Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

Has anyone else here wondered about a magazine to feed missiles to your hungry launchers? Does anyone else think it a little strange that the "supply storage" trait feeds engines and weapons? has anyone figured a way around this problem. I have created a zero suply usage engine but it won't work unless I put supplies with it. I have created a component called a "magazine" that has the supply storage ability but when the magazine goes empty my ships creeps at speed one. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif This is insane. Any help/suggestions from you grand and wise masters of modding? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

The only way to create 'ammunition' right now is to mod drones to be very small like fighters and treat them as missiles. If you remove 'normal' seekers you then have to build your missiles and load them on your ships. Of course, the AI is horrible at this sor tof 'logistical' thinking and you'll only make the single player game even more unchallenging. But in a humans only game it could be quite interesting.

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">"Computer, I'd like to replicate 450 Massive Death Missile Vs and a cup of Darjeeling, please. Better gas 'er up, too."
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ December 02, 2002, 04:31: Message edited by: Krsqk ]

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">"Computer, I'd like to replicate 450 Massive Death Missile Vs and a cup of Darjeeling, please. Better gas 'er up, too."
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">It's just a computer why say please? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

Hey, computers have feelings too! Especially if there's an emotion chip installed.
Gotta be nice and polite to the ship computer, so you can count on it obeying your commands when you really need it!

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

"[edit - RRRRRRGGGGHHH! can't believe I double posted]
The delete post option no longer exists?"

Congradulations, you just discovered the reason behind Rutha's Massive Thread of Doom (TM)

Phoenix-D

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Just pray it doesn't come back to haunt you, as mine does!

[ December 02, 2002, 07:01: Message edited by: Ruatha ]

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

Not to worry. I don't think we can sustain more than one Massive Thread of Doom!
There's only so much nonsense we can come up with each day.

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

Bump.

How about some feed back? Will this work or not? Anyone already try this out?

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

Ha-Ha, silly me. Put the supply storage ability back in the engine or if your magazine goes boom than you drop to movement of one. I will be setting mine at supply storage val 1 since it don't take a lot for an engine that uses none.

Does anyone else get sick when they think that the same goop that makes your ship board food also makes the fuel AND nuke tipped warheads? Do you glow after you eat a meal? What happens when you fart? Kinda adds a new dimension to the term "explosive" gas. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

Suggestion:
Remove the supply generation for engines, and add one point to the hull.
Then you don't have to worry about big ships with lots of engines.
Same with the supply storage points.

And, no I don't have a problem with the generic supplies deal. My quartermasters are psychic, and pick up everything in just the right proportions http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I did split up the "energy" supplies and the "matter" supplies in P&N, since that should help diversify weapons research and ship designs.

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

Really. So SJ do tell more? How did you divide them and was the result the one you were looking for or something close? What where your aims, what where you attempting to do? Something like my Magazine idea?

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

Ok SJ. I think that you have pushed me one step closer to getting this problem worked out. I modded the supply trait onto the hull and off the engine. I also modded the solar supply generation trait off of the engine and onto the hull. If not my ship would run out of supplies and get reduced to a speed of one after combat. Keep in mind that this is only test runs so the supplies would Last longer than just one combat. I just wanted to point that out for others reading before someone tells me to increase the amount of supplies. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Don't anthropomorphize computers.
They hate that.

(I used to use that line in my sig.)

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

SJ, I have taking a very quick look at the P&N mod v3.1 (I think) and i can't really see where you have devided the supplies. Break it all down for me please.

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

Well, what I am doing is to make matter weapons cost supplies, and energy weapons cost radioactives.

Bombardment missiles for example, use hundreds of supplies, while lasers and energy beams use next to nothing.

Defense ships can carry all the cheap supply sucking weapons while they sit on resupply depots, and attack ships will need some pricey, efficient weapons in order to effectively run campaigns.

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

I dunno Mr. President. Do you want to make two types of supply storage -- fuel cells and give them the engine attribute, and weapon magazines with the weapon attribute. Then engine destroyers and weapon destroyers would take out each type selectiively.

A low damage, long range selective weapon would take each type out.

But still, the supplies would be exchanged. It would just be easier to deplete supplies, depending on how many of each type of supply and eash type of weapon the ships were designed with.

Someone suggested that there be a hardcoded counter for weapon firings that was only reset at resupply depots.

On anothe vein, might I suggest this link: Encyclopedia Malfadorica

[ December 02, 2002, 12:05: Message edited by: Arkcon ]

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

Here is the moding I have done so far. It makes sense in game terms but I still need to test it out. I set engine supply consumption to zero. I created the magazine component and set it to 20000 (hay supplies are free) I will be setting the missile usage weapons to use between 100 and say 400 supplies each shot. Depends on the type and size of the weapons. Lets just say about 100 shots per magazine, a?

Take away engine supply storage: No real reason just nitpicky.
Give all engines: Solar supply generation of one.
Change the weapon and magazine details: So that a person reading them doesn't frie his mind on 20000 supllies stored or 400 supplies used each shot. Instead they see, for i.e. 200 supplies stored and 40 supplies used each shot. Nice and easy on the mind and eye.

Thoughts, comments, questions? AAR time.

After thought.
First: No I have not figured out what to do for starless systems where combat leaves you with no supplies.
Second: Before anyone asks the solar supply generation of one will give the ship power but with the supply usage on the weapons so high it will take a VERY long time to recharge for just one shot.
Problems I see:
First: I only have single star systems in my Mod so that fixes the first obvious. I assume the second star can't be that close to the first or the tidal forces, bla, bla, bla...
Second: BIG ships that have a heck of a lot of engines can produce a heck of a lot of power from one star per turn baby. Just set that bad puppy to a higher supply storage and usage.

And one more thing, is this not a good idea? Am I a mad man or what? Rate me than! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

[ December 02, 2002, 12:28: Message edited by: President Elect Shang ]

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

IE Energy weapons cost alot to install and maintain, whilst matter-based weapons cost a lot to shoot...

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

Thats true Gryphin, and to tell the truth although half of me cringes at the combined supplies the other half fears the alternative! Think about it.

[ December 03, 2002, 16:31: Message edited by: President Elect Shang ]

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

SJ: If attack ships cost loads more, what benefits have you given for attacking? Attack fleet size is limited by cost/maintenance, and losing attack ships hurts a lot more than losing defense ships. If attacking has no benefits, then "turtling" could become the strategy of choice.

Or are you just trying to limit massive multi-system conquests, making smaller individual battles more important?

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

I think "Taking Territory", "Destroying Enemy Infrastructure", and "Winning the Game" fall under the benefits side of attacking http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Attackers also have the advantage of mobility, and being able to choose the time and place of their attack. While the defenders must cover all entrances.

And you can always use defense ships to attack; you just have to bring along some hefty resupply capacity, or capture the defender's facilities intact.

PS: Sorry for dragging the thread off topic.

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

Why say please?
Do not anthropomophise your computer. It is rude and it only hurts their feellings.

On a serious note:
I susspect the supply issue is an abstraction for ease of play / coding. There are a lot of such compromises throughout most simulation games computer or board or miniatures. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

[ December 03, 2002, 12:48: Message edited by: Gryphin ]

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

SJ, do you remeber the thread about XO racks? How is this for an idea, I don't know as of yet if it will work. As soon as I get the time I will test it.

XO rack is a component that will fire drones. Now the tricky part. Can a ship that is carring drones in cargo transfer them to the XO racks after combat to simulate reload? If it works than the fire rate question of XO's is solved once and for all and the ammo question will be licked also.

Sweet! If it works that is. Have you heard of anyone else trying it?

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

Only if the ordinance storage is on a different ship.
You can make a cargo ship carry all your spare ordinance, while the warship launches all its ammo each combat and goes to the cargo ship for more afterwards.

Re: Engines/Supplies/Magazines
 

All cargo space on a ship is the same. A piece of cargo is not held in any one specific component.