all weapons used in system
..Death Shrine 3 (Religious) 15% damage bonus to all weapons used in system

Re: Damage Calculation
 

New, newer, newest list http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Factors which affect the probability of a hit:

ATTACK BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (aggressiveness)
..race creation points. 75% - 125% (Negative if below 100%)
..Berzerkers 10%
..Warriors 5%
..Politicians 2%
..Zealots 5%
..Engineers –5%
..Merchants -2%
..Renegades 2%
Combat Sensors
..lvl 1 25%
..lvl 2 45%
..lvl 3 65%
Weapon attack bonus
..PDC's 70%
..Ripper Beam 10%
..Wave-Motion Gun 30%
..High Energy Magifier 30% (crystalline)
..Tachyon Cannon 10% (temporal)
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Chassis bonus
..fighters 50%

DEFENCE BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (defensiveness)
..race creation points. 75% - 125% (Negative if below 100%)
..Berzerkers 10%
..Warriors 5%
..Politicians 2%
..Zealots 5%
..Engineers –5%
..Merchants -2%
..Renegades 2%
ECM
..lvl 1 20%
..lvl 2 40%
..lvl 3 60%
Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Scattering Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Stealth Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Chassis bonus
..drones 50%
..fighters, small 80%
..fighters, medium 70%
..fighters, large 60%
..escort 40%
..frigate 30%
..destroyer 20%
..light cruiser 10%
..baseship –40%
..space station –20%
..battle station –40%
..starbase –60%

SPECIAL CASE
Religious talisman sets the probability of a hit at 100% (cannot be modified by the attack/defense bonuses or changed by the 1% reduction rule to 99%)
================================================
DAMAGE BONUS
..Death Shrine 1 (Religious) 5% damage bonus to all weapons used in system

..Death Shrine 2 (Religious) 10% damage bonus to all weapons used in system
..Death Shrine 3 (Religious) 15% damage bonus to all weapons used in system

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Hey guys...don't tell me my list is perfect. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I can see one mistake http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif Who can find it? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Temporal Events Predictor gives a system-wide tohit bonus (I don't remember how much, though...) And I thought that Religious had a tohit/ecm bonus shrine, as well as the death shrine...

Re: Damage Calculation
 

For one thing, you've got the Space Combat cultural modifiers listed under the Racial Trait heading. It should be something like....

ATTACK BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (aggressiveness)
..race creation points assigned –25% to 25%
Cultural trait: space combat [fixed typo]
..Berzerkers 10%
..Warriors 5%
..Politicians 2%
..Zealots 5%
..Engineers –5%
..Merchants -2%
..Renegades 2%

...

DEFENCE BONUSES
Racial characteristic (defensiveness)
..race creation points assigned –25% to 25%
Cultural trait: space combat
..Berzerkers 10%
..Warriors 5%
..Politicians 2%
..Zealots 5%
..Engineers –5%
..Merchants -2%
..Renegades 2%

Also, certain Base and Weapon Platform mounts give a bonus to hit:

Large WP/Base Mount: +40%
Heavy WP/Base Mount: +60%
Massive WP/Base Mount: +80%

Quikngruvn

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility (including temporal) to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility (including temporal) to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%

I don't understand. What do you mean by Including Temporal? If you are talking about a Traning facility within the temporal racial tech, you're mistaken. It's the psychic racial tech, and it's system-wide.

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Seriously. There are more than enough REAL problems to solve without making more.
A minute wasted looking for problems you already know about is a minute less of playing SE4 for me. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

I guess I should just ignore this thread for a while, instead.

[ November 16, 2002, 19:04: Message edited by: Suicide Junkie ]

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Thanx Quikngruvn for the headings.

Didn't know the WP's got an attack bonus! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Your improvements & WP data will go into the new update. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">TC...quite right. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

It is the Psychic ship training facility and the Temporal fleet training facility (which doesn't exit).

Must have been crosseyed when I transposed the data. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif

Another error to correct. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

My understanding was that the training facilities only improve experience if the ships are in the same sector as the facility.

Thanks for telling me it is system wide.

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Normal ones DO require the ships to be in the same sector.
The Psychic Version of the facility broadcasts the training effect across the entire system.

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Seriously. There are more than enough REAL problems to solve without making more.
A minute wasted looking for problems you already know about is a minute less of playing SE4 for me. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

I guess I should just ignore this thread for a while, instead.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">SJ. I am sorry you feel that way. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

I can understand the frustration of knowing that there is something not right with the data and the insecurity of having to rely on incorrect information.

For myself, I like games. And I was hoping there are others out there who feel the way I do and will take up the challenge I threw out.

Often, I will spend hours trying to solve a puzzle which has no practical purpose whatsoever.

But the challenge I threw out does have a real purpose in addition to the fun aspect. I am not perfect. I assumed I made other mistakes. As it has turned out, a number of my mistakes have already surfaced. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Unfortunately we can be lazy creatures. There is a lot of data presented here and sometimes it is just easier to accept the data as it is presented rather than question its validity.

The challenge is meant to engage those who like a puzzle. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

The challenge also points out the fact that if I made one mistake, there very well could be others which may remain uncorrected unless the data is examined in a critical manner.

However, I do not want to be the cause unnecessary frustration and irritation. If I get a deluge of demands to correct it immediately, I would have no problem doing so.

As it stands, the error has not yet been discovered. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ November 16, 2002, 20:33: Message edited by: tbontob ]

Re: Damage Calculation
 

NEW! NEW! IMPROVED! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Here’s the new up to date Attack/Defense bonus listing

And my error is still there... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
=============================================

Factors which affect the probability of a hit:

ATTACK BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (aggressiveness)
..race creation points assigned –25% to 25%
Cultural trait (amends aggressiveness)
..Berzerkers 10%
..Warriors 5%
..Politicians 2%
..Zealots 5%
..Engineers –5%
..Merchants -2%
..Renegades 2%
Combat Sensors
..lvl 1 25%
..lvl 2 45%
..lvl 3 65%
Weapon attack bonus
..PDC's 70%
..Ripper Beam 10%
..Wave-Motion Gun 30%
..High Energy Magifier 30% (crystalline)
..Tachyon Cannon 10% (temporal)
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility (in sector) to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
….can be trained by Psychic Ship Training Facility (in system) to a max of
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility (in sector) to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
….can be trained by Psychic Fleet Training Facility (in system) to a max of
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Chassis bonus
..fighters 50%
Facilities
..War Shrine (religious)
….lvl 1 5% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 2 10% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 3 15% to in-system ships and units
..Events Predictor (temporal)
….lvl 1 10% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 2 20% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 3 30% to in-system ships and units
Weapon Mount
..Large WP/Base Mount 40%
..Heavy WP/Base Mount 60%
..Massive WP/Base Mount 80%

DEFENCE BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (defensiveness)
..race creation points assigned –25% to 25%
Cultural trait (amends defensiveness)
..Berzerkers 10%
..Warriors 5%
..Politicians 2%
..Zealots 5%
..Engineers –5%
..Merchants -2%
..Renegades 2%
ECM
..lvl 1 20%
..lvl 2 40%
..lvl 3 60%
Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility (in sector) to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
....can be trained by Psychic Ship Training Facility (in system) to max of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%

Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility (in sector) to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
....can be trained by Psychic Fleet Training Facility (in system) to max of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Scattering Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Stealth Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Chassis bonus
..drones 50%
..fighters, small 80%
..fighters, medium 70%
..fighters, large 60%
..escort 40%
..frigate 30%
..destroyer 20%
..light cruiser 10%
..baseship –40%
..space station –20%
..battle station –40%
..starbase –60%
Facilities
..War Shrine (religious)
….lvl 1 5% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 2 10% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 3 15% to in-system ships and units
..Events Predictor (temporal)
….lvl 1 10% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 2 20% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 3 30% to in-system ships and units

SPECIAL CASE
Religious talisman sets the probability of a hit at 100% (cannot be modified by the attack/defense bonuses or changed by the 1% reduction rule to 99%)
================================================
DAMAGE BONUS
..Death Shrine 1 (Religious) 5% damage bonus to all weapons used in system

..Death Shrine 2 (Religious) 10% damage bonus to all weapons used in system
..Death Shrine 3 (Religious) 15% damage bonus to all weapons used in system

Re: Damage Calculation
 

What about mines?

Would they be in the special Category with the Talisman as having a 100% chance to hit?

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Mines are not weapons.

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Hmm, an error is supposed to be in the list? I like puzzles...
How about:

Ripper beams don't get a 10% bonus. Incinerator beams do.
You didn't include the hit percentage dropping with distance.

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Weapon attack bonus
Mental singularity generator 20%

Re: Damage Calculation
 

I think I got the error:

The space between death shrines.

Edit: Also, I thought the British spelling (also canadian) was Armour?

and HE Magnifier is spelled magifire.

Another Edit: I thought drones also had bonus offensive?

[ November 16, 2002, 23:40: Message edited by: TerranC ]

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Looks like Armor in the game to me. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Give the man a ceegar! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

The War Shrine gives a combat bonus from 5 to 15% to in system battles and the Events Predictor (temporal) gives 10 to 30 percent combat bonus to in system battles.

However, my mistake is still there, undiscovered…. Who will find it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Here’s the new up to date Attack/Defense bonus listing

=============================================

Factors which affect the probability of a hit:

ATTACK BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (aggressiveness)
..race creation points. 75% - 125% (Negative if below 100%)
..Berzerkers 10%
..Warriors 5%
..Politicians 2%
..Zealots 5%
..Engineers –5%
..Merchants -2%
..Renegades 2%
Combat Sensors
..lvl 1 25%
..lvl 2 45%
..lvl 3 65%
Weapon attack bonus
..PDC's 70%
..Ripper Beam 10%
..Wave-Motion Gun 30%
..High Energy Magifier 30% (crystalline)
..Tachyon Cannon 10% (temporal)
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility (including temporal) to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility (including temporal) to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Chassis bonus
..fighters 50%
Facilitities
..War Shrine (religious)
….lvl 1 5% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 2 10% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 3 15% to in-system ships and units
..Events Predictor (temporal)
….lvl 1 10% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 2 20% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 3 30% to in-system ships and units

DEFENCE BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (defensiveness)
..race creation points. 75% - 125% (Negative if below 100%)
..Berzerkers 10%
..Warriors 5%
..Politicians 2%
..Zealots 5%
..Engineers –5%
..Merchants -2%
..Renegades 2%
ECM
..lvl 1 20%
..lvl 2 40%
..lvl 3 60%
Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility (including temporal) to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility (including temporal) to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Scattering Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Stealth Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Chassis bonus
..drones 50%
..fighters, small 80%
..fighters, medium 70%
..fighters, large 60%
..escort 40%
..frigate 30%
..destroyer 20%
..light cruiser 10%
..baseship –40%
..space station –20%
..battle station –40%
..starbase –60%
Facilitities
..War Shrine (religious)
….lvl 1 5% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 2 10% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 3 15% to in-system ships and units
..Events Predictor (temporal)
….lvl 1 10% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 2 20% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 3 30% to in-system ships and units

SPECIAL CASE
Religious talisman sets the probability of a hit at 100% (cannot be modified by the attack/defense bonuses or changed by the 1% reduction rule to 99%)
================================================

DAMAGE BONUS
..Death Shrine 1 (Religious) 5% damage bonus to all weapons used in system

..Death Shrine 2 (Religious) 10% damage bonus to all weapons used in system
..Death Shrine 3 (Religious) 15% damage bonus to all weapons used in system

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">You discovered it, you fix it. No sense duplicating work http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Especially when we've got a game like SE4 installed http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[ November 16, 2002, 12:36: Message edited by: Suicide Junkie ]

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">You discovered it, you fix it. No sense duplicating work http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Especially when we've got a game like SE4 installed http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">SJ...I will fix it if it continues to stump the experts. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

It could be anything...a percentage error, missed tech, etc. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Here’s the new up to date Attack/Defense bonus listing, corrected for some spelling mistakes and to make the racial characteristic bonus a bit clearer.

=============================================

Factors which affect the probability of a hit:

ATTACK BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (aggressiveness)
..race creation points assigned –25% to 25%
..Berzerkers 10%
..Warriors 5%
..Politicians 2%
..Zealots 5%
..Engineers –5%
..Merchants -2%
..Renegades 2%
Combat Sensors
..lvl 1 25%
..lvl 2 45%
..lvl 3 65%
Weapon attack bonus
..PDC's 70%
..Ripper Beam 10%
..Wave-Motion Gun 30%
..High Energy Magifier 30% (crystalline)
..Tachyon Cannon 10% (temporal)
Cultral trait: space combat
Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility (including temporal) to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility (including temporal) to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Chassis bonus
..fighters 50%
Facilities
..War Shrine (religious)
….lvl 1 5% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 2 10% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 3 15% to in-system ships and units
..Events Predictor (temporal)
….lvl 1 10% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 2 20% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 3 30% to in-system ships and units

DEFENCE BONUSES:
Racial characteristic (defensiveness)
..race creation points assigned –25% to 25%
..Berzerkers 10%
..Warriors 5%
..Politicians 2%
..Zealots 5%
..Engineers –5%
..Merchants -2%
..Renegades 2%
ECM
..lvl 1 20%
..lvl 2 40%
..lvl 3 60%
Ship Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Ship Training Facility (including temporal) to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Fleet Experience level
..0 to 50%
....obtained by actual experience
....can be trained by Fleet Training Facility (including temporal) to maximum of:
......lvl 1 10%
......lvl 2 15%
......lvl 3 20%
Scattering Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Stealth Armor
..lvl 1 5%
..lvl 2 10%
..lvl 3 15%
Chassis bonus
..drones 50%
..fighters, small 80%
..fighters, medium 70%
..fighters, large 60%
..escort 40%
..frigate 30%
..destroyer 20%
..light cruiser 10%
..baseship –40%
..space station –20%
..battle station –40%
..starbase –60%
Facilities
..War Shrine (religious)
….lvl 1 5% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 2 10% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 3 15% to in-system ships and units
..Events Predictor (temporal)
….lvl 1 10% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 2 20% to in-system ships and units
….lvl 3 30% to in-system ships and units

SPECIAL CASE
Religious talisman sets the probability of a hit at 100% (cannot be modified by the attack/defense bonuses or changed by the 1% reduction rule to 99%)
================================================
DAMAGE BONUS
..Death Shrine 1 (Religious) 5% damage bonus to all weapons used in system

..Death Shrine 2 (Religious) 10% damage bonus to all weapons used in system
..Death Shrine 3 (Religious) 15% damage bonus to all weapons used in system

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Not weapons? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Tell that to 2 destroyers and an escort that just met their demise in a game I'm playing.

Or am I missing something here. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Kamog. Quite right. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Sigh, I must have been having a bad day.

Thanks for catching it.

But sorry, it's not the "puzzle" error. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

EDIT: Does anyone know the "percentage dropping with distance"?

[ November 17, 2002, 01:21: Message edited by: tbontob ]

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Hi again Kamog http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Unfortunately, I do not know the point you are making. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Could you explain it more?

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Hi TerranC http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Sorry to disappoint you. But keep on lookin. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

To deal with your questions... correct me if I am wrong.
1) I believe Death Shrines is 2 words.
2) Yes, I believe the British and Canadian spelling is "Armour" I am Canadian, so I may use "Armor" and "Armour" interchangeably. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif
3)"HE Magnifier is spelled magifire", I don't believe is correct. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Does anyone know for sure that the drone does or does not have a bonus offensive?

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Is it time for a hint? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Hint #1 Someone has indirectly touched on the "error".

I know the hint is somewhat obtuse, but it is designed to be. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif So please do not ask for clarification. It may not be obvious now, but when you "see" the error, you will understand why I phrased it in this particular way.

If no one solves it, hint #2 will be on its way. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Good hunting

[ November 17, 2002, 02:16: Message edited by: tbontob ]

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Kamog. Quite right. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Sigh, I must have been having a bad day.

Thanks for catching it.

But sorry, it's not the "puzzle" error. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

EDIT: Does anyone know the "percentage dropping with distance"?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Oops, this is probably the 10% drop per sector. Y/N?

Re: Damage Calculation
 

No... you read my explanation all wrong.

The High Energy Magnifier is spelled Magifire on your list.

Also, there is an empty line; a space, between the death shrine entrys.

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Not weapons? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Tell that to 2 destroyers and an escort that just met their demise in a game I'm playing.

Or am I missing something here. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">They are not weapons because weapons are useable in combat. Mines only affect ships out of combat. So, they are not weapons. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">TerranC, you are correct. My apologies for the misinterpretation. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

As to the empty line, I had inadvertently entered a page break in my word processor. I guess this thread interprets the page break as a line.

Re: Damage Calculation
 

Stab in the dark... the first line should read:

Factors which affect the probability of a hit by a direct fire weapon

If that isn't it, I may have to wait for hint #2. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Quikngruvn

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Not weapons? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Tell that to 2 destroyers and an escort that just met their demise in a game I'm playing.

Or am I missing something here. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">They are not weapons because weapons are useable in combat. Mines only affect ships out of combat. So, they are not weapons. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Hmmmm

I am wondering if the difference is how we view weapons.

I view a weapon as anything that limits, damages or destroys an asset of the enemy.

Would it be correct to say that you view a weapon as something that limits, damages or destroys an asset of the enemy but also must be shown on a combat screen?

Re: Damage Calculation
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Q, Maybe this is the point Fyron is trying to make. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Would it be correct to say that all the data we have listed only affects direct fire weapons?

But sorry, it is not the "error" http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif